Mutual Research Group?

[libertysnake]

So, I've heard of things like mutual assistance groups. I'm not talking about that in the "prepping" sense. I'm talking about working together for the purpose of being better informed citizens. This is, I believe, the first step in taking better political action -- having better awareness.

One of the biggest blockers to having really deep conversations is information. I can spend time and do research into a given topic, but I can only go so far as one person. There is only so much any one single person can really do follow-up wise, given the time in the day with work, hobbies, betterment, and house chores. This is really one of the biggest blockers that comes to mind for me, viz pooling of our intellectual efforts instead of just the usual complaining.

Normally this would be the job of the media itself. The media, seemingly, has failed to do this job because of their political and financial interests at stake. We need to pick up the slack and inform ourselves via analysis, documentation, and FOIA requests if necessary.

From a high level perspective I see the key points as:

• Determining what topics we care about most.
• Assigning subject matter experts to those specific high level topics.
• Breaking down the hard work of research into smaller portions and assigning owners to that work.
• Writing conclusions and revisiting those conclusions periodically to keep our perspectives refreshed.

I get that this isn't exactly the most entertaining or glamorous of ideas that could be proposed, but I don't see an easy way forward without having good awareness as a central part. It's not a perfect start, but hopefully there is some interest in putting in the time.

 

[holdover]

I think We have something like that now. People post things from all over the web. Its not topic specific, but current events , news, reports, ect.

 

[Saltwater60]

I think this is a great idea. For one I would really like to know how much of all this liberal support shit is just media hype or is cold hard facts. How many Americans actually support what Biden and the dems are doing?
As mentioned above sure social media kind of does this but I follow who I follow because I agree with their ideas and statements. This does not give me an idea of the percentage of people that want gun control or are LGBTQ. Also many Freon outside the USA post or posts are seen in the USA.

 

[OwnTheRide]

Facts are great, but we know all too well that facts don't matter in this fight. How many times have we shown the antis that MSRs are simply not a problem, statistically? How many times have we shown them that the MSR ban did nothing to reduce gun violence? These are undeniable facts collected by objective and trusted sources, but they've done exactly nothing in stopping the antis from constantly calling for another MSR ban.

We won't win this battle with facts, unfortunately.

 

[libertysnake]

Facts are great, but we know all too well that facts don't matter in this fight. How many times have we shown the antis that MSRs are simply not a problem, statistically? How many times have we shown them that the MSR ban did nothing to reduce gun violence? These are undeniable facts collected by objective and trusted sources, but they've done exactly nothing in stopping the antis from constantly calling for another MSR ban.

We won't win this battle with facts, unfortunately.

Whether they listen to facts or not is not my concern.

My concern is with having good awareness, which is key to any strategy.

 

[Robin]

You just went to the top of the list! Thanks.
Robin

 

[Saltwater60]

Facts are great, but we know all too well that facts don't matter in this fight. How many times have we shown the antis that MSRs are simply not a problem, statistically? How many times have we shown them that the MSR ban did nothing to reduce gun violence? These are undeniable facts collected by objective and trusted sources, but they've done exactly nothing in stopping the antis from constantly calling for another MSR ban.

We won't win this battle with facts, unfortunately.

While I agree with you in a sense but how do we actually know they have heard the facts, believe the facts, and how many hear the facts and don’t believe them? This is what would be interesting to find out.
I’m on Twitter and most believe the lie so I correct them and point them to the facts. I’ve had many still just push their agenda but at least you point out the facts to others. Moms Demand Action actually banned me for posting facts and civilly discussing with their supporters because I was making an impact and getting through to people point big out the lies and misleading articles. It works for some and some times some is all we need.

 

[holdover]

If you cannot have a dialog, discuss the facts , sooner or later the guns come out. Were well on our way. Marxism suppresses the facts and dialogs
and what happens to the people who disagree? You are here.

 

[libertysnake]

While I agree with you in a sense but how do we actually know they have heard the facts, believe the facts, and how many hear the facts and don’t believe them? This is what would be interesting to find out.
I’m on Twitter and most believe the lie so I correct them and point them to the facts. I’ve had many still just push their agenda but at least you point out the facts to others. Moms Demand Action actually banned me for posting facts and civilly discussing with their supporters because I was making an impact and getting through to people point big out the lies and misleading articles. It works for some and some times some is all we need.

It’s not necessarily about others hearing the facts. I’d like them to hear the facts, they just don’t always listen.

To me, the foundation of any serious political action, or strategy in general, is awareness. The American people are blind to having good information. That makes us easy to manipulate into consuming, voting, pressuring, etc.

 

[TEOTWAWKI inc.]

I like the idea, but few will participate for free.

If people started hearing the truth, they wouldn't even believe it anymore. The truth is already out there, sort of. Just read between the lines.

 

[libertysnake]

If you cannot have a dialog, discuss the facts , sooner or later the guns come out. Were well on our way. Marxism suppresses the facts and dialogs
and what happens to the people who disagree? You are here.

People like to speculate too much about the future. I'm not saying you should be oblivious, but don't overly spin your wheels either. As James Garfield once said of conflict:

Of course I deprecate war, but if it is brought to my door, the bringer will find me home.

 

[holdover]

If you want to know the future study the past. The current situation of cancel culture, censorship of conservative ideas across the internet. rewriting history. founding fathers were evil men , Communist ideas being taught in our schools. Kneeling for the national anthem, the burning of the flag. The toppling of statues Communist mayors and governors. Demonization of the right, the defunding of the police. Left wing militias organizing while right wing militias are persecuted. The foundations are being built for a an American Khmer rouge, NAZI brown shirts.

De-funding the police isn't about racism. Thats the official mask. If the city is the table , then the police are the table legs, kick out the legs and the whole thing falls down. Its about taking down citys , the easy ones first , the ones which have the backing of the mayors.

 

[fresch]

Would only work on us.
Was at the dentist yesterday, talked to the girl cleaning my teeth, she knows nothing of fauchcheese lies being exposed. Nothing about bidong and the NWO. Basically not interested but I sound like her dad!

 

[Robin]

Would only work on us.
Was at the dentist yesterday, talked to the girl cleaning my teeth, she knows nothing of fauchcheese lies being exposed. Nothing about bidong and the NWO. Basically not interested but I sound like her dad!

When I'm there the conversation is pretty one sided.
Robin

 

[libertysnake]

So, I repeat: who is seriously interested in participating in this in an organized manner? Or is it just myself and @Saltwater60 that have any interest?

It's time to start taking action. Clarity is a start. Awareness is a start. Pessimism is not.

 

[TEOTWAWKI inc.]

Who/what do you propose as the first subject that requires attention? I would be willing to invest some time if the effort aims to achieve a specific goal.

 

[libertysnake]

Who/what do you propose as the first subject that requires attention? I would be willing to invest some time if the effort aims to achieve a specific goal.

I haven't forgotten about this.

I'm open to a lot of topics. Anything firearms related is useful. Specifically I'd be interested in diving deep into how often red flag laws are used compared to how often they result in returning of firearms to innocent people. I suspect the ratio of stripping people of their rights, to actual convictions / useful outcomes is quite low -- indicating it is just a law used to abuse people.

Secondly, another claim made around here was that firearms manufacturers are now not selling to NY due to being liable in NYS for lawsuits. I don't see evidence of this happening, but I'd like to know more.

Just two things that immediately come to mind.

 

[TEOTWAWKI inc.]

I haven't forgotten about this.

I'm open to a lot of topics. Anything firearms related is useful. Specifically I'd be interested in diving deep into how often red flag laws are used compared to how often they result in returning of firearms to innocent people. I suspect the ratio of stripping people of their rights, to actual convictions / useful outcomes is quite low -- indicating it is just a law used to abuse people.

Secondly, another claim made around here was that firearms manufacturers are now not selling to NY due to being liable in NYS for lawsuits. I don't see evidence of this happening, but I'd like to know more.

Just two things that immediately come to mind.

I have just been searching red flag statistics for a good 20 minutes now. Can't find anything useful/trustworthy. Everytown(yeah, I know) shows 170 ERPO's in NY in 2019, with 48% of NY counties filing at least one order. I'll check court and NYSP websites too, but someone would probably need to FOIA every LEA in the state to get good info.

 

[SonOfSun]

I have just been searching red flag statistics for a good 20 minutes now. Can't find anything useful/trustworthy. Everytown(yeah, I know) shows 170 ERPO's in NY in 2019, with 48% of NY counties filing at least one order. I'll check court and NYSP websites too, but someone would probably need to FOIA every LEA in the state to get good info.

Which would be expensive. It isnt uncommon for Foia requests to cost $70-100 each.

 

[libertysnake]

Which would be expensive. It isnt uncommon for Foia requests to cost $70-100 each.

Why should it even cost money? Fucking idiotic that it should cost The People a dime to get answers from their representatives.

 

[SonOfSun]

Why should it even cost money? Fucking idiotic that it should cost The People a dime to get answers from their representatives.

Freedom of information isn't actually free. The entities you are requesting information from are permitted to charge fees equal to labor cost required to provide the information. Those fees typically range from $25-80 an hour and include the benefit costs of the person processing the request. They are also allowed to charge nominal and actual fees for postage, print costs, etc. Apparently it's to prevent abuse where someone just requests a bunch of stuff just to cause work and labor costs for the municipality.

Not saying I agree or not, but that's what it is.

 

[libertysnake]

Freedom of information isn't actually free. The entities you are requesting information from are permitted to charge fees equal to labor cost required to provide the information. Those fees typically range from $25-80 an hour and include the benefit costs of the person processing the request. They are also allowed to charge nominal and actual fees for postage, print costs, etc. Apparently it's to prevent abuse where someone just requests a bunch of stuff just to cause work and labor costs for the municipality.

Not saying I agree or not, but that's what it is.

I wonder if it's worth the time to form a non-profit for the purpose of donating money to it for FOIA requests, so at least the money is reduced or not taxed.

Or seeing about writing off FOIA requests on taxes.

Anyway, I don't think it will be that many requests, but it may make sense to do some.

 

[TEOTWAWKI inc.]

The information should just reside in an easily accessible/searchable database already. What year is this?

I noticed a while back, you could not process a DMV transaction on their website outside of normal business hours. Apparently servers in NY even have damn union rep.

I'll put some cash towards FOIA if the info is useful.