FPC and SAF File Lawsuit Challenging Safe Act

JunkBoxFull · Jan 1, 2023

maverick52 said:
Not sure if this was posted but just saw this on another forum. This looks like a strong case. Basically they are asking the courts look at the case from a one step test rather than the two tier test that was used to decide the last lawsuit in 2015. This should be a solid case. It’s also in the southern district (Westchester County). If this case succeeds the dominos will fall fast.

SAF, FPC File a Lawsuit Challenging New York's 'Assault Weapons' Ban - The Truth About Guns

&#9664Previous Post Next Post▶ From the Second Amendment Foundation . . . A federal lawsuit supported by the Second Amendment Foundation and Firearms Policy Coalition has been filed in New York, challenging that state’s ban on so-called “assault weapons.” Plaintiffs are represented by SAF and...

www.thetruthaboutguns.com

Not holding my breath, but its a start! Thank you for posting it. I know alot of people have been hoping this would happen.

BMF JK · Jan 1, 2023

Keep punching !

JunkBoxFull · Jan 2, 2023

We`ll have to wait and see what the actual lawsuits says. My guess is, once AGAIN, there wont be one word about the magazine ban in the lawsuit. And it should be included WITH ALL AR-15 lawsuits. But like anything in the news, it doesn`t mean anything of what they say, until we can actually SEE & READ the text of the lawsuit.

EDIT UPDATE:
It looks like they spoke of the magazine bans in the lawsuit. So i likely stand corrected. Praying for a BIG 2A win!

Acer-m14 · Jan 2, 2023

wish i could file a suit .. says this lady ..

N.J. gun association calls Berlin woman's death an 'absolute outrage'

When Carol Bowne was fatally stabbed by an ex-boyfriend late Wednesday night just outside her Berlin home, she had been waiting since mid April. Although she had filed a restraining order against suspect Michael Eitel, 45, the man attacked her shortly after 10 p.m. upon Bowne's arrival at her...

www.nj.com

JunkBoxFull · Jan 2, 2023

maverick52 said:
The case is simple and straight forward. I am glad someone finally stepped up. I’d like to see how a district judge handles this. Once it gets to the Second Circuit they are going to be forced to grant relief.

Mav, i just read all 19 pages. Looks like a pretty strong lawsuit. Now we just have to hope that New Yorkers get their long awaited relief.

AND, it DOES include the mag bans and ALL features.

Sooner the better!

lrick · Jan 2, 2023

From the comments - some people get it. good to see.

terryfield8836 1 day ago

We need to keep piling on the pressure with lawsuit after lawsuit here in NY. Everyone needs to pitch in to help these groups fight here in Newyorkistan, Kommiefornia, Newjerksie and so on. Don't think because you don't live there that it doesnt matter to You. It does. If these lawsuits fail here, this tyranny will come to visit you in your safe space soon. We have to fight this shit together.

Saltwater60 · Jan 2, 2023

JunkBoxFull said:
Mav, i just read all 19 pages. Looks like a pretty strong lawsuit. Now we just have to hope that New Yorkers get their long awaited relief.

AND, it DOES include the mag bans and ALL features.

Sooner the better!

From your point of view. I’m sure it looks pretty weak from the other sides view. I agree if they justified it last time with the two step criteria it will be tough to justify this go around, but they will find a way.

Grimscale · Jan 2, 2023

JunkBoxFull said:
Mav, i just read all 19 pages. Looks like a pretty strong lawsuit. Now we just have to hope that New Yorkers get their long awaited relief.

AND, it DOES include the mag bans and ALL features.

Sooner the better!

Does it also include the stupid semi-auto permit requirements?

Phazer · Jan 2, 2023

maverick52 said:
SAF, FPC File a Lawsuit Challenging New York's 'Assault Weapons' Ban - The Truth About Guns

&#9664Previous Post Next Post▶ From the Second Amendment Foundation . . . A federal lawsuit supported by the Second Amendment Foundation and Firearms Policy Coalition has been filed in New York, challenging that state’s ban on so-called “assault weapons.” Plaintiffs are represented by SAF and...

www.thetruthaboutguns.com

THIS is what the Bruen ruling opened as an avenue of attack against all unconstitutional anti-gun legislation:

52. The Second Amendment is an “unqualified command.” Bruen, 142 S. Ct. at 2130. The Second Amendment does not accommodate the use of any “means-ends scrutiny” of the kind that the Second Circuit applied when it upheld the constitutionality of New York’s laws. Id.; Cuomo, 804 F.3d at 253. When a law—like New York’s Semiautomatic Firearm Ban at issue here—prevents citizens from owning firearms that are in common use for lawful purposes, then the law violates the Second Amendment. Bruen, 142 S. Ct. at 2129–30. It cannot be justified by reference to any countervailing governmental interest. Id.

MikeyCNY · Jan 2, 2023

Hopefully Bruen leads to all sorts of new freedoms in NY - SAFE Act gone, pistol permit system gone, maybe NFA items??? I don't care for full-auto (except maybe a .22 for range fun), but when suppressors are sold "over the counter" in Europe but they're restricted here? I just want hearing safe and to be kind to the range neighbors..

'Course that means I need to start a separate fund...

Saltwater60 · Jan 2, 2023

MikeyCNY said:
Hopefully Bruen leads to all sorts of new freedoms in NY - SAFE Act gone, pistol permit system gone, maybe NFA items??? I don't care for full-auto (except maybe a .22 for range fun), but when suppressors are sold "over the counter" in Europe but they're restricted here? I just want hearing safe and to be kind to the range neighbors..

'Course that means I need to start a separate fund...

Suppressors might be sold over the counter in Europe but what do you have to do to get the gun that they attach to?
Also permitting of guns was already ruled allowable by the Supreme Court so don’t expect to see that disappear anytime soon or ever. This was specifically mentioned as allowed in Bruen. I could see NFA items being allowed but you’ll still need to go through the system they have now at least for the short term.

MikeyCNY · Jan 2, 2023

Saltwater60 said:
Suppressors might be sold over the counter in Europe but what do you have to do to get the gun that they attach to?
Also permitting of guns was already ruled allowable by the Supreme Court so don’t expect to see that disappear anytime soon or ever. This was specifically mentioned as allowed in Bruen. I could see NFA items being allowed but you’ll still need to go through the system they have now at least for the short term.

Not trying to take the thread too far off-topic but -

I could almost see (but not fully support) a CCW Permit system (to carry), but to require a permit to purchase and keep in the home is CLEARLY unconstitutional. I personally know 10+ people who have expressed interest in having a pistol at home, in a quick-access safe, for possible break-ins or "just in case". BUT they refuse to play the state's games for a permit. They've asked me for advice but it's not really my area of expertise. A shotgun would likely be a first choice, but as I don't own one (yet) I can't be certain. Plus some of the people asking me are older/retired, and a 12ga may be too much for them.

Most of us here would likely recommend a rifle, but then with the current laws that presents issues with type of build and ammo capacity.

I should have jumped on the $250 Shockwaves years ago - while not perfect with some slight modifying they might have been a good short term solution.

1075tech · Jan 2, 2023

None of it matters if there's no recourse for the .gov to just ignore the courts rulings. Assuming they rule in favor of the constitution

JunkBoxFull · Jan 2, 2023

1075tech said:
None of it matters if there's no recourse for the .gov to just ignore the courts rulings. Assuming they rule in favor of the constitution

Its not up to the guv to fix itself. The "recourse" has to come from "we the people".

Vinson57 · Jan 2, 2023

I forgot the arguments on why this never happens and why it would be bad? Since NY decided to double down on bullshit CCIA in face of Bruen decision and other states doing the exactly same. How about the Supreme Court end their suffering and issue a ruling that all state gun control is null and void in one swoop and clear all the courts of al these slow walking suits that take forever? With the 2A as it reads, we take the givens in the meaning of the 10th, to say the states have no rights on gun control.

JunkBoxFull · Jan 2, 2023

Vinson57 said:
I forgot the arguments on why this never happens and why it would be bad? Since NY decided to double down on bullshit CCIA in face of Bruen decision and other states doing the exactly same. How about the Supreme Court end their suffering and issue a ruling that all state gun control is null and void in one swoop and clear all the courts of al these slow walking suits that take forever? With the 2A as it reads, we take the givens in the meaning of the 10th, to say the states have no rights on gun control.

Yep, agreed. This slow walking sh!t needs to stop. These states are using tax dollars illegally to fund their court cases that are unconstitutional.

Saltwater60 · Jan 2, 2023

MikeyCNY said:
Not trying to take the thread too far off-topic but -

I could almost see (but not fully support) a CCW Permit system (to carry), but to require a permit to purchase and keep in the home is CLEARLY unconstitutional. I personally know 10+ people who have expressed interest in having a pistol at home, in a quick-access safe, for possible break-ins or "just in case". BUT they refuse to play the state's games for a permit. They've asked me for advice but it's not really my area of expertise. A shotgun would likely be a first choice, but as I don't own one (yet) I can't be certain. Plus some of the people asking me are older/retired, and a 12ga may be too much for them.

Most of us here would likely recommend a rifle, but then with the current laws that presents issues with type of build and ammo capacity.

I should have jumped on the $250 Shockwaves years ago - while not perfect with some slight modifying they might have been a good short term solution.

Shockwaves are now considered others and are banned as far as I know.
As for not wanting to jump through the pistol permit hoops now a simple premise permit in my county will be fairly easy to get and no class is needed. You simply get finger printed, photos, references, and apply. It’s easier than it was in the past. As for a permit being unconstitutional you maybe right but I do t see it ever going away and I think you’ll need a permit for everything soon.
Shotguns are a pretty good option for home defense and I don’t generally recommend rifles for home defense. As for a 12 gauge being too much a 20 gauge is a great option and you can get some more compact youth sized guns. They make OO buck for 29 gauge shotguns but good luck finding it locally. I bought a few boxes right before Letitia James shutdown the internet ordering. I’d like a few more someday. 20 gauges are lighter, easier to handle, less recoil, and generally have slightly shorter barrel lengths.

Saltwater60 · Jan 2, 2023

Vinson57 said:
I forgot the arguments on why this never happens and why it would be bad? Since NY decided to double down on bullshit CCIA in face of Bruen decision and other states doing the exactly same. How about the Supreme Court end their suffering and issue a ruling that all state gun control is null and void in one swoop and clear all the courts of al these slow walking suits that take forever? With the 2A as it reads, we take the givens in the meaning of the 10th, to say the states have no rights on gun control.

I agree it would be nice but 75 and sunny all day with rain while I’m sleeping would be nice as well. None of that will ever happen. The courts only work on ruling on what’s before them not broad action. They want and need jobs and don’t want to give us too much ever. The right is no better than the left and they want power and control just as bad. No one cares about what is right and proper anymore.

lrick · Jan 2, 2023

1075tech said:
None of it matters if there's no recourse for the .gov to just ignore the courts rulings. Assuming they rule in favor of the constitution

It is frustrating the way they just thumbed their noses at Bruen, but by doing so they tipped their hand and further exposed just what

mistaken and potentially treasonous creatures they are. And for many just seeing that does open an avenue of recourse, but of

course it is the most extreme recourse available, yet it is highlighted in our founding documents. It just requires We The People reach

a threshold of justification to act upon. Day by day they add another straw and push more people to that end. They are playing with

fire, but do they fully understand what they are doing and is that their intent? Is this tyranny just the over-reaching imposition of the

will of the current slate of politicians driven by their 'woke' sensibilities or is it intended to evolve into something else?

For now we just stay the course and see this play out within the legal means afforded us and support those fighting these legal battles.

But as the straw piles deeper, don't ever conclude even rhetorically, that there is no recourse, to do so is to surrender.

Special note to the monitors, especially those that may want to infer anything inciteful from my comment -

My comment is fully supported within the meaning of our Declaration of Independence, Constitution, and Bill of Rights. Further, these documents provide a method of amendment to themselves. Through the provision of amendments, our Founding Fathers saw fit to acknowledge that corrections would be needed. These 'end means' laws and actions created and enabled through your supportive actions circumvent that process and are Constitutionally illegal. Full stop.

If 'you' want to disable the Second Amendment, there is a process provided to do just that. However, since we are still (even if in name only) a Democratic Republic, it requires that a democratic threshold be reached. But to stay your course, the other threshold I spoke of builds and it is one that none of us want to cross over. That is merely an observation.

You, Mr./Ms. Monitor and your colleagues are key cogs in the machine. It is hard to believe any fellow patriotic American does not see this. That you do not see this. Sometimes shit can roll uphill, but it requires bravery to make it happen. Support crumbles at the bottom. While you may have your own personal convictions and feel powerless should there be common ground, the least you can do is to temper your orders with the oaths that many of you have taken and feel where many of us are coming from. No doubt most of the 2A community supports ethical LE and honors the risks many of you take everyday on our behalf, but ask yourself, is the definition you are living today protector or oppressor? And is it what you really signed up for? We are not your enemies, do less to be ours. Be safe.

RedBreast21 · Jan 2, 2023

Nothing like starting from the beginning again after a supreme court ruling. Its time to leave NY.

RDN · Jan 2, 2023

Ten years of NY SAFE act maybe coming to an end.

JunkBoxFull · Jan 2, 2023

RedBreast21 said:
Nothing like starting from the beginning again after a supreme court ruling. Its time to leave NY.

Running away will not fix the problem. Running away allows THEM, to move into the next state and take that next state too.
People need to stop running away and start fighting back. This why we lose so much. We allow them to push us around like sheep.

What do you think will happen when that cancer spreads to the free state you ran to. You gonna keep running?
Eventually, the wolves corner the sheep, and then YOU are the dinner! Let that sink in before you choose to run!

People need to grow a set of balls, STAND UP AND FIGHT! We are AMERICANS, not P U S S I E` S
Now pick up that damn shovel and DIG IN! Nobody said this was going to be easy!

We fight them in court NOW, so that we DON`T have to go to the unwanted methods!
We stick together, we fight them in court, we beat them, because it sets the precedent for your kids & grandkids!

JunkBoxFull · Jan 2, 2023

EVERYBODY, PLEASE d o n a t e to these 2A law offices. They REALLY need our full support!
They are taking our fight right to these tyrants.... GOD BLESS them for what they are doing!
Never think its just a fight here or there for a state or two in name, it is for the WHOLE country!

We ALL NEED to be UNITED as gun owners! HELP EVERY BROTHER & SISTER behind ALL enemy lines!

JunkBoxFull · Jan 2, 2023

maverick52 said:
I am here for a fee more years no matter what. So while I am here I will fight the good fight. I will continue to donate, educate, train and vote. But when it’s time for me to retire…good riddance. It’s not running away. It’s common sense. NYS is doomed in the long term. Not just in gun rights but on everything.

I hear you Maverick, loud and clear. Its going to take every effort to turn it all around. Over 200 years of tyrants can`t be fixed that fast. I just want people to stand the hell up, and FIGHT, or we lose what little is left. What little IS left, is damn sure worth the fight. God bless you brother. I`m retired, and i know exactly what you are saying, and i personally thank YOU, for standing with us all.

Yes, its small, but people are starting to notice that WE ARE NOT GOING DOWN WITHOUT A FIGHT.

Acer-m14 · Jan 3, 2023

Saltwater60 said:
Also permitting of guns was already ruled allowable by the Supreme Court so don’t expect to see that disappear anytime soon or ever

just saying .. so was Roe Vs Wade .. and it went poof ..

lets see now laws on having a permit to go to your church .. or a permit for speaking ..

how many states now no permit is needed .. 25 .. 26 .. just have to pass that unconstitutional 4473 too

didn't need a 4473 and all the BS back in the day when you could order a gun from sears n roebucks magazine

BTW .. there were no permits in 1791 ..

FPC and SAF File Lawsuit Challenging Safe Act

.223 Rem

.357 mag

.44 mag

.357 mag

.223 Rem

.950 JDJ

.223 Rem

.357 mag

6.5 Creedmoor

terryfield8836 1 day ago​

.950 JDJ

.338 Win Mag

.223 Rem

.338 Win Mag

6.5 Creedmoor

.950 JDJ

6.5 Creedmoor

.338 Win Mag

.357 mag

.338 Win Mag

.357 mag

.950 JDJ

.950 JDJ

6.5 Creedmoor

.223 Rem

.357 mag

.357 mag

.357 mag

.223 Rem

.357 mag

.950 JDJ

terryfield8836 1 day ago