4WHLDRFTN
6.5 Creedmoor
Yea umm. My opinion. You don’t like, move along. Carry on with your bad self and take your 5yr old personal attacks with you.
Good Day
Alec Baldwin Criminal Charges To Be Dropped In Fatal ‘Rust’ Shooting
- Thread starter subsonic
- Start date
Good Day
Acer-m14
.950 JDJ
Well that lady in Cali pointing a non working pistol defending her home from BLM ..
the defense had someone fix the pistol so it would work ..
Acer-m14
.950 JDJ
any one here in the ARMY or MARINES ??
was the ARMOR on base responsible if you shot some one during training on the range ??
was the ARMOR on base responsible if you shot some one during training on the range ??
4WHLDRFTN
6.5 Creedmoor
Of course not, that’s not ther job. Armorer on the set is there to make sure the set/crew is safe Bc most actors aren’t trained in gun safety.
Acer-m14
.950 JDJ
4WHLDRFTN
6.5 Creedmoor
Then there shouldn’t have been any guns on set. Her fault
Acer-m14
.950 JDJ
Arjuna
.338 Win Mag
subsonic
.44 mag
You keep doubling down and your opinion is uninformed.
Yet it's also the armorer's job to train actors in gun safety and BE on set. Hannah was ultimately hired by and reported to Alec, she wasn't on set, and Alec had been on many sets with competent armorers and firearms safety training many times.
Let me give you a direct hypothetical analogy, layering the Rust accident on an actual incident that happened with Bumble Bee.
Suppose Alan Baldrick owns and operates Trust Quality Seafood LLC as CEO, president, and majority shareholder. He's 63 years old and has been in the business for 40 years, and opens a new cannery. And he cheaps out and hires a 24-year-old woman named Anna Gomez-Read, with one year of experience and no relevant certifications as safety manager for the plant, pays her an entry level wage that no qualified person would ever accept, and demands that she also assist with facilities and maintenance. Now suppose he shows up unannounced to the plant to see how it's going. Anna isn't on site. There was a union crew walkout earlier in the day over ongoing safety violations. He's unhappy to see tuna sitting around not getting canned, and checks in with the shift manager, Daniel Hale, who tells him a load of raw tuna should be ready to go. To show the remaining skeleton crew of undocument scabs how it's done Alan personally dumps a load of tuna into the oven, shuts it, and sets it to pressure cook without checking it first. Unbeknownst to Alan, Daniel had sent another employee, Jose Hitchens, into the oven to clean it earlier, without reminding him to lock out/tag out, or checking that he'd done so. He figures that's more an Anna responsibility, not his job. Daniel assumes Jose is done cleaning already since he had plenty of time and the oven isn't locked out. Jose, being lazy and inexperienced, and more importantly, never properly trained or supervised in the importance of lockout/tagout, did not bother to lock out or tag out, and suspected no danger based on the walkout and that his presence in the oven was obvious during the routine cleaning, and that everyone always looks inside the oven and hollers before loading it anyway. So, Jose ends up being buried in tuna and steam-cooked until the meat is falling off the bone.
Your argument is that this is all Anna's fault and responsibility, and in any event since safety wasn't Alan's job as a humble tuna factory worker he shouldn't be held responsible for burying Jose in tuna and pressure-cooking him.
Which is bullshit. While others made mistakes that allowed the accident to happen, Alan actually killed Jose, should have known better, ran and stood to profit from the whole shit-show, including having total authority over everyone involved including Anna, and had fair warning of danger. While Anna, Daniel, and maybe even Jose may also bear responsibility, Alan is by clearly by far the most at fault in this scenario and should not escape criminal liability.
What happened in Rust is the same except that guns are much more commonly familiar than industrial equipment. This shouldn't be a hard call.
DoOver
.450/400 Nitro Ex
Arjuna
.338 Win Mag
Willyone
6.5 Creedmoor
Baldwin is the producer, regardless of an armorer (so called) being hired, he is responsible .... "the buck stops here".... he is responsible, bottom line. You get handed a gun, prop gun or not, it would have taken him one second or less to check to see if the gun was loaded. Murder? Not likely, but man slaughter at minimum.
Would anyone here have faith in the armorer, even a good/legit armorer, or anyone else on the set checking or saying the gun was not loaded with live rounds? I think not.
Baldwin lied during an interview, he said he didn't pull the trigger, said the gun just "went off". Gun was examined after he shot and killed the woman, and the examiner said the gun would not fire unless the trigger was pulled.
The POS paid someone off.
Would anyone here have faith in the armorer, even a good/legit armorer, or anyone else on the set checking or saying the gun was not loaded with live rounds? I think not.
Baldwin lied during an interview, he said he didn't pull the trigger, said the gun just "went off". Gun was examined after he shot and killed the woman, and the examiner said the gun would not fire unless the trigger was pulled.
The POS paid someone off.
Arjuna
.338 Win Mag
4WHLDRFTN
6.5 Creedmoor
John Stark
.44 mag
Two tiered Justus(TM):
thefederalist.com
What almost seemed certain to be a falling star that would impact the earth shortly has mysteriously veered off and is maintaining its orbit once again.
Star gazers and sun worshipers cheer and genuflect, happy that their idol continues to inspire from afar.
Actor Alec Baldwin Gets The Best Justice Money Can Buy
Prosecutors dropped criminal charges against Baldwin, while his working-class employees take the fall, proving we have two systems of justice.
thefederalist.com
What almost seemed certain to be a falling star that would impact the earth shortly has mysteriously veered off and is maintaining its orbit once again.
Star gazers and sun worshipers cheer and genuflect, happy that their idol continues to inspire from afar.
Acer-m14
.950 JDJ
i hope his movie RUST tanks at the box office
i for one will not watch it .
i for one will not watch it .
C3D
.308 Win
He's not out yet
nypost.com
Alec Baldwin could be charged again in ‘Rust’ shooting after analysis finds trigger was pulled
Experts in ballistics and forensic testing based in Arizona and New Mexico released a report examining the revolver used on set and markings it left on a spent cartridge.
nypost.com
Agree and disagree. I'm certainly not a big Alec Baldwin fan. That being said...
It's the job of the armorer to make sure the prop weapons are provided to the actors in a state suitable for the film set. That's what they do. Actors aren't weapons experts, they are actors. That"s why they hire the armorer... to be the expert that the actors aren't. I bet most actors wouldn't know a live round from a blank cartridge. When I buy a box of ammo I don't disassemble every round to make sure the right powder charge etc. is in there. I assume that the manufacturer got it right because that's all they do as it relates to the ammo they sold me - they make ammo - they are better at it than me.
The part I agree on is the gun just going off. Unless the weapon was in disrepair then they don't "just go off". I'm calling BS on this claim.
spat
.700 Nitro Express
You do understand that responsibility isn't a zero sum game.
The armorer *and* the shooter can both be responsible for the tragedy.
An armored is responsible for the technical details WRT the firearms. But anyone handling them is responsible for basic firearms safety.
The 4 rules are not complex. It is not unreasonable to expect *anyone* who handles a gun to know and apply them, no matter what their pay grade.
If I could do it when I was 6 years old, then Baldwin should certainly be expected to to it too.
spat
.700 Nitro Express
If they aren't trained in gun safety then they have no business touching a gun at all. If you need them to touch the gun, then train them. It's not hard.
I have friends little kids I've taken shooting. They were *all* trained in gun safety before they ever touched one.
If a 10 year old can do it, so can an actor.
stokes
.338 Win Mag
Even a person that has no knowledge of firearms knows you dont point a gun at somebody and pull the trigger. Now unless they can figure out who put a live round in a gun used in a film shoot, Dicky boy baldwin is the only one in the hot seat.
Baldwin is 100% culpable, it's not his first rodeo... And knows Firearm Safety rules! It's all BS that he got off Scott Free... He's the producer... He knew they were target shooting on site, etc.
He aimed the firearm at something he didn't want to destroy!
He pulled the dam trigger!
That's it! Done! End of story and conversation! I don't want to hear shit about the armorer because she didn't pull the fucking trigger while aiming the fucking gun at a live human being!
His guilt put on full display too with his public display and proclamations about his innocence, which in my opinion, only lent more to the fact he was trying to deflect blame!
He's bought his way out so far... Just depends how far his money stretches! Lol
He aimed the firearm at something he didn't want to destroy!
He pulled the dam trigger!
That's it! Done! End of story and conversation! I don't want to hear shit about the armorer because she didn't pull the fucking trigger while aiming the fucking gun at a live human being!
His guilt put on full display too with his public display and proclamations about his innocence, which in my opinion, only lent more to the fact he was trying to deflect blame!
He's bought his way out so far... Just depends how far his money stretches! Lol
Acer-m14
.950 JDJ
just a actor in training ..
subsonic
.44 mag
Who hired the armorer? Why is this so hard to understand?
Actors handling real firearms must be trained in firearm safety. This is the responsibility of the armorer and everyone with responsibility for the film production, with the executive producer (again, Alec Baldwin) at the top, over and above the armorer. There was a firearms safety walkout the very day Alec shot his victim, he had actual notice that there was a problem!
The "armorer" here was completely unqualified, in way over her head, and not even present when the incident occurred. If Alec isn't responsible, you're ignoring his multiple layers of knowing recklessness for his own personal benefit and whims, and saying anyone can wash their hands of their own actions, up to and including reckless manslaughter, just by giving any random person a job title of "responsibility nanny." Doesn't matter if they have any qualifications, perform any actual function, or are even present when you decide to just snuff out someone's life in their workplace.
Alec cheaped out on an incompetent armorer, gave her a workload that was impossible for her, and denied her the resources she needed. He saved money hiring an insider's inexperienced daughter and scored "diversity" points with a young female. Many such cases. He knew better, and this was his fault. If he had even recalled and paid attention to his own training from previous productions, this would not have happened either. Alec is a veteran of the movie business, and he was running this show. His narcissism, miserliness, corner-cutting and recklessness cost a woman her life.
If his supposed "armorer" was so responsible for what happened, then why was Alec letting the AD hand him weapons when she wasn't even on set?
Yes, I think Hannah does bear some responsibility, even as a naive and inexperienced young woman it was her duty to quit when she was given unsafe orders. But the far greater responsibility is on Alec Baldwin, who was not only the owner and architect of the shit-show, but the literal triggerman.