Ft Drum Delivery driver’s gun confiscated; group says his rights were violated

[livingston]

WATERTOWN — A Second Amendment advocacy group is going to bat for a truck driver who said his rights were violated when his firearm was confiscated at an entrance to Fort Drum last month.
The group, 2AWNY.COM out of Western New York, held a news conference at the Hilton Garden Inn on Thursday. Its founder, Steve Felano, began the news conference by describing what happened during an incident at Fort Drum on Nov. 15.
Mr. Felano said a Kentucky delivery driver was making his way to Fort Drum to deliver telephone poles. At the Gas Alley Gate entrance, the driver told military police of a 9 mm pistol he had in his truck, secured in a lock box. An MP confiscated the weapon, which Mr. Felano argues is a violation of the driver’s Second Amendment rights.

Mr. Barrett would later be charged with fourth-degree criminal possession of a weapon. He was traveling from Kentucky, a state that doesn’t require a pistol permit. New York state requires a permit, however, and the driver didn’t have the required documentation, which resulted in the charge, said Jack Keller, a state police spokesman.

“He had an illegal handgun in his vehicle,” Mr. Keller said.
Mr. Barrett was arraigned in Town of LeRay Court on Nov. 15 and pleaded guilty to a lesser charge of disorderly conduct. He surrendered his firearm and was fined $125.

Delivery driver’s gun confiscated; group says his rights were violated

WATERTOWN — A Second Amendment advocacy group is going to bat for a truck driver who said his rights were violated when his firearm was confiscated at an entrance to

www.nny360.com

 

[livingston]

He should be very thankful that all he was charged with...

 

[fnfalguy]

Countdown starting
3
2
1

 

[Bustedknees]

He's damn lucky, any news I read coming out of Watertown is a clusterfuck of Liberals wrecking great North County living and tradition..

 

[Marine Cpl]

That MP is an oath breaker. Goes to show that the problem isn’t just with police. It plagues the military too.

 

[Criticalt]

That MP is an oath breaker. Goes to show that the problem isn’t just with police. It plagues the military too.

In my almost 8 years in the Army and all the MPs ive known in and out, not a single one would have screwed with this guy.
They would either wave it off or just tell him to keep it locked and hidden, because NYS will screw you over.

 

[Bananabandit]

I bet that MP doesnt stand for the pledge either.

 

[FrankenCub]

His first mistake was not having the king's paperwork for said handgun and not looking to see if he even could have it. Second mistake is even saying he had one in a lock box. Unless he's been there before and have had his truck inspected. Then refer to the first mistake.

 

[Twogunwilly]

Perhaps our new moderator should give it back to him.

 

[repete]

That MP is an oath breaker. Goes to show that the problem isn’t just with police. It plagues the military too.

I've been stationed at 5 different military bases and all without exception had regulations against carrying hand guns and even the limited passion of long guns. I never interviewed any MP on the subject but from what I have seen 50% or more would confiscate a gun, I'm sure it's in their general orders.

 

[spat]

I've been stationed at 5 different military bases and all without exception had regulations against carrying hand guns and even the limited passion of long guns. I never interviewed any MP on the subject but from what I have seen 50% or more would confiscate a gun, I'm sure it's in their general orders.

It's a military base. Telling him he can't bring it onto the base is reasonable.

They can either tell him to turn around and leave, or they can offer to hold it while he is on base and return it when he leaves.

They are under no obligation to enforce NY's unconstitutional edicts.

What they did is wrong.

 

[Acer-m14]

Wounder why the plea deal ... SCOTUS

also that no bail deal is kicking in .. would have been released in a hour or 2 and road off never to be seen again anyways LOL ..

 

[GOPerfect]

More than likely, it was not an MP at the gate that detained him and began this ball rolling. MP's, for the most part are not stationed at gates as guards.

DOD police of private security.

 

[GOPerfect]

It's a military base. Telling him he can't bring it onto the base is reasonable.

They can either tell him to turn around and leave, or they can offer to hold it while he is on base and return it when he leaves.

They are under no obligation to enforce NY's unconstitutional edicts.

What they did is wrong.

Incorrect on enforcement of State Laws. MP's jurisdiction in not only on the installation, their jurisdiction extends past the Post's borders. When they are out on the economy, they follow the laws of the State and of the area that they are in.

Just saying.

 

[repete]

It's a military base. Telling him he can't bring it onto the base is reasonable.

They can either tell him to turn around and leave, or they can offer to hold it while he is on base and return it when he leaves.

They are under no obligation to enforce NY's unconstitutional edicts.

What they did is wrong.

By the time he pulled up to the guard shack he was on post. It's been 30 years since I've been to Drum but I'm willing to bet it still has signs stating something about NO GUNS ALLOWED. I also remember signs stating that you give up some of your rights on post (think 4th amdt) Kind of ironic, isn't it? I'm not saying it's right or wrong, I am saying he was a dumb ass and he was a very lucky one at that!

 

[repete]

Incorrect on enforcement of State Laws. MP's jurisdiction in not only on the installation, their jurisdiction extends past the Post's borders. When they are out on the economy, they follow the laws of the State and of the area that they are in.

Just saying.

If the civilian is on post then yes, But they have NO authority over a civilian that's OFF post!

 

[GOPerfect]

If the civilian is on post then yes, But they have NO authority over a civilian that's OFF post!

Kind of yes and no. Your response is more correct than not.

Lets see if I explain this correctly.

MP's have jurisdiction, for example, while in the limits of off post housing that is owned by the military. MP's can and do patrol those areas. If while in route to patrol the off post area, the MP sees a crime being committed or an accident on the road, he may and should interject. He is in "command" of the situation until local LE arrives.

One other thing to consider is...


Each jurisdiction an instalation can adopt the surrounding state's motor vehicle laws under the Assimilative Crimes Act (see Federal Jurisdiction).

So the co-jurisdictional authority is given by the Assimilative Crimes act as I thought. But the act states:
The Assimilative Crimes Act, 18 U.S.C. § 13, makes state law applicable to conduct occurring on lands reserved or acquired by the Federal government as provided in 18 U.S.C. § 7(3), when the act or omission is not made punishable by an enactment of Congress.


Many Military areas do not end at the gates. There are State and County roads that are actually on the Post/Base and are driven by those in the civilian population. Many Local LE will have a shared agreement with the Military Police.

As for Fort Drum, I was never an MP there so I am not sure. Each Post/Base is different.

 

[Grimscale]

I am saying he was a dumb ass

Only in NY is a victim of egregious and unConstitutional "Laws" further victimized by those who should be defending his Rights and verbally attacking the tyrants who pass crappy Laws.
Why even bother having a Constitution, a document that spells out what Rights the various .govs CANNOT infringe, if the .govs can so easily set it aside and infringe on those Rights?

Is it the intent of the Second Amendment to ensure the Citizens of the United States have the Right to defend themselves anywhere?
If the answer is "yes" then this man did no wrong. It is his Right to have his pistol wherever he wants. Schools, banks, .gov buildings, military bases, etc.

If it is ok to ban possession in certain areas then there are no Rights after all.

 

[spat]

Only in NY is a victim of egregious and unConstitutional "Laws" further victimized by those who should be defending his Rights and verbally attacking the tyrants who pass crappy Laws.
Why even bother having a Constitution, a document that spells out what Rights the various .govs CANNOT infringe, if the .govs can so easily set it aside and infringe on those Rights?

Is it the intent of the Second Amendment to ensure the Citizens of the United States have the Right to defend themselves anywhere?
If the answer is "yes" then this man did no wrong. It is his Right to have his pistol wherever he wants. Schools, banks, .gov buildings, military bases, etc.

If it is ok to ban possession in certain areas then there are no Rights after all.

I liked on general sentiment, but have to disagree on one point.

A location that he can be completely excluded from, like a military base, can set arbitrary conditions on allowing him entry.

If it is a public place that they cannot deny the general public from entering, then you are correct.

But a military base is not that.

They can reasonably set conditions for your entry like "no weapons", or "no photography", or even "no protesting". This only applies in locations where they can just say "no entry at all" though.

 

[nortatoga]

It's a military base. Telling him he can't bring it onto the base is reasonable.

They can either tell him to turn around and leave, or they can offer to hold it while he is on base and return it when he leaves.

They are under no obligation to enforce NY's unconstitutional edicts.

What they did is wrong.

Returning the firearm when he leaves the base would then be a crime committed by the guards at the gate.

 

[Robin]

As long as he is still on federal property I don't see how that is so. What law?
Robin

 

[SmallGameAddict]

I was an MP, United States Army. I was stationed at West Point.

I had to work the gates on rotation. Not one person ever pulled up and stated that they had a handgun, or otherwise. Of course, at the time it was an "open" post, basically a college campus, albeit a military installation. Anyone wanting to enter still had to at least slow down and stop at the gate. You were either waved on (current or retired military, via bumper sticker) or civilians were (usually) stopped and inquired politely about their business on post. You can imagine the mess during the Army-Navy games at old Michie Stadium.

This of course was long before 9/11.

We were required to enforce NYS Vehicle and Traffic laws, on post, for civilians, many of whom were employed on base, I.e. commissary, PX, credit union etc. We were also required to detain civilians who violated NYS law. These individuals would then be turned over to civil authorities (the police with jurisdiction would come on post to the MP headquarters building and pick them up).

Back then, I'm thinking if someone had declared a long gun, they would have been informed that they needed to keep it locked in their vehicle during their visit. A mass shooting, back then, was unthinkable.

If they (a civilian) had declared a handgun, in all likelihood they would have been asked, at the very least, to produce a valid NYS Pistol Permit for same. State law was State law. Failure to produce one would have caused a stir, with likely a phone call from the gate to headquarters for disposition and orders.

 

[nortatoga]

As long as he is still on federal property I don't see how that is so. What law?
Robin

That too is breaking then federal law.

 

[Robin]

What if that soldier, MP, at the gate was from a free state before being assigned there and someone declared having a pistol on board. Not knowing NYSSR laws he probably would have said, big fucking deal, what do you want, a medal!
Robin

 

[SmallGameAddict]

What if that soldier, MP, at the gate was from a free state before being assigned there and someone declared having a pistol on board. Not knowing NYSSR laws he probably would have said, big fucking deal, what do you want, a medal!
Robin

Lol

 

[nortatoga]

What if that soldier, MP, at the gate was from a free state before being assigned there and someone declared having a pistol on board. Not knowing NYSSR laws he probably would have said, big fucking deal, what do you want, a medal!
Robin

I would believe when this pistol was confiscated from the driver, a call would go up the chain of command, No?

 

[SmallGameAddict]

I would believe when this pistol was confiscated from the driver, a call would go up the chain of command, No?

Absolutely. There would have been an NCO and a Commisioned Officer involved very quickly.

 

[Robin]

He wouldn't have confiscated it in the first place, he would have told him to lock it up like he would with any other gun.
Robin

 

[nortatoga]

He wouldn't have confiscated it in the first place, he would have told him to lock it up like he would with any other gun.
Robin

Would not any other gun also been confiscated on a military base? With the rash of shooting's on bases I would think so.

 

[gun_slinger_boy]

I was an MP, United States Army. I was stationed at West Point.

I had to work the gates on rotation. Not one person ever pulled up and stated that they had a handgun, or otherwise. Of course, at the time it was an "open" post, basically a college campus, albeit a military installation. Anyone wanting to enter still had to at least slow down and stop at the gate. You were either waved on (current or retired military, via bumper sticker) or civilians were (usually) stopped and inquired politely about their business on post. You can imagine the mess during the Army-Navy games at old Michie Stadium.

This of course was long before 9/11.

We were required to enforce NYS Vehicle and Traffic laws, on post, for civilians, many of whom were employed on base, I.e. commissary, PX, credit union etc. We were also required to detain civilians who violated NYS law. These individuals would then be turned over to civil authorities (the police with jurisdiction would come on post to the MP headquarters building and pick them up).

Back then, I'm thinking if someone had declared a long gun, they would have been informed that they needed to keep it locked in their vehicle during their visit. A mass shooting, back then, was unthinkable.

If they (a civilian) had declared a handgun, in all likelihood they would have been asked, at the very least, to produce a valid NYS Pistol Permit for same. State law was State law. Failure to produce one would have caused a stir, with likely a phone call from the gate to headquarters for disposition and orders.

I remember as a kid taking field trips there and going right on in on the bus. Later as a teen I remember going right on in for things like job fairs. Now there are gates that are for DoD personnel with CAC only. The one "public" gate is now actually 2 checkpoint gates. If you don't have a CAC you have to have a valid reason for entering or they will turn you away. And now there are absolutely no guns allowed.