Hypothetical questions if HR 38 passes

[Nanook145]

Seeing that bill HR 38 regarding nationwide concealed carry reciprocity just took a step closer to becoming law earlier today, I had a few questions on how this bill would affect us here in NY. Specifically would this bill now allow us to carry our weapons into NYC? What implications would this bill have on those of us who have restrictions on our permits? Lastly, would an out of state permit (e.g. UT or PA) held by a New Yorker be recognized across the country as well?

 

[Exonautic]

Seeing that bill HR 38 regarding nationwide concealed carry reciprocity just took a step closer to becoming law earlier today, I had a few questions on how this bill would affect us here in NY. Specifically would this bill now allow us to carry our weapons into NYC? What implications would this bill have on those of us who have restrictions on our permits? Lastly, would an out of state permit (e.g. UT or PA) held by a New Yorker be recognized across the country as well?

All speculation and hopes:
Considering our restricted permits aren't even a thing in the eyes of the ny state penal code, i think that may go away due to hr38.

An out of state should be valid in new York but if hr38 passes they may stop issuing out of states since the purpose of them was to allow you to carry in other states so get them now if you can.

And yes you will be allowed to carry in NYC, but depending on the final version, we may be restricted to the types of firearms that those in NYC are allowed to own.

 

[M_F]

My guess would be that some poor folk with a NY State pistol license WITHOUT NYC endorsement might be getting arrested and have to take their case to court, that is what happened when LEOSA first came into effect, the likes of FUACK, BLOOMBERG and other anti-gun forces would not give up without a fight.

 

[Marine Cpl]

Seeing that bill HR 38 regarding nationwide concealed carry reciprocity just took a step closer to becoming law earlier today, I had a few questions on how this bill would affect us here in NY. Specifically would this bill now allow us to carry our weapons into NYC? What implications would this bill have on those of us who have restrictions on our permits? Lastly, would an out of state permit (e.g. UT or PA) held by a New Yorker be recognized across the country as well?

Yes. But only with a nonresident license from another state.

 

[Nanook145]

Yes. But only with a nonresident license from another state.

Certainly all speculation at this point, but if someone was in NYC with a NY CCW and a permit from some other state, couldn't they just show the out of state permit and that would suffice?

 

[M_F]

Would NY PL 400 need to have its language changed as well? Considering it clearly says NY State pistol permits are invalid in NYC unless it has a nyc endorsement.

 

[Nanook145]

Would NY PL 400 need to have its language changed as well? Considering it clearly says NY State pistol permits are invalid in NYC unless it has a nyc endorsement.

this is precisely what I was referring to. My question was with regards to the circumstance that NY PL 400 did not change. In that case, could you get around it by showing one of your permits from other states (assuming you have them)

 

[Exonautic]

Would NY PL 400 need to have its language changed as well? Considering it clearly says NY State pistol permits are invalid unless it has a nyc endorsement.

Yes that would be nullified but i dont think anyone has a clue whether or not assault weapon laws would be in play when dealing with out of state or out of jurisdiction permits.

 

[libertysnake]

All good questions. I'm sure the scumbag politicians of NYC will find a way to fuck the state, per usual, like they've fucked business out of the state.

 

[M_F]

I can picture FUAC issuing an executive order to ignore recently passed federal legislation or some other nonsense.

 

[libertysnake]

Yes that would be nullified but i dont think anyone has a clue whether or not assault weapon laws would be in play when dealing with out of state or out of jurisdiction permits.

Maybe we should just demand consistency across all states when it comes to "assault weapons." I mean, for fucks sake, at this point they'll start outlawing BB guns after what little we have left in NY state. How are we supposed to have an armed populace that is a counter to potential tyranny when we're armed with almost nothing for this technological age?

 

[Truebeliever]

All speculation and hopes:
Considering our restricted permits aren't even a thing in the eyes of the ny state penal code, i think that may go away due to hr38.

An out of state should be valid in new York but if hr38 passes they may stop issuing out of states since the purpose of them was to allow you to carry in other states so get them now if you can.

And yes you will be allowed to carry in NYC, but depending on the final version, we may be restricted to the types of firearms that those in NYC are allowed to own.

It might not work that way because that is where they will attack the law in the courts.

I hope to God this passes and that it survives it’s court challenges.

 

[Nanook145]

I can picture FUAC issuing an executive order to ignore recently passed federal legislation or some other nonsense.

Lol, pretty sure no state official could do something like that

 

[libertysnake]

Lol, pretty sure no state official could do something like that

They don't think they're state officials. They believe they're kings. And we all know how the American people feel about living under a king...

 

[Exonautic]

Maybe we should just demand consistency across all states when it comes to "assault weapons." I mean, for fucks sake, at this point they'll start outlawing BB guns after what little we have left in NY state. How are we supposed to have an armed populace that is a counter to potential tyranny when we're armed with almost nothing for this technological age?

There's a bill for that. Saga. Hasnt moved much. Forget the number.

 

[VietnamEraVet]

I followed the committee hearing pretty closely today. As I understand it right now (and obviously subject to change as we try to get it passed in the House and Senate, and signed by President Trump), it seems like this:

The Dem's on the Judiciary Committee were already losing their shit, and kept trying to amend it, pretty much without success. Their biggest complaint was that the Act would essentially reduce things down to the "lowest standard" state. Right now, even though I have an Unrestricted NY CCW, I cannot carry in NYC. But this Act would allow me to go get an out of state CCW permit from a state like Florida (where I could get one even without a NY permit), AND THAT permit would allow me to carry in all 50 states (including NYC) with just the Florida permit. If I were carrying in NYC, and were stopped, there would be no point or need to even show the cops my upstate NY CCW!

They were particularly upset at the prospect of people being able to do that, which is exactly one reason I really want this to become law. As it stands right now, it would essentially nullify the requirement to obtain a permit in your home state. No more 12-18 month bullshit to obtain a permit in Erie County!

Like I have said before, - if this became law as written right now, this would turn the system (in the anti gun states in particular) upside down, and worthless!

Bring it on!

 

[RBean]

Well, it passed out of commity today. It will probably pass the house and get stalled in the Senate, unless it is attached to something the Dems really want.

 

[VietnamEraVet]

There's a bill for that. Saga. Hasnt moved much. Forget the number.

HR 3576

 

[Nanook145]

I followed the committee hearing pretty closely today. As I understand it right now (and obviously subject to change as we try to get it passed in the House and Senate, and signed by President Trump), it seems like this:

The Dem's on the Judiciary Committee were already losing their shit, and kept trying to amend it, pretty much without success. Their biggest complaint was that the Act would essentially reduce things down to the "lowest standard" state. Right now, even though I have an Unrestricted NY CCW, I cannot carry in NYC. But this Act would allow me to go get an out of state CCW permit from a state like Florida (where I could get one even without a NY permit), AND THAT permit would allow me to carry in all 50 states (including NYC) with just the Florida permit. If I were carrying in NYC, and were stopped, there would be no point or need to even show the cops my upstate NY CCW!

They were particularly upset at the prospect of people being able to do that, which is exactly one reason I really want this to become law. As it stands right now, it would essentially nullify the requirement to obtain a permit in your home state. No more 12-18 month bullshit to obtain a permit in Erie County!

Like I have said before, - if this became law as written right now, this would turn the system (in the anti gun states in particular) upside down, and worthless!

Bring it on!

I thought I was the only one listening to the committee discussion earlier today. Good to see another person was paying attention too. LOL, listening to the democrats whine was so pathetic. Basically they were saying "well we don't want your common sense bill to pass because it means our unconstitutional and totalitarian laws will no longer hold much weight". And republicans were like "yes that is exactly the point."

 

[libertysnake]

I thought I was the only one listening to the committee discussion earlier today. Good to see another person was paying attention too. LOL, listening to the democrats whine was so pathetic. Basically they were saying "well we don't want your common sense bill to pass because it means our unconstitutional and totalitarian laws will no longer hold much weight". And republicans were like "yes that is exactly what we are saying."

How would this effect "assault weapons" laws though? Would it also allow you to bring your rifle between states, effectively nullifying things like the unSafe act?

 

[VietnamEraVet]

How would this effect "assault weapons" laws though? Would it also allow you to bring your rifle between states, effectively nullifying things like the unSafe act?

This Act only deals with concealed carry of handguns.

Here is a Committee statement on it:
House Judiciary Committee Approves Bills to Protect the Second Amendment and Curb Gun Violence - House Judiciary Committee


Here is a link to the video of the hearings. Also, click on the Plus symbol to see and read the text of the various amendments proposed.
Markup of H.R. 38; H.R. 4477; and H.R. 2666 - House Judiciary Committee

 

[Nanook145]

How would this effect "assault weapons" laws though? Would it also allow you to bring your rifle between states, effectively nullifying things like the unSafe act?

I honestly didn't even think about that. Most people don't really carry long guns so this isn't something that gets much attention.

 

[libertysnake]

I honestly didn't even think about that. Most people don't really carry long guns so this isn't something that gets much attention.

I really need to know now. I can only get so hard in anticipation of the libtard meltdown when people are just walking around with rifles on their backs.

 

[Nanook145]

I really need to know now. I can only get so hard in anticipation of the libtard meltdown when people are just walking around with rifles on their backs.

OMG that would be so awesome to hold an open carry rally in a place like Time Square. Bloomberg may finally have a heart attack and kick the bucket.

 

[RBean]

Don't know about "assault weapons". Don't think HR38 applies. I moved to Florida and now that I can use a scope have started shooting service rifle matches. I have friends in NY inviting me to visit upstate to shoot high power this summer when it is too hot in FL to get in a shooting jacket. But my "service rifle" is illegal in NY. Might be some loop hole in the SAFE act, haven't had the inclination to wade through it to see.

 

[Marine Cpl]

Certainly all speculation at this point, but if someone was in NYC with a NY CCW and a permit from some other state, couldn't they just show the out of state permit and that would suffice?

That's what the bill says. It says that ANY issued state license is valid in Any state. It would render the NYS permit meaningless assuming you moved in from another state with your own pistols. Getting new guns would be the problem and you'd need the NY one to do that since federally you cannot buy one in another state unless you built your own.

 

[Marine Cpl]

Don't know about "assault weapons". Don't think HR38 applies. I moved to Florida and now that I can use a scope have started shooting service rifle matches. I have friends in NY inviting me to visit upstate to shoot high power this summer when it is too hot in FL to get in a shooting jacket. But my "service rifle" is illegal in NY. Might be some loop hole in the SAFE act, haven't had the inclination to wade through it to see.

There is no loop hole in Safe to bring it in unless you made it compliant by changing the configuration of it.

If this bill passed and that gun was an AR pistol or an AK pistol, it would be covered.

Not so with long guns.

 

[Edwardteach72]

Few things not mentioned in the thread so far, and why we really would want this bill passed the way that it is written.

@VietnamEraVet touched on part of the lowest standard but to add to that, this bill would also protect US here in NY to have the ability to have any handgun we want and any magazine size (for handgun) we want. As long as you have a license from a state that doesn't restrict handguns or magazine choice/size a 51oz handgun with 11+1 rounds would have to be good to go here in New York.

 

[Nanook145]

Few things not mentioned in the thread so far, and why we really would want this bill passed the way that it is written.

@VietnamEraVet touched on part of the lowest standard but to add to that, this bill would also protect US here in NY to have the ability to have any handgun we want and any magazine size (for handgun) we want. As long as you have a license from a state that doesn't restrict handguns or magazine choice/size a 51oz handgun with 11+1 rounds would have to be good to go here in New York.

I know you posted this on another thread, but could you explain why you feel like this bill doesn't stand a chance in the Senate? Republicans have the majority still and that is all you need to get this passed.

 

[Edwardteach72]

I know you posted this on another thread, but could you explain why you feel like this bill doesn't stand a chance in the Senate? Republicans have the majority still.

If you read the sister bill that the Senate has also introduced (S. 446) which is not nearly as good as H.R. 38, does not afford nearly as many protections (ie h.r.38 not only covers carrying of a handgun, but protects magazines and even ammunition. But S .446 would mean if someone from PA was to go to New York and have a gun that held more than 10+1 they would have to make sure to have a NY compliant handgun and magazine.
H.R 38 also had a provision stating that if a state wants to try some fuckery (they may use different wording) and bypass the law and still arrest someone the state is liable for all cost and must pay the individual back, this right there is a good way to prevent places like NYC from doing the whole we will arrest them because "we don't exactly know the law completely" and then let the courts figure out if they were legal or not. S. 446 does not offer that)

So with all the good stuff we want besides just the base being able to carry in any state that H.R. 38 has, S. 446 is lacking.

Now we get to the reason I'm sure (in its current form and honestly any other aspect) it will fail the Senate.

The house has 435 representatives and needs at minimum 218 yes votes to then move on to be voted on in the Senate, currently there are 213 cosponsors (don' need to co sponsor to vote yes but it' a good indication) so we are kinda good there.

The Senate bill S. 446 has 36 cosponsors

The Senate has 100 members and for a bill to pass there it needs 51 yes votes, But here is the tricky part, the Senate can hold a filibuster forcing the need for a supermajority to pass that would mean we would need to some how get 60 yes votes for it to pass (look at how many are on board with the lesser sweet national reciprocity bill, think they can convince another 24 to vote yes on something even more pro 2a? Hell we only have what is it 51 republicans in the Senate?)