Legislative update

FrankenCub · Jun 5, 2019

This bill requires that only gunsmiths manufacture or assemble guns and further-
more that all guns must obtain a serial number.

Get your 80% lowers while you can

BDinPutnam · Jun 5, 2019

I don't get the second one, am I missing something? Other than (certain) small game and "domestic game birds" (which I take it is going to cover preserve-raised)- doesn't pretty much everything in the state already have a bag limit?

FrankenCub · Jun 5, 2019

BDinPutnam said:
I don't get the second one, am I missing something? Other than (certain) small game and "domestic game birds" (which I take it is going to cover preserve-raised)- doesn't pretty much everything in the state already have a bag limit?

Many coyote hunts will go for weeks with totals counted at the end. Falls under small game. Basically city peps wanting to protect everything they don't know anything about.

BDinPutnam · Jun 5, 2019

FrankenCub said:
Many coyote hunts will go for weeks with totals counted at the end. Falls under small game. Basically city peps wanting to protect everything they don't know anything about.

Interesting, didn't know that would fall under small game, thanks. My potential 'yote shooting has been limited to get off my lawn type encounters.

Acer-m14 · Jun 6, 2019

i guess FISH lives Matter ..

what is a firearm in NY .. the Deff ..

disposal of ghost guns .. ?? WTF .. there goes boating mishaps LOL ..

time for a catch and release contest .. yotes , bears, bobcats .. and the elusive NY Cougar ..

subsonic · Jun 6, 2019

So sharing a CAD file would be a class D violent felony. Great priorities.

subsonic · Jun 6, 2019

Holy crap this is bad:

8. ANY PERSON, OTHER THAN A GUNSMITH DULY LICENSED PURSUANT TO SECTION
400.00 OF THIS CHAPTER, WHO ASSEMBLES, MANUFACTURES, OR CAUSES TO BE
ASSEMBLED OR MANUFACTURED, A FIREARM, RIFLE OR SHOTGUN IS GUILTY OF A
CLASS C FELONY.

Note, this isn't "ghost gun." This is any gun. Not just manufacturing, but assembling. Building your own rifle from stripped receiver and parts? That might be covered.

MothMan · Jun 6, 2019

A-722B

When I read this one Auburn, NY popped into mind. Don’t know now but back ten years or so Auburn had a crow problem. Like blacken the sky and cover parts of the city with droppings problem. So some clever person began sponsoring a crow hunt with the winner being the person who took the most crows. Contest became popular and began drawing the ire of animal rights groups and went away , I think the crows did also. Now it seems there will be no more crow hunting contests in NY.

BDinPutnam · Jun 6, 2019

subsonic said:
Holy crap this is bad:

Note, this isn't "ghost gun." This is any gun. Not just manufacturing, but assembling. Building your own rifle from stripped receiver and parts? That might be covered.

Read line 28. This covers 80% lowers. A stripped lower (should) would not be an "unfinished" part.

subsonic · Jun 6, 2019

BDinPutnam said:
Read line 28. This covers 80% lowers. A stripped lower (should) would not be an "unfinished" part.

Section 28 is added to the definitions in 265.00. It's not referenced in this new crime of "assembling or manufacturing a firearm" in added created in 265.10 (8). There's no reference to "unfinished firearm frame or receiver" in 265.10 (8). That's only referenced in the new definition of "ghost gun," possession or sale of which is separately punished under other new sections.

This new offense in 265.10 (8) doesn't prohibit the assembly or manufacture of ghost guns. And since that definition is specifically added to the bill, and not referenced, it wouldn't be interpreted that way. It is "assembling or manufacturing a firearm, rifle or shotgun" that would be made to be a class C felony. And the fact that they used both "assembling" and "manufacturing" that implies there is a distinction. This truly does make building any kind of gun without a license criminal territory, as I read this terrible bill.

Let's hope this dies in committee.

ManrisFrack · Jun 6, 2019

Yep, subsonic is right. Theoretically, you could take your gun apart to clean it, but putting it back together would be a felony.

ETA: It would also make possession of 80% guns that you completed prior to passage a felony unless you register AND serialize it. It's retroactive.
In addition, it makes the sale of 80% hunks of metal a felony.

Grimscale · Jun 6, 2019

I thought a "retroactive" law was null and void. you can't "retroactively" make someone a criminal.
And I know there used to be a local squirrel hunt contest for kids around here. Guess that's off the table.

ManrisFrack · Jun 6, 2019

Grimscale said:
I thought a "retroactive" law was null and void. you can't "retroactively" make someone a criminal.

Ha! They've discovered that they can do anything they want, the corrupt courts will back it at every step before SCOTUS and they can use tax money to do it!

Besides, you have until the November 1st immediately following passage to get that serial number and register it. They're being way nicer to us deplorables than we deserve by giving us that much time. /s

BDinPutnam · Jun 6, 2019

It's not "retroactive" any more than the bullshit act was "retroactive."

subsonic · Jun 6, 2019

Grimscale said:
I thought a "retroactive" law was null and void. you can't "retroactively" make someone a criminal.

It's not retroactive in the ex post facto sense; it doesn't make you a criminal for having manufactured or possessed it before. It "just" makes possession of your previously lawful gun criminal going forward (no grandfathering). The "legal" options being to serialize and register, take it out of state or turn it in.

So there are still at least a couple of constitutional questions, whether this infringes 2A (obviously), and whether or not banning without compensation (buyback) is an unconstitutional taking (the counterargument is it's just "police power" for "public safety").

Here's truly hoping this shit doesn't become law. Fuck this state.

Saltwater60 · Jun 6, 2019

Acer-m14 said:
i guess FISH lives Matter ..

what is a firearm in NY .. the Deff ..

disposal of ghost guns .. ?? WTF .. there goes boating mishaps LOL ..

time for a catch and release contest .. yotes , bears, bobcats .. and the elusive NY Cougar ..

Fish aren’t considered small game are they? Also most fishing derby’s are catch and release. This will not be allowed to stand since the Great Lakes region benefits hugely in fishing contests of fish are included in this.

Acer-m14 · Jun 7, 2019

Saltwater60 said:
Fish aren’t considered small game are they?

i would say so .., should fall under taking game ( animal )

spat · Jun 7, 2019

ManrisFrack said:
Yep, subsonic is right. Theoretically, you could take your gun apart to clean it, but putting it back together would be a felony.

ETA: It would also make possession of 80% guns that you completed prior to passage a felony unless you register AND serialize it. It's retroactive.
In addition, it makes the sale of 80% hunks of metal a felony.

if 80% hunks of metal become illegal how about 79% ones ?

0% ?

Are they going to outlaw possession of any chunk of aluminum (or even plastic) large enough to mill a receiver out of ?

Grimscale · Jun 7, 2019

What about guns that were manufactured decades ago and do not have serial numbers?

spat · Jun 7, 2019

Grimscale said:
What about guns that were manufactured decades ago and do not have serial numbers?

What about cap and ball revolvers that may not have a serial number from the factory, but require a pistol permit if you have powder and shot for them ?

BDinPutnam · Jun 7, 2019

Grimscale said:
What about guns that were manufactured decades ago and do not have serial numbers?

I'm not saying I have some of these but, I have some of these.

ManrisFrack · Jun 7, 2019

Unless it's changed in the last ten years, fishing and small game are separate licenses (Sportsman is a package that cover fishing small and large game). So there's already a codified distinction between the two.

spat said:
if 80% hunks of metal become illegal how about 79% ones ?

0% ?

Are they going to outlaw possession of any chunk of aluminum (or even plastic) large enough to mill a receiver out of ?

They don't call them 80%s. The wording would cover 1% receivers. Here's the actual definitions (capitalization from original):

"28. "UNFINISHED FIREARM FRAME OR RECEIVER" MEANS A PIECE OF ANY MATE-
RIAL THAT DOES NOT CONSTITUTE THE FRAME OR RECEIVER OF A FIREARM, RIFLE
OR SHOTGUN BUT THAT HAS BEEN SHAPED OR FORMED IN ANY WAY FOR THE PURPOSE
OF BECOMING THE FRAME OR RECEIVER OF A FIREARM, RIFLE OR SHOTGUN. THE
TERM SHALL NOT INCLUDE A PIECE OF MATERIAL THAT HAS HAD ITS SIZE OR
EXTERNAL SHAPE ALTERED TO FACILITATE TRANSPORTATION OR STORAGE OR HAS
HAD ITS CHEMICAL COMPOSITION ALTERED.
29. "GHOST GUN" MEANS A FIREARM, RIFLE OR SHOTGUN THAT IS:
(A) MANUFACTURED USING ADDITIVE MANUFACTURING; OR
(B) ASSEMBLED FROM A FRAME OR RECEIVER THAT WAS MARKETED AND/OR SOLD
(EITHER SEPARATELY OR AS PART OF A KIT) AS AN UNFINISHED FIREARM FRAME
OR RECEIVER THAT THE RECIPIENT COULD USE TO ASSEMBLE A FIREARM, RIFLE OR
SHOTGUN."

spat · Jun 7, 2019

ManrisFrack said:
Unless it's changed in the last ten years, fishing and small game are separate licenses (Sportsman is a package that cover fishing small and large game). So there's already a codified distinction between the two.

They don't call them 80%s. The wording would cover 1% receivers. Here's the actual definitions (capitalization from original):

"28. "UNFINISHED FIREARM FRAME OR RECEIVER" MEANS A PIECE OF ANY MATE-
RIAL THAT DOES NOT CONSTITUTE THE FRAME OR RECEIVER OF A FIREARM, RIFLE
OR SHOTGUN BUT THAT HAS BEEN SHAPED OR FORMED IN ANY WAY FOR THE PURPOSE
OF BECOMING THE FRAME OR RECEIVER OF A FIREARM, RIFLE OR SHOTGUN. THE
TERM SHALL NOT INCLUDE A PIECE OF MATERIAL THAT HAS HAD ITS SIZE OR
EXTERNAL SHAPE ALTERED TO FACILITATE TRANSPORTATION OR STORAGE OR HAS
HAD ITS CHEMICAL COMPOSITION ALTERED.
29. "GHOST GUN" MEANS A FIREARM, RIFLE OR SHOTGUN THAT IS:
(A) MANUFACTURED USING ADDITIVE MANUFACTURING; OR
(B) ASSEMBLED FROM A FRAME OR RECEIVER THAT WAS MARKETED AND/OR SOLD
(EITHER SEPARATELY OR AS PART OF A KIT) AS AN UNFINISHED FIREARM FRAME
OR RECEIVER THAT THE RECIPIENT COULD USE TO ASSEMBLE A FIREARM, RIFLE OR
SHOTGUN."

So their definition is any piece of any material that you *intend* to make into a gun ?

They have outdone themselves with ambiguous bullshit on that one.

@thewheels · Jun 7, 2019

Single digit compliance rates coming right up!

ManrisFrack · Jun 7, 2019

Well you do have to shape it in some way. But how do they prove the end product is a receiver? I don't know.

BDinPutnam · Jun 7, 2019

spat said:
What about cap and ball revolvers that may not have a serial number from the factory, but require a pistol permit if you have powder and shot for them ?

I take it they dont have to go on a permit, you just have to actually have a permit?

ProgSpear · Jun 7, 2019

spat said:
So their definition is any piece of any material that you *intend* to make into a gun ?

They have outdone themselves with ambiguous bullshit on that one.

0% Billet AR-15 Lower Receiver

FrankenCub · Jun 21, 2019

I need a

to slow my reading down

ManrisFrack · Jun 22, 2019

FrankenCub said:
Anyone notice, this passed Senate and Assembly. Wont be long before FUAC signs it.

What passed exactly? A-7847/S-6230 is still listed as In Committee.

Legislative update

6.5 Creedmoor

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