Ghost Gunner 1911 and Glock

[freddy]

I think the ideal would be to build something well done and obviously legal that one can add to the permit.
If anyone has time why not a 0% jig saw lower? IMO is a waste when the gun shop has good ones and might be even cheaper to buy one made than getting into complex projects.

Yes, but the point is that the Ghost Gunner makes ghost guns. Perfectly legal ghost gun long arms with no registration, no serial number, no record keeping - yet totally legal even in NYS. These are milled on a CNC and certainly are 'good ones'. I would hesitate to call it a 'complex project' only because it is automated (ergo you get to go and enjoy 4tube while the machine mills receivers for you). Here in NYS, only registration of 'handguns' would be required. In free states no registration required even of handguns.

 

[meketrefe]

If one makes one even for the purpose of a collection / old design reproduction then a serial number is needed if that firearm is functional.
If one is going to use a hand gun then the serial and proper registration / amendment to the permit is also required.
I think black powder muzzle loaders are excluded right?
Not sure all the legit reasons for making one of the books.

 

[freddy]

If one makes one even for the purpose of a collection / old design reproduction then a serial number is needed if that firearm is functional.
If one is going to use a hand gun then the serial and proper registration / amendment to the permit is also required.
I think black powder muzzle loaders are excluded right?
Not sure all the legit reasons for making one of the books.

No, serial number is NOT required.

 

[meketrefe]

No, serial number is NOT required.

How do you register your pistol w/o a serial number? You cannot use a pistol w/o being in your permit, it would be illegal.

 

[freddy]

How do you register your pistol w/o a serial number? You cannot use a pistol w/o being in your permit, it would be illegal.

For a handgun only, NYS may ask for serial number. But long arm needs no serial number in this circumstance. Even with handgun it is possible to regi in NYS without a serial number... ala pre-1968 which have no serial number.

 

[Eddie Gunks]

@Bullet Guy had one for sale not too long ago.

Gone. You snooze you loose.......

 

[meketrefe]

A person is guilty of criminal possession of a weapon in the third degree when: (1) Such person commits the crime of criminal possession of a weapon in the fourth degree as defined in subdivision one, two , three or five of section 265.01 , and has been previously convicted of any crime;  or (2) Such person possesses any explosive or incendiary bomb, bombshell, firearm silencer, machine-gun or any other firearm or weapon simulating a machine-gun and which is adaptable for such use;  or (3) Such person knowingly possesses a machine-gun, firearm, rifle or shotgun which has been defaced for the purpose of concealment or prevention of the detection of a crime or misrepresenting the identity of such machine-gun, firearm, rifle or shotgun;

The ATF says you can make your own rifle or pistol.
NYS says it cannot be defaced / must have Identity.
NYS requires a pistol with serial number added to your Pistol License.

I think it is clear.

 

[freddy]

Gone. You snooze you loose.......

Yes of course.

Until you have witnessed it first hand, a person cannot really understand the feeling this pre-programmed and automated little mill evokes. It is the feeling of freedom.

 

[freddy]

A person is guilty of criminal possession of a weapon in the third degree when: (1) Such person commits the crime of criminal possession of a weapon in the fourth degree as defined in subdivision one, two , three or five of section 265.01 , and has been previously convicted of any crime;  or (2) Such person possesses any explosive or incendiary bomb, bombshell, firearm silencer, machine-gun or any other firearm or weapon simulating a machine-gun and which is adaptable for such use;  or (3) Such person knowingly possesses a machine-gun, firearm, rifle or shotgun which has been defaced for the purpose of concealment or prevention of the detection of a crime or misrepresenting the identity of such machine-gun, firearm, rifle or shotgun;

The ATF says you can make your own rifle or pistol.
NYS says it cannot be defaced / must have Identity.
NYS requires a pistol with serial number added to your Pistol License.

I think it is clear.

Where exactly does it say "must have identity"?

And, does no one in the entire state of NY legally possess a pre 1968 handgun manufactured without a serial number?

 

[Marine Cpl]

Defaced doesn't mean built without a serial number. I bet if you go to your boys in the NYSP you'll get 12 different answers at 12 different times.

 

[Eddie Gunks]

@meketrefe

Making a gun with no serial number is NOT defacing it.

Defacing would be REMOVING an existing serial number.

 

[freddy]

Now look at California. In or around June 2018, as I understand it, they will require serial numbers but only if built after June 2018. How exactly a LEO will know if a unserialized receiver was built after 2018 I do not have any idea.

How long before all NYers lose the opportunity to do this?

 

[meketrefe]

@meketrefe

Making a gun with no serial number is NOT defacing it.

Defacing would be REMOVING an existing serial number.

The result is the same but just in case take the last sentence, there is the word "OR" in between.
"...or misrepresenting the identity of such machine-gun, firearm, rifle or shotgun"

Between the defacing (same result / no serial) and the misrepresenting the identity how could a
judge in liberal ny going to interpret a brand-less firearm w/o a serial number?
Why people put the serial many times (youtube). Is that too much work? It can be anything right?

I get why someone might think well, if shtf I have some things to resort to for emergency.
If that is the case then many people are going to be diving where the boat went down anyway.

 

[freddy]

The result is the same but just in case take the last sentence, there is the word "OR" in between.
"...or misrepresenting the identity of such machine-gun, firearm, rifle or shotgun"

Between the defacing (same result / no serial) and the misrepresenting the identity how could a
judge in liberal ny going to interpret a brand-less firearm w/o a serial number?
Why people put the serial many times (youtube). Is that too much work? It can be anything right?

I get why someone might think well, if shtf I have some things to resort to for emergency.
If that is the case then many people are going to be diving where the boat went down anyway.

There is a big difference between 'omitting' and 'misrepresenting'.

And, again, please refer to the millions of pre-1968 rifles shotguns and handguns that were manufactured without any serial number.

 

[Marine Cpl]

How is not adding a serial number misrepresenting? Here is that sword for you.

 

[Eddie Gunks]

Again. It is not misrepresentation.

Your interpertatin is a bit streached. Make it easy and just use what they say and stop reading in that far .

How you get from making a gun with no engraving to misrepresenting is ......Curious.

 

[freddy]

Guns America: Cody Wilson Drops New 'Ghost Gunner' Package, Adds 1911s and Glocks

" It’s even legal to sell or transfer these guns, as long as they aren’t made with the intent of selling or transferring them. They don’t have or need serial numbers."
​

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[freddy]

WIRED magazine: This "Ghost Gun" Machine Now Makes Untraceable Metal Handguns

"Of course it’s worth the risk. The right is protected because it can be abused, not because there are no consequences," [Cody Wilson] says.
​

 

[freddy]

Ghost Gunner CNC Machines Now Completing 80% Pistol Frames - The Truth About Guns

Lots of people people finish 80% receivers now using hand tools or drill presses. Results vary based on their skill, patience, and equipment. If attacking a would-be rifle or pistol frame with a drill isn’t your speed, Defense Distributed’s Ghost Gunner, a tabletop CNC mill, will do the job with professional-level precision.
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[freddy]

"For Immediate Release

LIGHTS OUT CALIFORNIA

On July 1st, 2018, California’s AB857 comes into effect. This law requires 80% frames finished after July 1 to be reported to the California Department of Justice.

Ghost Gunner encourages all Californians to purchase and complete their 80% builds by July 1. At which point, we must begin recommending all California GG purchasers serialize their builds."

 

[freddy]

How long before NYS does the same?

 

[Acer-m14]

how many ..

will they get

 

[Acer-m14]

gunner .. find them hehehee what is it some visa number hs1b or something like that ..