Marlin 45/70 ammo question

[TonyRossi]

Hey all ,
I’m hoping someone with knowledge about what ammo I can and can’t use in my 45/70.
I have a newer Marlin 45/70 with the big loop. I usually shoot factory ammo out of it and it runs perfect . I got a great deal on some ammo that I am assuming was reloaded . I attached a pic of the three different types of bullets. Gentleman said most was 350 grain. My only concern is the longer bullet in the pic. Am I ok to shoot that ? There’s not many of those ,as the bulk of them look like the factory ammo I shoot.
Gun holds 5+1

thank you so much to anyone who responds .
Tony

 

[Getzville 068]

That longer bullet round concerns me.

Even if it chambers it might be so long that it touches the rifling in the barrel.

You don't want that to happen.

The other loads look good.

 

[thegatman]

Do not use pointed bullets in that Marlin. They touch in the magazine and could chain reaction on the primers. Always use flat nose. you can use Hornady Leverevolution as they have a plastic tip.
The bullet on the left in your picture would be good in a single shot.

 

[Varmint]

I wouldn’t run anybody’s reloads that I did not know very very well.

 

[Tisto]

I wouldn’t run anybody’s reloads that I did not know very very well.

What he said !!!

 

[Tisto]

I have a Marlin 1895 SBL that absolutely loves the Hornady LEVERevolution with the 325gr FTX bullet.

I would not shoot reloads from an unknown source. There's no telling if they are safe. Best to not take the chance that your gun will blow up in your face.

As far as the gun itself, and what loads it can handle, there are basically 3 categories of ammo for the .45-70 Govt.
1; this category is held to the original pressures for the cartridge. The .45-70 started out as a black powder cartridge, and was then adapted to smokeless powder. The low pressures generally held to about 25,000 C.U.P. are safe to run in any gun in good condition, including the Springfield 1873 Trapdoor, the 1886 Winchester, the H&R Shikari, and Rolling Blocks.

2; this category has substantially higher pressures that are NOT safe in the guns listed above. Pressures held to about 40,000 C.U.P. are safe to run in the 1895 Marlin as well as other modern lever action guns of similar construction or guns built with a stronger action.

3; this category is loaded to the highest pressures and is designed only for strong actions such as the Ruger # 1. Developing pressures slightly above 50,000 C.U.P., these loads would be extremely dangerous in any gun mentioned in either of categories 1 or 2 above.

Assuming that the person that loaded the rounds you purchased followed ALL the correct load data and produced loads he deemed to be "safe", you still don't know what they contain. What powder did he use ? What charge weight of that powder ? Is the bullet the correct diameter and weight ? Is it seated properly ? - a bullet seated too deeply will cause extreme pressures.

The guy that loaded that ammunition might be a window-licking moron that had no clue what he was doing. He may have blended different powders, and dreamed up his own load data. Now, do you still want to shoot that stuff ????

 

[repete]

I do a lot of reloading and I wouldn't shoot anybody else's reloads UNLESS it was a commercial licensed and insured re loader!
There's just to many variables. As far as the OAL of the bullet on the left that wouldn't bother as long as it was at or less then the recommended COAL or set up specifically for my gun.

 

[Skinny420]

Yup what they said. Don't shoot them unless you have a really good life insurance policy for your family to live on when your gone. Not worth it. 45-70 is a fun round to reload. Get some supplies and start your own projects. Regular bullet molds and round balls. The case has so much room you can put 3 round balls in there and plenty of powder. Get a published book on reloading and don't go past there recommended maximum. You should be good. As far as length. Hard to tell what is ok without measuring it. If it's not to long and chambers in your rifle it will be fine.

 

[turbobike]

As said before, don’t shoot this loaded ammo. BUT, I would get a bullet puller and dump the powder out, get a basic reloading setup, lookup some reloading data for those bullets, and reload the bullets to safe SAMMI pressures... reloading is a great hobby!

 

[tony]

Ammunition for a somewhat heavy recoiling caliber like that and tubular magazine should be crimped. The middle cartridge just may be lightly crimped, the others do not appear to be.

 

[TonyRossi]

This is how he loaded the rounds with the flat silver bullet .
Can someone please explain .

thank you

 

[repete]

This is how he loaded the rounds with the flat silver bullet .
Can someone please explain .

thank you

It's loaded with a 300 grain bullet with 38 grains of Hodgen 4227 powder

 

[TonyRossi]

It's loaded with a 300 grain bullet with 38 grains of Hodgen 4227 powder

Thank you
Is that sound about right ? Safe ?

 

[thegatman]

That is if he didn’t screw up and forgot the powder entirely. Usually with that bullet, 31 grains is recommended. I would pull them all and use the components with an approved load from a reloading manual.
@turbobike

 

[BDinPutnam]

That is if he didn’t screw up and forgot the powder entirely. Usually with that bullet, 31 grains is recommended. I would pull them all and use the components with an approved load from a reloading manual.
@turbobike

I am not a 45/70 nor a reloading guy but everything in this thread has me agreeing with this (and the others above).

There is no sense risking your (or someone else's) life and limb over this.

I have one (1) box of someone else's reloads in my ammo stockpile, and it's only because they were worked up specifically for my rifle (the actual 300 WinMag in my safe) by my father in law's brother.

 

[tony]

I have to concur with all the members whom said do not shoot this ammo. Find someone to pull the bullets, dump the powder in the garden. Buy some factory ammunition, shoot it, have a blast and save all your brass until you are ready to load your own.

If you are interested you might possibly find someone in your area to mentor you in the reloading process. I would encourage you to read up on the subject in just about any reloading manual to be familiar with the process. It certainly isn't rocket science but HAS to be done right.

 

[Tisto]

The closest data I could find in all of my reloading books has a 293 gr cast bullet with a MAXIMUM charge of 31.0 gr of IMR 4227. Now, IMR 4227 and H 4227 ARE NOT THE SAME POWDER, but they had similar burn rates, so we'll go with it for now. The data I have shows the necessity of a 1/2 gr polyester over powder wad. This is extremely important to ensure proper ignition of the powder. Failure to use one could cause a hangfire, which would be dangerously unpleasant at best, perhaps deadly. Keep in mind the MAXIMUM charge is 25% LESS than what is written on your ammo box...

Hodgdon quit producing H4227 sometime around 2003.

In ABSOLUTELY NONE of my books does it show data for loading H4227 in the .45-70 Govt. IMR4227 is shown in a few listings, but only very few. Quite honestly, IMR4227 would be a poor choice for that cartridge, and since I can find NO data for using H4227, that would be an even worse choice.

I know you don't want to hear this, but for your own safety and those around you, DISMANTLE ALL THOSE ROUNDS. Put the powder in a little pile and light it. It will burn - it will NOT explode. You should be able to then pop off the primers in the gun, and salvage the bullets. You can then safely reload the brass, but you should check to see that the brass is modern ( not balloon construction ) and has no signs of corrosive primers having been used.

 

[repete]

I agree with all the above with the exception of burning the powder. It's rich in nitrogen and works great spread in the garden, lawn or flower beds!

 

[Tisto]

I don't have a garden, and don't mich like pushing the lawnmower, so I see no reason to fertilize it !

 

[RooftopKorean]

Here is data from the Hornady Reloading book 10th edition I just purchased.

I just started reloading and by no means am I a pro, but going strictly on what the book says there is no mention of Hodgen 4227. I'd highly suggest what everyone is saying and steer clear of those rounds.

 

[Rondo223]

As stated the safest route is to not shoot these. I would say that not because they are not a safe lad but because you do not know for sure if they are correct.

Any recently published load data is not going to have any info on H4227. I did find in my Hornady Handbook Vol. 2 they list 4227 but do not clarify whether IMR or H. They have powders from both manufacturers listed in various recipes without calling them out

That being said they show load data for 300gr jacketed bullets( no cast data) starting at 27gr and maxing at 34.6gr for trapdoor loads. Ruger loads start at 41.3 and max at 50.6gr. I suspect if you went to the marlin or castboolits forum they would have a better idea what would be acceptable

They could very well be safe loads, But do you trust your well being with them? If I can find them I will post a pic of what a Marlin 1895 looks like when it has been loaded hot.

Oh and as far as the longer bullets go as long as the bolt closes and they cycle they should be OK. the tips are not pointed and have enough flat area to not be an issue.