Bullet Construction: Hunting vs Match?

camper4lyfe

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I want to use my .223 to deer hunt, and I'm having a really hard time sorting out what's what, and what's ok to use and what's not.

The barrel has a 1:8 twist, which as gest I can tell, I can use up to ~80 grain bullets (and I want to go with the heaviest bullet I can for energy reasons). I'm currently looking for something in the 74-77gr range because they seem to be more readily available, but the issue I'm finding is that a large majority of the heavier rounds are match rounds, not hunting rounds. In my limited research, the difference between match and hunting rounds is related to how the bullet performs when it hits its target. Match tends to fragment while hunting rounds hold together and mushroom.

That said, can anyone help me sort out what I should be looking for, in a way a 10 year old might understand? The options and variations available are mind boggling, and the more I look, the more confused I get.

Edit: I'm looking for off the shelf ammo, not just bullets for reloading.
 
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Robin

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I have six rounds of Federal fusion you can have. I bought a box years ago to hunt deer with. I sighted in, blew up a bunch of milk jugs and never did hunt with them, Hah. I think they are adequate for deer.
Robin
 
Tisto

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You are correct in that match bullets are not designed to perform regarding terminal ballistics. Their only concern is in-flight ballistics. They can not be relied upon to expand upon impact.

Without doing a bit of searching, I would first suggest a Barnes solid like the TSX series. Sierra names their bullets clearly, so Blitzking and Matchkings are out, but Gamekings would be suitable. The Speer Gold Dot would be an excellent choice, as would the Grand Slam if it's available in that caliber. Nosler Partition may be considered by many as the gold standard in hunting bullets. They also have a Bonded Solid Base. Hornady makes a GMX (solid) available as 70 gr.

There are LOTS to choose from. My first choice if you don't want a solid would be the Nosler Partition or Binded Solid Base. Both a bit pricey to work up loads with, but will perform well.

Are you attempting to load this to fit into a magazine where OAL is an issue ? If so, that might limit your choices. Also, some bullet profiles may not feed well in an autoloader. What powders do you have available to load ?
 
FP1201

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I have killed Deer using ordinary 55gr Cor-Lok's at ~150 yards...Neck/Nogg'n shots, but they dropped right there.
Shot placement becomes more critical the smaller, slower the round.
The heavier a bullet, the faster the twist needed to stabilize it. a couple grains difference in small cartridges like the .223 make a big difference between "shoots" and "don't"....Expansion isn't necessary for "Match" bullets any more than "Ball" Rounds, but are deadly nevertheless.
Hornady has a huge selection of .224 Bullets, scroll down for details: https://www.hornady.com/bullets/rifle/#!/
 
Tisto

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Speer Gold Dots are available in 62gr and 75gr flavors. Both acceptable for thin skinned medium game.

Nosler makes a 60gr Partition. Apparently, the 64gr Bonded Solid Base is discontinued. Too bad.

Sierra has a 64gr Tipped Gameking.

Barnes TSX, TTSX and LRX
 
Tisto

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There is a trade off between velocity and weight. Heavier bullets do retain energy better, meaning they buck the wind better and penetrate further. But, they also drop more with distance. Lighter bullets fly faster and flatter, but don't penetrate as well and are affected more by a cross wind.

My suggestion is split the difference. A bullet in the 60 to 68 gr weight.
 
camper4lyfe

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FP1201 said:
I have killed Deer using ordinary 55gr Cor-Lok's at ~150 yards...Neck/Nogg'n shots, but they dropped right there.
Shot placement becomes more critical the smaller, slower the round.
The heavier a bullet, the faster the twist needed to stabilize it. a couple grains difference in small cartridges like the .223 make a big difference between "shoots" and "don't"....Expansion isn't necessary for "Match" bullets any more than "Ball" Rounds, but are deadly nevertheless.
Hornady has a huge selection of .224 Bullets, scroll down for details: https://www.hornady.com/bullets/rifle/#!/
Click to expand...
I'm not a fan of head/neck shots. The margin for error is just too small.

I'm coming at shot placement with an archery mindset. I need/want broadside/quartering away shots, and not trying to blow through a shoulder.
 
camper4lyfe

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Tisto said:
There is a trade off between velocity and weight. Heavier bullets do retain energy better, meaning they buck the wind better and penetrate further. But, they also drop more with distance. Lighter bullets fly faster and flatter, but don't penetrate as well and are affected more by a cross wind.

My suggestion is split the difference. A bullet in the 60 to 68 gr weight.
Click to expand...
I'm not looking to take super long shots. Maybe 100-150yds max. Where I'm currently setup on a pipeline, it's 45yds across, and my longest shot from that position is just shy of 100 yds. I can't imagine we'll stay there, but probably won't move too far from it either, as we're getting a lot of movement around us.
 
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camper4lyfe said:
I don't reload (yet), so I need an off the shelf solution.
Click to expand...
I think most of us thought you wanted BULLETS, not AMMUNITION.

I know that Speer has loaded ammo Gold Dots in 62 and 75 gr.
Nosler has a 70gr Accubond, as well as the 64gr Bonded Solid Base - weird, it doesn't show as available as just a component anymore, but it is an excellent bullet.
Barnes has plethora of choices.
 
camper4lyfe

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Tisto said:
I think most of us thought you wanted BULLETS, not AMMUNITION.

I know that Speer has loaded ammo Gold Dots in 62 and 75 gr.
Nosler has a 70gr Accubond, as well as the 64gr Bonded Solid Base - weird, it doesn't show as available as just a component anymore, but it is an excellent bullet.
Barnes has plethora of choices.
Click to expand...
That's my bad. I'll clarify the post. It does kind of feel like I need to develop my own load to find what I'm looking for, though.
 
Tisto

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camper4lyfe said:
That's my bad. I'll clarify the post. It does kind of feel like I need to develop my own load to find what I'm looking for, though.
Click to expand...
Either of the Gold Dots would do very well. So too would the Nosler offerings.

I think you're overthinking this a bit. You don't need that much weight for a clean kill on a deer at a hundred yards. 60 ~ 70gr is plenty.

That 64 gr Nosler solid base is an excellent bullet. I've loaded that for game and been very happy with it.
 
camper4lyfe

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Tisto said:
Either of the Gold Dots would do very well. So too would the Nosler offerings.

I think you're overthinking this a bit. You don't need that much weight for a clean kill on a deer at a hundred yards. 60 ~ 70gr is plenty.
Click to expand...
I'm definitely overthinking a bit. That's my standard MO when I'm trying something new. In this instance, I really want to be as ethical as I can when hunting, leading to even more overthinking. What I'm finding is that ideally you want about 1000ft-lb of energy at impact, so I'm also weighing that.
 
Tisto

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www.nosler.com

223 Rem. 70gr AccuBond Trophy Grade Ammunition

223 Rem. 70gr Accubond Trophy Grade Ammunition
www.nosler.com www.nosler.com

www.nosler.com

223 Rem 64g Bonded Solid Base DEFENSE Ammunition (20ct)

223 Rem 64g Bonded Solid Base DEFENSE Ammunition (20ct)
www.nosler.com www.nosler.com

www.speer.com

Buy Gold Dot Rifle Personal Protection 223 Rem Ammo | 62 Grain, 3000 FPS | Speer

Shopping for the Gold Dot Rifle Personal Protection, 223 Rem, 62 Grain, Gold Dot Soft Point, 3000 fps - Learn more about the latest Gold Dot Rifle Personal Protection and other hunting, shooting or reloading gear at Speer.
www.speer.com www.speer.com

www.speer.com

Buy Gold Dot Rifle Personal Protection 223 Rem Ammo | 75 Grain, 2775 FPS | Speer

Shopping for the Gold Dot Rifle Personal Protection, 223 Rem, 75 Grain, Gold Dot Soft Point, 2775 fps - Learn more about the latest Gold Dot Rifle Personal Protection and other hunting, shooting or reloading gear at Speer.
www.speer.com www.speer.com
 
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Mosinitis

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80gr and up .223 bullets are designed to be seated longer than magazine length. They are used for single round loading only. 77gr and below are for magazine length rounds.
 
camper4lyfe

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Mosinitis said:
80gr and up .223 bullets are designed to be seated longer than magazine length. They are used for single round loading only. 77gr and below are for magazine length rounds.
Click to expand...
Fortunately I don't want to go over 80gr. That's too much for my barrel.
 
camper4lyfe

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Tisto said:
www.nosler.com

223 Rem. 70gr AccuBond Trophy Grade Ammunition

223 Rem. 70gr Accubond Trophy Grade Ammunition
www.nosler.com www.nosler.com

www.nosler.com

223 Rem 64g Bonded Solid Base DEFENSE Ammunition (20ct)

223 Rem 64g Bonded Solid Base DEFENSE Ammunition (20ct)
www.nosler.com www.nosler.com

www.speer.com

Buy Gold Dot Rifle Personal Protection 223 Rem Ammo | 62 Grain, 3000 FPS | Speer

Shopping for the Gold Dot Rifle Personal Protection, 223 Rem, 62 Grain, Gold Dot Soft Point, 3000 fps - Learn more about the latest Gold Dot Rifle Personal Protection and other hunting, shooting or reloading gear at Speer.
www.speer.com www.speer.com

www.speer.com

Buy Gold Dot Rifle Personal Protection 223 Rem Ammo | 75 Grain, 2775 FPS | Speer

Shopping for the Gold Dot Rifle Personal Protection, 223 Rem, 75 Grain, Gold Dot Soft Point, 2775 fps - Learn more about the latest Gold Dot Rifle Personal Protection and other hunting, shooting or reloading gear at Speer.
www.speer.com www.speer.com
Click to expand...
I saw the 70gr stuff. I'm surprised, it drops to below 1000 ft-lb before 100yds. I know it's a heavier bullet, but damn.

The personal protection one brings up an interesting point. Would defense rounds be appropriate to use?
 
Tisto

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camper4lyfe said:
I saw the 70gr stuff. I'm surprised, it drops to below 1000 ft-lb before 100yds. I know it's a heavier bullet, but damn.

The personal protection one brings up an interesting point. Would defense rounds be appropriate to use?
Click to expand...
Theyre doing the exact same job. Driving deep into the vitals and creating massive tissue damage along the way.

1000 ft-lbs of energy is a lot, considering the animal. Their skin is thin, they're not particularly muscular, and they don't have an exceptionally heavy bone structure.

Aside from a varmint type bullet that nearly disintegrates on impact or a FMJ which won't expand, near any type bullet will do the job at your distances.

I doubt you'll find any commercially loaded ammunition in your given cartridge that provides a whole lot more kinetic energy than the ones I linked to. If you determine that you require more energy, then you'll have to consider a different cartridge. The .223 is limited in energy because of case capacity and bullet weights. That being said, loads with appropriate 60 grain and heavier bullets have taken whitetails for decades.


Personally, I would prefer the 64gr Bonded Solid Base to the 70gr Accubond assuming they both shot equally well in my rifle. But that's just me.
 
camper4lyfe

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Tisto said:
Theyre doing the exact same job. Driving deep into the vitals and creating massive tissue damage along the way.

1000 ft-lbs of energy is a lot, considering the animal. Their skin is thin, they're not particularly muscular, and they don't have an exceptionally heavy bone structure.

Aside from a varmint type bullet that nearly disintegrates on impact or a FMJ which won't expand, near any type bullet will do the job at your distances.

I doubt you'll find any commercially loaded ammunition in your given cartridge that provides a whole lot more kinetic energy than the ones I linked to. If you determine that you require more energy, then you'll have to consider a different cartridge. The .223 is limited in energy because of case capacity and bullet weights. That being said, loads with appropriate 60 grain and heavier bullets have taken whitetails for decades.


Personally, I would prefer the 64gr Bonded Solid Base to the 70gr Accubond assuming they both shot equally well in my rifle. But that's just me.
Click to expand...
That's fair. I'll have to do some off-season research and sort out what works. in it.
 
FP1201

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Tisto said:
Speer Gold Dots are available in 62gr and 75gr flavors. Both acceptable for thin skinned medium game.

Nosler makes a 60gr Partition. Apparently, the 64gr Bonded Solid Base is discontinued. Too bad.

Sierra has a 64gr Tipped Gameking.

Barnes TSX, TTSX and LRX
Click to expand...
Gameking is tough to beat for Hunting, but Barns Bullets easily do.
 
FP1201

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camper4lyfe said:
I had no idea. It s semi auto.
Click to expand...
Semi-auto's tend to favor fast burning powders, Bolt and Singles like their slower counterparts...might not think it makes a difference when things happen in a fraction of a second, but it does....same with Gas Tube lengths and Dwell Time.
 
Tisto

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I seriously doubt that any of the loaded ammunition, especially that branded as personal protection ammunition would fail to function in a modern autoloader. There may be an extremely small possibility that some ammunition would not be suitable , but I would have to think that it would have such a warning on the package. "This ammunition will not fit in a magazine" or something like that. Already, much of the heavier bullets have warnings on the package stating that a 1:8 or 1:7 or whatever twist is necessary to stabilize the bullet.

You have another 10 months to buy and test ammunition. Have your brother that lives in Pennsylvania order you 2 boxes of everything, then spend the spring testing them all. When you find the flavor you like, order more of that, sight in your gun to that ammo, and you'll be ready for opening day.
 
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CSX, is made of Copper. like the Barnes TSX................VERY LONG for the caliber as copper weighs less than lead.

They look like much heavier bullets, and the velocity is up so that on impact, the bullet tip opens to much larger 2x size, leaving energy in the deer.................no thru and thru shots, like a FMJ
 
FP1201

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Zerex said:
CSX, is made of Copper. like the Barnes TSX................VERY LONG for the caliber as copper weighs less than lead.

They look like much heavier bullets, and the velocity is up so that on impact, the bullet tip opens to much larger 2x size, leaving energy in the deer.................no thru and thru shots, like a FMJ
Click to expand...
Barns actually recommends using a lighter bullet than you normally shoot as they retain their weight and have fantastic expansion. and of course with lighter bullets you can expect higher velocities, and their Coated (blue) bullets will load at even higher velocities when following the loads specifically developed for their use.
 
camper4lyfe

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Zerex said:
CSX, is made of Copper. like the Barnes TSX................VERY LONG for the caliber as copper weighs less than lead.

They look like much heavier bullets, and the velocity is up so that on impact, the bullet tip opens to much larger 2x size, leaving energy in the deer.................no thru and thru shots, like a FMJ
Click to expand...

FP1201 said:
Barns actually recommends using a lighter bullet than you normally shoot as they retain their weight and have fantastic expansion. and of course with lighter bullets you can expect higher velocities, and their Coated (blue) bullets will load at even higher velocities when following the loads specifically developed for their use.
Click to expand...
And this is why I crated this thread. There's SO much info and it very quickly gets overwhelming and confusing.
 
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