If you had a choice, what LONG RANGE caliber would you choose

I have always wanted a long range rifle in .338 lapua mag.

Jmac00 said:

can you afford the ammo???

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When I buy that rifle I will have money set a side for reloading supplies. You did say you wanted a flat shooting round.

The .338 Laupa is a popular and noteworthy caliber, but there are others that will do close to if not more than the Lapua Round:
I shoot a .300 Remington Ultra Mag that's brutally accurate a long damn way out, the .338 RUM is listed as having a slightly higher velocity, and if you like wearing a mouth guard when you shoot, go .375 RUM

FP1201 said:

The .338 Laupa is a popular and noteworthy caliber, but there are others that will do close to if not more than the Lapua Round:
I shoot a .300 Remington Ultra Mag that's brutally accurate a long damn way out, the .338 RUM is listed as having a slightly higher velocity, and if you like wearing a mouth guard when you shoot, go .375 RUM

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I’d pop loose a retina shooting that

i think for your answer we would need for your answer is what is long range OP .. 300 yrd 500 , 1000 , 2000 ..

One can shoot long range with a nice 223 o a 6mm BR, both very efficient cartriges in their own way.
What are you going to use it for?
Scoring on paper.
Shoothing steel
Tactical targets
Open class
Goat or even Elk hunting
????

.223 Wylde.
Robin

You didn't say what you want the rifle for? Bench rest shooting, hunting, etc?

For hunting, having gone through this research a couple of years ago, .300 Win Mag is the clear hands down winner. The 6.5 is a very accurate flat shooting round, but lacks the power of the .300 Win Mag, especially over more than a couple of hundred yards. The .300 Win Mag is quite accurate and is affordable and with ammo choice can go down to regular whitetail or up to elk. And it red mists coyotes, if that's your thing.

.338 Lapua and .338 Win Mag are also superior choices, but are too much power and recoil for most applications. That means you end up with a rifle that's too heavy to carry easily in the field to help absorb that recoil. And you get the crap kicked out of your shoulder at the range if you don't have a heavy rifle and a sandbag.

7mm Remington Magnum is also a good overall choice, but I think the .300 Win Mag edges it out.

And .50 BMG solves everything just keep that in mind.


Edit: Pirated this chart, which is helpful as you see the 6.5 energy and how it loses it's ability to take bigger game at 200+ yards.




I sold my .308 deer rifle and now with the .300 Win Mag have one rifle for long range target and hunting.

dsdmmat said:

The 6.5 Creedmoor will shoot flat out past where your stated range is and give you lower recoil than the 308 win. For hunting elk out to those distances the 6.5 Creedmoor, 308 win, 7mm Remington Magnum or 300 Win Magnum should do the trick. Of course the 30-06 would do the trick as well. It really depends on if you want a rifle you will only shoot once a year or can afford to only shoot once a year.

My brother just build an ultra light 300 Remington Ultra Magnum for his elk hunt. He could have gotten away with another caliber but he is a glutton for punishment.

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You are correct! What really matters is shot placement and a good part of that is bullet weight and velocity (Newton's first, second, and third Laws)
Plenty of Elephants and other big game have been harvested by the lowly 6.5x54MS wiki but to hunt the big five now, a .375 is the minimum.
The simple, basic problem with smaller and lighter calibers is wind drift and energy loss which is why the Military adopted heavier bullets and faster twists to gain distance and accuracy at those distances.

Something worth noting with the Ultra-Mags is they can be loaded down, in fact Remington sells the .300RUM in Power Level I, II, and III (30'06, .300WM, and full house)

Given the available technology (bullet choices, optics, GPS/Weather, etc) it really doesn't matter the caliber only where that bullet goes, which is dependent on the person behind the Rifle putting in practice time at all distances from multiple positions and not just a few shots off sandbags at 100yds.

C3D said:

You didn't say what you want the rifle for? Bench rest shooting, hunting, etc?

For hunting, having gone through this research a couple of years ago, .300 Win Mag is the clear hands down winner. The 6.5 is a very accurate flat shooting round, but lacks the power of the .300 Win Mag, especially over more than a couple of hundred yards. The .300 Win Mag is quite accurate and is affordable and with ammo choice can go down to regular whitetail or up to elk. And it red mists coyotes, if that's your thing.

.338 Lapua and .338 Win Mag are also superior choices, but are too much power and recoil for most applications. That means you end up with a rifle that's too heavy to carry easily in the field to help absorb that recoil. And you get the crap kicked out of your shoulder at the range if you don't have a heavy rifle and a sandbag.

7mm Remington Magnum is also a good overall choice, but I think the .300 Win Mag edges it out.

And .50 BMG solves everything just keep that in mind.


Edit: Pirated this chart, which is helpful as you see the 6.5 energy and how it loses it's ability to take bigger game at 200+ yards.

I sold my .308 deer rifle and now with the .300 Win Mag have one rifle for long range target and hunting.

Click to expand...

7mm Remington Magnum is also a good overall choice, but I think the .300 Win Mag edges it out

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The 7mm is really a hell of a cartridge too! I always found it odd that off the shelf, a box of 7mm Mag was about half the cost of .300 Win. Mag. and they are virtually identical except the .284 v. .308 bullet diameters and close weights.
Think about a .270 costing half as much as a box of 30'06.

Up hill or down hill? Lol

for me it's the old bland 308 does a fair job ammo is easy to find and fairly reasonable to buy. I own a Reminton vtr in 308 that's glass bedded that will shoot with most 6.5 creedmores out to 500 yards that's about the farthest distance I've been able to shoot it. with Sierra matchking bulletts it shoots about and moa at 500 yards so I'm fine with that. the recoil is reasonable it handles heavier bullets' than most 6.5s and like I said ammo is readily available if you don't reload

Robin said:

.223 Wylde.
Robin

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No Valkyrie?

Alas, tis gone.
Robin

I have shot both .308 and 6.5 CM out to 1000 yards and killed multiple deer with both calibers (250 -300 yards shots on deer)

At the range on targets the two calibers I find equal out to 700 yards. Past 700 yards it is easier to get hits on steel with 6.5, and the farther out you go the bigger the difference is between the two calibers. You can get hits with the .308, but at 1000 yards you will need an additional 10” of dialed in elevation (as there is over 8 feet more drop at 1000 yards with the .308).

I have never hunted elk, but on deer I have gone back to .308. The fast small diameter bullet of 6.5 ( and also .243) will kill deer, but my last three have left no blood trail until just before they collapsed and I was already in sight of the downed animal. The farthest went 70 yards.

I would go with the .308 as it is a better hunting cartridge and just accept the greater challenge at 700 plus yards to ring steel with it. You will still have fun at the range

As you spend time at range ( with either caliber) you can form your own opinion at what distance you can confidently and consistently get first round hits from a cold bore under field conditions. For me it is 500 yards under very favorable wind conditions.
Throw in some buck fever, and it’s less. Three years ago I had a nice buck come out at 300 yards, and I was so excited I couldn’t get a steady hold. I backed off on the rifle, did some slow breathing, and took him at 240 yards. (Luckily he was scent trailing a doe that passed earlier, so I expected him to get closer if he kept following the path doe took)

The main reason I will shoot a CMP match or a PRS match ( other than fun and challenging myself) is the self imposed pressure to make a good shot under time constraints, knowing it will be scored or observed by your peers. Much like buck fever. Those matches are my real prep for deer hunting.

If you want to shoot long range, why buy M1A. If you want M1A buy the caliber this rifle was designed for to avoid possible cycling problems.

22, 6 and 6.5mm max out pretty quicky in terms of max grain of the longest bullets so one should not get too optimistic about going after certain game type / weights and distance. At the other hand can be very accurate and pleasant to score o paper or ring some steel.
Energy on paper is cool but what might be needed is momentum, two different things.
Energy is often used arbitrarely and alone doesn't say much about the killing potential of a bullet wo momentum, section, bullet construction, speed on target, etc ..

Before I was asking about the potential uses because it plays a huge role when deciding on a rifle and / or equipment.

If serious long range hunting is key then one might consider 2 rifles or a compatible quick barrel swap system. Let me explain...

If one wants to hunt long range with authority one needs the best bullets for this so we are talking 7mm, 30 or 338 . 270 might but I see no point with the amazing 7mm.
One could start with the tipical suspects for those bores but even in short action one is going to be involved in a heck of a work out and expense to get good at it.

If you have all training and practice at long range and are very good at long range and want something you can setup and shoot occasionally then a popular magnum in 7mm or 30 cal will provide enough beans to get the job done with plenty of room to spare. But if you need to learn still and practice a lot, a magnum( especially a 30 call or above) will beat you like an old rug and will be tiring and more expensive to feed even if you reload.
That is why if you go to a light, efficient caliber you can practice a lot, get better at it and then use the larger one to specialize in certain tasks. A 223 rem with 77-80gr bullets can provide this. A 6mm BR will do 1200 yards with little powder only the lapua brass is more expensive but it lasts for ever so do the barrels. 22 and 6mm provide bulk bullet value packs and use small primer.

But if you are kind in the middle a SA that can shoot decent bullets yet it has the option to propel 175-200gr bullets for mid to large game that might be a good compromise.

308, 30-06 can push lighter loads with not as refined trajectories but one might get better at shooting skill wise and then for special competitions and hunting one might use prime bullets that shoot as flat and as far as the 6 and 6.5mm but with the benefit of extra energy, section and momentum on the target if is needed.

7mm-08mm is another one that with some reloading outshines all 6 and 6.5mm varians out of the same case and does better than the 308 too other than heavy stout loads for dangerous game at close range like those 180 and 200gr bonded. But a 175gr 7mm bullet is a heck of a round. ....still , IMO for Elk long range a 7mm remmag carries the extra assurance.

People get all wrapped up in fashions and internet w/o knowing all options and all the things one can do if done smartly and efficiently for ones purpose.

M1A is about the less consistent platform one could buy no matter how many thousand of dollars you put into it. Ask me how I know.
I an happy I sold it along with the frustrarions

Per your question.. 6.5 creedmore is a flatter shooter vs .308.
Imo there are better options for a long range hunting rifle than a M1A.
Fieldcraft, Savage ultralight, Kimber, Tikka...
I would choose 300WM or 7mm for long distance elk, caribou hunting. just my $0.02

States impose minimum caliber restrictions for a reason.
Unless you prove your talents at long range shooting to a guide that's willing to take a chance that your skilled enough to make an ethical kill shot at distance, their going to get you as close as possible to the quarry.
At those distances, almost any caliber with the right bullet can do the job.
Weight of the rifle is also a consideration.
Your don't want to be humping a bench rifle up a mountain, or trying to shoot long range with a pencil barreled small caliber rig either.
A medium contoured 24" barreled 30-06 or 7mm Mag would be my recommendation, along with plenty of range time.

M1A and long range accuracy and repeatability do not belong in the same sentence. Not even in the same book.
...
That is before we decide "how to" do something we talk about what is really desired "the what" and also "the why" is needed and then the "how to" is a lot easier.
People quickly get into the 'how to" wo much thought.

Lets say you have a 3 to 5k dollar budget for equipment that is a quite modest figure.
Take that number and multiply it by 2 or 3 to include professional training, trips, truck load of rounds to train and shoot in the space of 2 or 3 years and then one might be in right track to start conncecting at long range with certain level of confidence.

The rifle and the casing of choice along with a rebarreling might be consider the spendable items and the least of one worries vs good optics, equipment and professional training .

And one has to keep on top training like any perishable skill and sport.

That is the reality of it and why might be happy starting with a small 223 or 6mm and get to some local classes and tail gate sessions before heading west of the USA where the best long range opportunities can be found.

I’m gathering parts for a .224 Valkyrie upper myself but for the M1A I’d go with the .308

Sooo many ways to answer this. If shtf is a factor then id say 308 as ammo is just more commonly found.

If not then id say go 6.5cm as it shoots flatter, which is something you asked for.

I have been eyeballing the Sprinfield Armory 2020 Waypoint rifle in 6.5 (not that Im ready to buy, but down the road).

Celt said:

Sooo many ways to answer this. If shtf is a factor then id say 308 as ammo is just more commonly found.

If not then id say go 6.5cm as it shoots flatter, which is something you asked for.

I have been eyeballing the Sprinfield Armory 2020 Waypoint rifle in 6.5 (not that Im ready to buy, but down the road).

Model 2020 Waypoint Rifles - Springfield Armory

www.springfield-armory.com

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He also said he wants to hunt elk long range that is not the ideal task for a 6.5 bore.
In any case, when one introduces premium solid bullets the 6 and 6.5 take a back seat and that is when the classic
308, 30-06, 284 shoot as flat or flatter and hit much harder.

It is a matter of how much one shoots to be able to enjoy the versatility of a 30 or 7mm bore.

Also if one reloads that is a huge plus.