Double barrel sawed off vs Shockwave?

[Different Drummer]

I tried to find an active thread to put this in but did not seem to have any luck.
Looking for comments.
I was at someones house a day to two ago who has all sorts of rifles, pistols and other various firearms.
He shows me what I will call a double barrel sawed of shotgun. Not only was the barrel shortened but the
original stock was as well. Plus it was fitted with a nice fitting smaller thin butt plate/pad ( probably custom made judging by it's size} which finished it off nicely. The whole deal appeared pretty short at first glance and I commented about the legality. He said "it is perfectly legal". I said in return " it looks pretty short overall".
So out comes the tape measure. Very careful measurement of the barrel = 181/8 inch.
Another very careful measurement of over all length = 27 inches.
Sooooo, I figured I had to stand corrected.
This double barrel really struck my fancy in comparison to something like the Mossy shockwave. The reason
is that the shortened original stock just seemed to fit and feel better in my hand. Without having a Shockwave right next to it for comparison, I really can't describe what I felt. Maybe there was more of an angle or curve to it allowing a more substantial grip. I wish I took a Pic to post but at the time did not think of it.
It was a brand name gun like Remington or Winchester.
He said it had previously belonged to a truck driver who apparently carried it with him in his rig.
So, am I overlooking something or over simplifying the legal analysis on this weapon?
I just have this drift that it is not a legal modification.
If it is legal, I think I may be on the hunt for a donor double barrel shotgun.

 

[kev74]

Look at coach guns. You might find something like what you're looking for.

I've got a Mossberg 500 that came to me with an 18 inch barrel and a pistol grip. I found a nice little youth stock for it that makes it much more pleasant to shoot and easier to hit what I'm shooting at.

The pistol grips on shotguns are overrated.

 

[Different Drummer]

I hear you on the pistol grips. That is nt what I am saying this shortened original stock is.
I own a 590 A1 with 18.5 inch barrel and like it a lot with the factory stock so I am not trying to replace that.
BUT, I had been giving a casual look at the shock Wave because of its compactness for caring in the truck.
Now I see this guys side by side all shortened up and it appeals to me a bit more than the Shock Wave.

 

[kev74]

I hear you on the pistol grips. That is nt what I am saying this shortened original stock is.
I own a 590 A1 with 18.5 inch barrel and like it a lot with the factory stock so I am not trying to replace that.
BUT, I had been giving a casual look at the shock Wave because of its compactness for caring in the truck.
Now I see the this guys side by side all shortened up and it appeals to me a bit more than the Shock Wave.

Something like this?

Stoeger Coach Gun 12 Gauge Double Barrel Shotgun with Blued Barrel

Stoeger: Coach Gun 12 Gauge Double Barrel Shotgun with Blued Barrel for sale at Sportsman's Outdoor Superstore.

www.sportsmansoutdoorsuperstore.com

 

[fnfalguy]

They are handy. Actually both are but I digress. Here is a photo of one that I picked up a while ago

i had the FFL check the length as well as they seem so short due to the smaller length receiver

 

[Different Drummer]

Kev74
Barrel is 1 3/4 inch longer than what I saw. Also overall length is much beyond what I saw.
I am probably just bored. I have no new firearms needs and the shot gun I held just looked and felt unique.
Plus it was simple and I like that. Just A simple break action with two shots. It just appealed to me.

 

[Mk44]

Something like this ?
(from the internet)

It's cool and all but I would prefer a shockwave (more rounds.)

 

[spat]

If it started life as a shoulder fired shotgun, then it cannot become an other like a shockwave.

It would be classified as a short barreled shotgun and would need to be NFA registered.

The shockwaves and clones are only legal because they were built on virgin receivers.

You cannot legally take your Mossy 500, strip it to a bare receiver and add all the shockwave hardware to make a shockwave.

So, yes, you could have 2 mechanically identical guns, one legal and one illegal and the only difference is what the receivers were classified as when they left the factory.

 

[Different Drummer]

If it started life as a shoulder fired shotgun, then it cannot become an other like a shockwave.

It would be classified as a short barreled shotgun and would need to be NFA registered.

The shockwaves and clones are only legal because they were built on virgin receivers.

You cannot legally take your Mossy 500, strip it to a bare receiver and add all the shockwave hardware to make a shockwave.

So, yes, you could have 2 mechanically identical guns, one legal and one illegal and the only difference is what the receivers were classified as when they left the factory.

The gun in question has a barrel over 18 inches in length. nd an over all length of 27 inches.
So, does the quoted Info apply to this weapon?

 

[Different Drummer]

I found out the gun is a Savage made model 511. Also designated "Springfield" 511
I think the major difference between what I held and the shockwave is that the shape of the original 511 stock has more shape to it.
Where it is cut off is just rearward of where the upper and lower curve occurs. This seemed to give more of a natural hand hold than the smooth curve of the Shockwave.
I am not sure if any of that makes any sense without a photo. I will see if I can find one on-line . Then I just need to figure out how to get it over here.
All just hypothetical talk here I guess.

 

[spat]

The gun in question has a barrel over 18 inches in length. nd an over all length of 27 inches.
So, does the quoted Info apply to this weapon?

No, if it meets those requirements then it's just a normal shotgun.

 

[96coal449]

Legalities.

Shall not be infringed.

Just saying .....

 

[Different Drummer]

View attachment 154433

Something like this ?
(from the internet)

It's cool and all but I would prefer a shockwave (more rounds.)

Yes something like that. However what remains of the stock has more shape / curves that seem to fit my hand better and lend more of a secure grip and comfort. I texted the owner and got a photo. See post #10 above.
Edit: I do have large hands. Not fat or meaty but my hands are quite wide and my fingers are long.

 

[Jem45472]

Throw a bullpup kit on your mossy if you want it shorter. Here's my 500. Can't remember exactly, but I believe I'm at 27".

 

[Different Drummer]

Interesting thing comparing the double barrel to the shockwave. You get over two more inches in barrel length with the double barrel while staying at nearly the same overall length. ( only a half in longer ) Actually the double has enough area on the stock to have another half inch removed and be the exact same overall length as the Shockwave.
The bull pup is nice but does not retain the simplicity of the double barrel. Though having the capacity advantage.
I wonder if the Bull pup will accept the heavy barrel of the 590 A1?

 

[Jem45472]

Interesting thing comparing the double barrel to the shockwave. You get over two more inches in barrel length with the double barrel while staying at nearly the same overall length. ( only a half in longer ) Actually the double has enough area on the stock to have another half inch removed and be the exact same overall length as the Shockwave.
The bull pup is nice but does not retain the simplicity of the double barrel. Though having the capacity advantage.
I wonder if the Bull pup will accept the heavy barrel of the 590 A1?

I'd have to look back into it, but I believe the bullpup kit is gtg on anything as long as It doesn't have rifle sights.

 

[Jem45472]

I like it for it's small size, length of pull, and it's ar controls. Only downside is the trigger is not as good as it was, but hey, this isn't for competition.

 

[Acer-m14]

Diablo 12 Gauge Pistol | American Gun Craft

americanguncraft.com

 

[Jmac00]

I have a Stoger double defense, in 12 ga its a little brutle on the recoil

Double Defense Side-By-Side Shotguns | Stoeger Shotguns Pistols and Airguns

stoegerindustries.com

 

[Different Drummer]

Diablo 12 Gauge Pistol | American Gun Craft

americanguncraft.com

Heh, Heh, Like the "Howdah" only black powder.