Bear vs .45 acp

[Deplorable Me]

https://www.ammoland.com/2019/08/ma...sued-him-up-tree-in-washington/#axzz5vTOA3E93

At that point, the defender fired three shots from his Glock model 21, chambered in .45 ACP. All of the shots hit the bear in the chest, killing it.

Moral of the story; SHOT PLACEMENT

I'm impressed, 1 warning shot plus three defensive shots. All intended shots on target. He didn't empty the mag although he probably filled his pants.

 

[Carlos Hathcock]

.45
.9mm

 

[Mr. terzmo]

I guess the Bear didn't read the manual on warning shots and not to fire a warning shot. Friggin racist Bear !

 

[Marine Cpl]

This is why I laugh when people say that you need a large, heavy recoiling, low capacity revolver with slow follow up shots for bear protection. Any service calibered pistol with the right ammunition will do the job. There are multiple instances of even the lowly 9mm killing Grizzlies.

 

[Blimey]

only a black bear though

 

[Marine Cpl]

only a black bear though

In this instance. In the most recent one before this one, an Alaskan guide killed a grizzly with 147 gr hard cast 9mm out of a single stack S&W.

 

[Celt]

I read that story as well and thought it was entertaining. Even though the bear was pretty small in size, they are tough animals.

 

[oc shooter]

the nerve of that bear astounds me!!!!

 

[Criticalt]

In this instance. In the most recent one before this one, an Alaskan guide killed a grizzly with 147 gr hard cast 9mm out of a single stack S&W.

Yes well, you can drown someone with a teaspoon of water but id prefer to toss them in the middle of the Atlantic.

 

[Marine Cpl]

Yes well, you can drown someone with a teaspoon of water but id prefer to toss them in the middle of the Atlantic.

You’d have to grab them precisely with your monstrously muscles arms just the same as you would have to shoot them precisely with your monstrously heavy caliber because a shot to an non vital would not immediately drop them no matter what the caliber.

 

[Depick]

This answers so many questions. 9mm vs .45? Glock vs 1911?

 

[Twogunwilly]

A few years ago a LEO in Hawaii killed a runaway elephant with 1 shot from his 9mm pistol; next example please.

 

[Marine Cpl]

A few years ago a LEO in Hawaii killed a runaway elephant with 1 shot from his 9mm pistol; next example please.

That’s a perfect example of why shot placement matters no matter what the caliber. Thanks for that.

 

[Criticalt]

That’s a perfect example of why shot placement matters no matter what the caliber. Thanks for that.

Do you have any expierience with Brown bears?
I realize people have killed bears with 9mm.
But, those times are usually from a distance with time to aim precisely.
Most brown bear attacks come from nowhere. Usually a spooked bear that you stumble upon and they charge from close range. Many gun vs bear incidents happen in a couple seconds, no time for aiming.
At close distance a 44 cal is going to have a better chance at penetrating and less of a chance for deflection from hitting bone.
While a 9mm CAN kill a bear....absolutely ZERO expierienced guide or person living in brown bear country would carry a 9mm over a 44mag.
Some bears have been known to run right through 6 44 mag shots and kill the person anyways.
The best plan is to carry bear spray and a caliber that is KNOWN for thousands of 1 shot bear kills.
Alot of guides now carry spray and 10mm with extended magazines.
Most of the time bear spray will work, or at least give you time to make good shots with your gun.
And yes, I lived in Brooks Alaska off grid for 2 years in one of the most densely populated areas for inland grizzlies.
I know 2 guys who killed grizzlies with 1 shot from a 44 mag and a 454 Casull.
Much of the time people dont even have time to draw a gun let alone fire it.
Alot of guys die with their guns in the holster.
In a perfect situation a 9mm is enough to kill a bear but only a fool relies on a 9mm.

 

[Marine Cpl]

Do you have any expierience with Brown bears?
I realize people have killed bears with 9mm.
But, those times are usually from a distance with time to aim precisely.
Most brown bear attacks come from nowhere. Usually a spooked bear that you stumble upon and they charge from close range. Many gun vs bear incidents happen in a couple seconds, no time for aiming.
At close distance a 44 cal is going to have a better chance at penetrating and less of a chance for deflection from hitting bone.
While a 9mm CAN kill a bear....absolutely ZERO expierienced guide or person living in brown bear country would carry a 9mm over a 44mag.
Some bears have been known to run right through 6 44 mag shots and kill the person anyways.
The best plan is to carry bear spray and a caliber that is KNOWN for thousands of 1 shot bear kills.
Alot of guides now carry spray and 10mm with extended magazines.
Most of the time bear spray will work, or at least give you time to make good shots with your gun.
And yes, I lived in Brooks Alaska off grid for 2 years in one of the most densely populated areas for inland grizzlies.
I know 2 guys who killed grizzlies with 1 shot from a 44 mag and a 454 Casull.
Much of the time people dont even have time to draw a gun let alone fire it.
Alot of guys die with their guns in the holster.
In a perfect situation a 9mm is enough to kill a bear but only a fool relies on a 9mm.

I have none. I also agree that a 44 Magnum will penetrate more than a 9mm. That’s can’t be disputed. You are correct.

However there are more than 13+ reported cases of people fending off and killing brown bear with a 9mm. In those 13+ cases, each time the 9mm reached vitals. The last reported case was was indeed from an Alaskan hiking guide who killed a brown bear who charged his clients. The 147 gr hard cast projectiles made it to the opposite part of the bears chest and middle region and were lodged in the skin of the opposite side.

 

[Criticalt]

I have none. I also agree that a 44 Magnum will penetrate more than a 9mm. That’s can’t be disputed. You are correct.

However there are more than 13+ reported cases of people fending off and killing brown bear with a 9mm. In those 13+ cases, each time the 9mm reached vitals. The last reported case was was indeed from an Alaskan hiking guide who killed a brown bear who charged his clients. The 147 gr hard cast projectiles made it to the opposite part of the bears chest and middle region and were lodged in the skin of the opposite side.

Right, and that guy was ridiculed by his peers.
Of course a 9mm can kill a bear but those guys got lucky.
All of those incidents were one bone strike away from being the death of the shooter.
In any self defense situation you want to mitigate as many "what ifs" as possible.
When in bear country you are going to need every advantage you can get.
Heavier bullet going faster is your best option for a 1 shot kill.
Ill bet every one of those 13 would have prefered to have a heavy ass 6 shot 44 mag.
Also, most guides in Alaska carry spray and a rifle as their first defense. Their handguns are just for surprise attacks.
Again, a bear charging from 50 yards is very rare. Its usually from less than 10 yards through the Alder brush or from around a corner on a trail. A bear can clear 10 yards is about 1.5 seconds.
Anyways, I agree that id rather have a 9mm than nothing but when you see an 800 pound grizzly from 20 yards, youre hoping your 300 Win Mag will be enough.

 

[Marine Cpl]

I would prefer a 10mm personally. I cannot shoot a high recoiling revolver with a high bore axis to save my life.

 

[71velle]

I would prefer a 10mm personally. I cannot shoot a high recoiling revolver with a high bore axis to save my life.

You can always stick to 380....

 

[Marine Cpl]

You can always stick to 380....

Funny enough, Buffalo Bore makes a Hard Cast .380 that penetrated 44 inches in gel. Probably a good load for a female hiker or jogger who’s outdoors in the woods or for someone who just doesn’t want to deal with weight. Better than the .44 Magnum left at home.

 

[nortatoga]

I'll bet no one ever did this with a 9mm...

 

[Marine Cpl]

I'll bet no one ever did this with a 9mm...

View attachment 50119

That story was proved to be myth. But anyway, we all know that the .45 ACP has a little trouble against glass. It does have explosive properties on hard armor though.

 

[Elwood]

Good thing that bear wasn't carrying a frying pan or that guy would be fucked.

 

[Carlos Hathcock]

That story was proved to be myth. But anyway, we all know that the .45 ACP has a little trouble against glass. It does have explosive properties on hard armor though.

View attachment 50120

Totally true.

.45 = Stay alive.
.9mm = Little peter.

 

[nortatoga]

That story was proved to be myth. But anyway, we all know that the .45 ACP has a little trouble against glass. It does have explosive properties on hard armor though.

View attachment 50120

Owen John Baggett Killed Japanese Pilot in Mid Air-Reported as Truth! - Truth or Fiction?

The Japanese held Owen Baggett prisoner for more than two years. Air Force Magazine cites three pieces of evidence to support claims that Baggett shot the Japanese zero pilot while he parachuted to the ground:

A few months later, Col. Harry Melton, commander of the 311th Fighter Group who had been shot down, passed through the POW camp and told Baggett that a Japanese colonel said the pilot Owen Baggett had fired at had been thrown clear of his plane when it crashed and burned. He was found dead of a single bullet in his head. Colonel Melton intended to make an official report of the incident but lost his life when the ship on which he was being taken to Japan was sunk.

 

[BDinPutnam]

Funny enough, Buffalo Bore makes a Hard Cast .380 that penetrated 44 inches in gel. Probably a good load for a female hiker or jogger who’s outdoors in the woods or for someone who just doesn’t want to deal with weight. Better than the .44 Magnum left at home.

I didnt know about this ammo, thanks. I have been considering picking up a handy little 380 to pocket carry around the property when letting the dog out late at night etc when I might not feel like strapping on a full blown holster and my CZ.

 

[Criticalt]

I would prefer a 10mm personally. I cannot shoot a high recoiling revolver with a high bore axis to save my life.

When I lived in Alaska I had a 45-70 rifle, a 12 gauge shotgun and no handgun.
I came close but never had to shoot a bear.
Alot of people now carry a Glock 20, a Glock 40, or a 1911 in 10mm in bear country.
A 1 shot kill is nice but having 15 rounds of 10 mm to unload with would be reassuring.
I have a Glock 20.
I can put 11 rounds on target pretty dang fast. I recently shot a friends Glock 40.....it has even faster follow up shots and is, IMO a superior handgun for precise, quick shooting.

 

[Criticalt]

I didnt know about this ammo, thanks. I have been considering picking up a handy little 380 to pocket carry around the property when letting the dog out late at night etc when I might not feel like strapping on a full blown holster and my CZ.

If im outside of the house, I have my 357 or 10mm on me.
2 weeks agosome friends were tent camping behind our house.
In the morning we found a pile of bear crap 6 feet from one of the tents and foot prints walking all over the camp site.
The damn bears come for our bee hives but when they feel the electric fence, they prowl the property. Our dogs are pretty good about bear patrol but I dont want to be surprised.

 

[BDinPutnam]

I hear ya @Criticalt. Here my intended audience is coyote. Maybe raccoon though I've never actually seen one in our hood in the six years we've been here.

 

[ECU Pirates]

This is why I laugh when people say that you need a large, heavy recoiling, low capacity revolver with slow follow up shots for bear protection. Any service calibered pistol with the right ammunition will do the job. There are multiple instances of even the lowly 9mm killing Grizzlies.

Would you rather have a 9mm or a 10mm if a bear was attacking you?

 

[ECU Pirates]

I have none. I also agree that a 44 Magnum will penetrate more than a 9mm. That’s can’t be disputed. You are correct.

However there are more than 13+ reported cases of people fending off and killing brown bear with a 9mm. In those 13+ cases, each time the 9mm reached vitals. The last reported case was was indeed from an Alaskan hiking guide who killed a brown bear who charged his clients. The 147 gr hard cast projectiles made it to the opposite part of the bears chest and middle region and were lodged in the skin of the opposite side.

It was a fishing guide who normally carries a .44 mag but the bear threat was low that day.