I’m new to the gun world in NY and I would like to stay compliant to our current law.

[Normalaveragejoe]

So I recently ordered upper receiver from PSA since I would like to build my AR (budget). However I’m very confused with the law. First and foremost, the barrel length. It was advertised as 16” barrel and it does not state it’s pined or welded. So I’m assuming it’s removable, so the total length of the barrel is 16” without the flash hider?
second I’ve seen people saying welding the thread protector is the safe bet but would it be ok to just jbweld the thing and call it a day? Thirdly any recommended featureless build without that weird stock?

 

[dsdmmat]

first welcome to the site.

Featureless is spur grip/ something like it or the funky stock. Of course if you can find an SCR lower receiver you would only have to take care of the threaded barrel.

If you you bought a 16 inch upper, the barrel is 16” most likely threaded so you will have to take care of that. Personally I feel the Red locktite or epoxy on the thread protector will be enough for compliance. But your mileage may very.

the other way to do it is with a fixed mag. That is a PIA but it is reversible

 

[Normalaveragejoe]

Thank you for the reply ! I really appreciate your time.

 

[dsdmmat]

We are here to help.

 

[GTN]

The weird stock isn’t to bad. You do need a ambi safety in order to engage the safety back on

 

[spat]

The weird stock isn’t to bad. You do need a ambi safety in order to engage the safety back on

Agreed, the stock looks funny, but aside from not being able to re-engage the safety without shifting your grip, it's not too bad.

I had 2 ARs when I lived in NY, one with the stock and the other with a fixed mag. The stock was far less of an issue.

The barrel is 16 inches. That is a federal law, so it's nothing NY special. If it needed the flash hider to make up the extra length, then it already had to be permanent per the ATF. I wouldn't worry about that.

As for the thread protection, you have a few options depending on your comfort level.

Most people think JB Weld would be sufficient.

I soldered mine on. IIRC there is an official ATF opinion that that is sufficient to make a barrel attachment "permanent".

Another option is to just grind the threads down leaving a smooth end (but don't cut them off or you will make the barrel too short).

I wouldn't have felt comfortable with just red locktite, but that's just an opinion. There is no definitive answer.

 

[ArmedCorgi]

I soldered mine on. IIRC there is an official ATF opinion that that is sufficient to make a barrel attachment "permanent".

So that ATF memo, I believe is in regard to making an NFA length barrel legal to cross state lines with. NYS has no guidance on what is legal other than that threads are not legal. Pinning and welding a thread protector or other muzzle device does not remove the threads, neither does LocTite or JB weld so short of grinding the threads off when it comes to pinning and welding or gluing, your guess is as good as mine. Unless there is some kind of legal proof that NYS adopted the ATF standard from that memo, but again, that memo has everything to do with barrel length and nothing to do with threads.

 

[spat]

So that ATF memo, I believe is in regard to making an NFA length barrel legal to cross state lines with. NYS has no guidance on what is legal other than that threads are not legal. Pinning and welding a thread protector or other muzzle device does not remove the threads, neither does LocTite or JB weld so short of grinding the threads off when it comes to pinning and welding or gluing, your guess is as good as mine. Unless there is some kind of legal proof that NYS adopted the ATF standard from that memo, but again, that memo has everything to do with barrel length and nothing to do with threads.

You are correct that the memo is about attaching a muzzle device to permanently lengthen a barrel that otherwise would be too short. Nothing about crossing state lines though, without that extension it would be an unregistered SBR no matter where it was made or kept.

And you are also correct that that standard hasn't been officially adopted by NY for anything, but it is a guideline.

As for "the threads still being there", If they want to go that far, I could claim any barrel has threads, I just need to run a die down it to remove the steel covering them.

 

[ArmedCorgi]

Nothing about crossing state lines though, without that extension it would be an unregistered SBR no matter where it was made or kept.

That's the guidance though. If you have an SBR and want to cross state lines without all the paperwork, Etc., you have to make the barrel the federal legal length. The official way to do so is detailed in that ATF memo. SBR's and other NFA items are per state and not legal to go between states with if you are changing residences without application and more paperwork. Application to Transport Interstate or to Temporarily Export Certain NFA Firearms (ATF Form 5320.20) | Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco, Firearms and Explosives

 

[Normalaveragejoe]

Hmmm so I guess I’ll just sand down the thread and just cover the mess with thread protector to cover it….
plus alpha to this thread which option is better? ordering stripped lower from PSA or getting one from FFL in Long Island? Either option which one is reputable dealer to get it from ?
btw I really appreciate all of you guys for replying to my post. No one really had any answer to my questions.. either that or sarcastic answers

 

[ArmedCorgi]

Hmmm so I guess I’ll just sand down the thread and just cover the mess with thread protector to cover it….
plus alpha to this thread which option is better? ordering stripped lower from PSA or getting one from FFL in Long Island? Either option which one is reputable dealer to get it from ?
btw I really appreciate all of you guys for replying to my post. No one really had any answer to my questions.. either that or sarcastic answers

Have your muzzle device (thread protector or muzzle brake) pinned and welded or jb weld it. I don't think it matters as long as a cop can't readily remove it without tools and you don't have the illegal type of muzzle device on it, ie a "flash hider". Permanently attaching the illegal type of muzzle device will just make the barrel permanently illegal in NY. Like @spat said, if they go that far then you can claim some things. I don't think they could even try to remove the muzzle device in court, so I wouldn't worry too much about it. That isn't legal advice mind you.

As far as getting a stripped lower, either option will still require going through an ffl. so if you have an ffl that is selling stripped lowers, see what the cost comparison is between buying one online with shipping and transfer fees VS. just buying one locally.

 

[Normalaveragejoe]

Have your muzzle device (thread protector or muzzle brake) pinned and welded or jb weld it. I don't think it matters as long as a cop can't readily remove it without tools and you don't have the illegal type of muzzle device on it, ie a "flash hider". Permanently attaching the illegal type of muzzle device will just make the barrel permanently illegal in NY. Like @spat said, if they go that far then you can claim some things. I don't think they could even try to remove the muzzle device in court, so I wouldn't worry too much about it. That isn't legal advice mind you.

As far as getting a stripped lower, either option will still require going through an ffl. so if you have an ffl that is selling stripped lowers, see what the cost comparison is between buying one online with shipping and transfer fees VS. just buying one locally.

I have zero clue which dealer to goto.. I’ve just google searched around Long Island which dealers have stripped lower. Most don’t have their website to see what they have or what they sell. Some dealers sounded shady according to different forum like Jerry’s and freds? So I’m just timid on where to go.

 

[ArmedCorgi]

Most dealers will offer stripped lowers. It's just that they may charge more or less for them. All dealers will charge a transfer fee if you order from a third party that isn't one of their suppliers for the use of their ffl. That's if they will do the transfer in the first place. I would do your best to research the local dealers and then just stop in and see what they offer. if they don't have what you want, ask if they can get it for you and/or if they would do a transfer for you if you ordered it from online. Worst that can happen is they are too expensive or they say no.

 

[Normalaveragejoe]

Most dealers will offer stripped lowers. It's just that they may charge more or less for them. All dealers will charge a transfer fee if you order from a third party that isn't one of their suppliers for the use of their ffl. That's if they will do the transfer in the first place. I would do your best to research the local dealers and then just stop in and see what they offer. if they don't have what you want, ask if they can get it for you and/or if they would do a transfer for you if you ordered it from online. Worst that can happen is they are too expensive or they say no.

Thank you, I’ll do more research!!

 

[ArmedCorgi]

Don't go to DSI.

 

[GOYABEAN]

Welcome @Normalaveragejoe there's currently a open position for governor of land you're chance to run and normalize these tyrannical un American and ridiculous laws

 

[spat]

That's the guidance though. If you have an SBR and want to cross state lines without all the paperwork, Etc., you have to make the barrel the federal legal length. The official way to do so is detailed in that ATF memo. SBR's and other NFA items are per state and not legal to go between states with if you are changing residences without application and more paperwork. Application to Transport Interstate or to Temporarily Export Certain NFA Firearms (ATF Form 5320.20) | Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco, Firearms and Explosives

Pretty sure once you have it registered as an SBR, you can't just extend the barrel length and then ignore the restrictions.

And if you have an SBR that's unregistered, it's already illegal, even if you never leave the state.

I guess I'm just not understanding what would be legal if you never moved it interstate, but would be illegal if you did.

 

[togmaster]

Are you in Queens? (The rotten apple) Check with a local FFL and make sure you can get an AR lower transferred to you before you invest in other parts.

 

[GTN]

There’s also going the route of a barrel that is crowned target - no threads at all. That’s what I have on mine.
To me a AR with droppable mag is more important than a muzzle device, adjustable stock and pistol grip.

 

[nortatoga]

This. This is what it is important to know. It is still a NY state law. The 2nd circuit in Western NY may have struck down the ruling and some western NY cops and DAs might not arrest or try to prosecute but they could try.
And, yeah, it might not go anywhere for them but do want that hassle. Do you have the time to deal with it, missing work, paying attorney's fees all the while the cop and the DA don't sweat it because it is their job and they are getting paid for your hassle.
I not saying you couldn't carry 10 rounds without going to jail; I'm just saying it might cost you time and money.

So I recently ordered upper receiver from PSA since I would like to build my AR (budget). However I’m very confused with the law. First and foremost, the barrel length. It was advertised as 16” barrel and it does not state it’s pined or welded. So I’m assuming it’s removable, so the total length of the barrel is 16” without the flash hider?
second I’ve seen people saying welding the thread protector is the safe bet but would it be ok to just jbweld the thing and call it a day? Thirdly any recommended featureless build without that weird stock?

@Normalaveragejoe AR 15's were banned in NYC before the Safe-Act. And that may not have changed! I know you have to get a permit and register all long guns. Then there is the 5rd mag limit, I remember threads in the past that only the Ruger Mini-14 ( with a SKU# that it came from the factory with a 5rd mag was GTG ) and the (ARES) Fightlite SCR which also only ship's with a 5rd mag. So unfortunately you really need to check with the powers that be in NYC at this time.


The basic SCR unfortunately Fightlite is out of stock.



This started out as a basic model. There are a few threads on here about SCR's.

 

[ArmedCorgi]

Pretty sure once you have it registered as an SBR, you can't just extend the barrel length and then ignore the restrictions.

And if you have an SBR that's unregistered, it's already illegal, even if you never leave the state.

I guess I'm just not understanding what would be legal if you never moved it interstate, but would be illegal if you did.

Yes. Extending the barrel length to 16" will make it a normal rifle with no federal restrictions. Pinning and welding or silver solder is the official and legal way to "permanently" do so according to the ATF. Again, nothing about threads being legal or illegal.

If you want to take a registered SBR or other NFA item out of your home state, accross state lines legally, you need to apply to do so as per that link I posted or permanently extend the barrel using the guidance in that ATF memo.

 

[ArmedCorgi]

@Normalaveragejoe AR 15's were banned in NYC before the Safe-Act. And that may not have changed! I know you have to get a permit and register all long guns. Then there is the 5rd mag limit, I remember threads in the past that only the Ruger Mini-14 ( with a SKU# that it came from the factory with a 5rd mag was GTG ) and the (ARES) Fightlite SCR which also only ship's with a 5rd mag. So unfortunately you really need to check with the powers that be in NYC at this time.

View attachment 148114
The basic SCR unfortunately Fightlite is out of stock.

View attachment 148115

This started out as a basic model. There are a few thread on here about SCR's.

I still really want one of those.

 

[spat]

Yes. Extending the barrel length to 16" will make it a normal rifle with no federal restrictions. Pinning and welding or silver solder is the official and legal way to "permanently" do so according to the ATF. Again, nothing about threads being legal or illegal.

If you want to take a registered SBR or other NFA item out of your home state, accross state lines legally, you need to apply to do so as per that link I posted or permanently extend the barrel using the guidance in that ATF memo.

But, once you have registered it as an SBR, I don't think moving it interstate is as simple as extending the barrel anymore.

Otherwise, you could just swap uppers. No soldering needed.

 

[Edwardteach72]

But, once you have registered it as an SBR, I don't think moving it interstate is as simple as extending the barrel anymore.

Otherwise, you could just swap uppers. No soldering needed.

This is correct

 

[spat]

This is correct

So, the whole "lengthen the barrel" thing is irrelevant for interstate transport.

If it was an illegal SBR in the original state it was already illegal.

If it was a registered SBR, lengthening the barrel won't make it any easier to transport.

The permanent attachment thing is how to not make it an SBR to begin with, and any interstate transport is irrelevant.

 

[Edwardteach72]

So, the whole "lengthen the barrel" thing is irrelevant for interstate transport.

If it was an illegal SBR in the original state it was already illegal.

If it was a registered SBR, lengthening the barrel won't make it any easier to transport.

The permanent attachment thing is how to not make it an SBR to begin with, and any interstate transport is irrelevant.

Correct. Because the lower reciever (or whatever is considered the firearm) is what has the engraving and tax stamp you can't just toss a 16" barrel on it and now it's no longer an NFA item

 

[Saltwater60]

First welcome and thanks for being appreciative of our responses. Far too many times people get mad we don’t have all the answers.
What I would do is do an FFL search in your area and you maybe better off going with a table top guy around you. Call a few highly rated local shops, but be sure you know what you want before calling and asking if they have this or that. Most fun shops are busy right now and don’t have excess time to talk and mull things over, some are just down right rude, but hey it happened in every business world.
I have that funky stock and two fixed mag ar’s. I like the fixed mag ones better, but wanted one with removable mags. As stated the third sentence stock isn’t that bad and I have one without a muzzle break. There are uppers that come featureless and you might be better off looking for one of them. If not I would have some one out a small tack weld between the barrel and muzzle break, but that’s just me.
If you go fixed mag make sure you fix only a 10/10 round mag not a 10/30 mag and make sure it’s a good quality mag like magpul with the removable base incase you get a double feed. It’s happened to me.

 

[nortatoga]

@Normalaveragejoe you may also find more info on this forum as it it closer to the NYC limits. Forums - Long Island Gun Club

 

[Drinkthekoolaid]

Congrats and welcome

Building your first is a great way to learn more about them.

Every American needs an AR-15 (well at least one) for every able bodied person who wants one anyway

Be careful they can be addicting...

 

[FRB]

Be careful they can be addicting...

Indeed! I am a Barrel away from one more and counting on more than one hand!