MY Reloading Adventure

[HighlandLofts]

I have the single stage lock n load setup actually two of them. Most of myvstuck cases are my fault. I switch calibers and forget to switch the shell holder.

But the last stuck case was a 308. I only have been useing Hornady one shot spray. I didnt get any lube inside the neck.
A couple of weeks ago I got in some liquid lanolin and bought some of the red container of Heet dry gas and made some home made spray, ten to one ratio. I put in 4 inches of heat and .4 inches of lanolin.
It smells like alchohol and really lubricates the cases. I place the cased in a plastic container spray them, roll.them around and give them another shot of spray.
I'll let them set a while and then I wipe the necks with a paper towel.and them lube the necks with the Imperaial dry neck lube.
After I resize the cases I wipe them off with a paper towel.
I clean the primer pockets before I resize. So far no stuck cases and they resize easily.

I did a hundred or so 30/06 cases this afternoon.
I will stick with the spray, I have the rcbs lube pad and lube for it. I think it is good just sitting in the box of extra loading stuff.

 

[Carlos Hathcock]

So I think I have the formula figured out. Smaller cases (.223) are OK with just the spray lube. Larger cases need a little more. I sized close to 300 cases of .223 and no issues at all....other than my arms about to fall off.

I do find a lot of homemade lube and cleaning solution recipes on youtube and other forums. I'll more than likely try some of these brews pretty soon.

Had some issues with the powder drop but guess it was just maintenance related. I guess it was due.

 

[Carlos Hathcock]

Loaded around 400 rounds .223. I'm starting to learn the valuable lesson of reloading. Some calibers aren't always worth the effort.

 

[Carlos Hathcock]

So what say you?

Loaded up a couple .243 options. First were 115DTAC's as I was wanted to see how they'd shoot out of my Savage. Long story short, I dont rhink I have enough twist to stabilize. I think a couple ground hogs and birds were taken out. I think a couple hit paper backwards.

Tried my second load:
100g Sierra Pro Hunters
Hornady cases (twice fired)
39g H4350
CCI 200 primers

After about 25 I noticed primers either partially out or blown out altogether. Thought I had some overloads slip through. Back to the shop and pulled 3 randoms. All measured from 39.0 to 39.3.

Any idea what may be the cause for this? Could IMR's tables be off? I was near the higher end of the load but not that heavy. Saw one case neck with a tiny split but the rest were fine. Could've been an anomaly. Whadya think?

 

[gun_slinger_boy]

Did you possibly mix the 115 grain data with the 100 grain? 39 grains would put you over for the 115 grains.



ETA IMR as the powder manufacturer is slightly different.

 

[Carlos Hathcock]

Didnt mix. I write a data card for each box so the powder loaded was what I wrote on the card.

 

[Carlos Hathcock]

Just want to confirm my suspicions. Do re- sized / re-loaded cases fit into the chamber a little more "snug" than a factory unfired case? I would think the answer is yes since they've been fire formed to the chamber. I typical check cases that have been sized and trimmed prior to loading.

Also, noticed while loading some 22-250 cases (Hornady and Sellier & Bellot) that SB cases have a lighter neck tension vs the Hornady's. Can actual feel when seating. This is not a bushing sizing die for this caliber. I'm going to separate when testing assuming I'll get different speeds and results.

 

[Deplorable Me]

Loaded around 400 rounds .223. I'm starting to learn the valuable lesson of reloading. Some calibers aren't always worth the effort.
View attachment 40504

Nice picture!

 

[ManrisFrack]

Yes, fired brass will be formed to your chamber. It does shrink back a bit after the pressure drops off due to the elasticity of the brass. If it didn't shrink back, you wouldn't be able to extract it.

Sizing it will make the case smaller, depending on what dies you use and how you do it. If you're using a bolt action, you can neck size (bring the die down enough to shrink the neck back but not enough to move the shoulder back at all). You can also set the die to bump the shoulder a certain amount (if you're using a semi-auto I've seen 0.003" shoulder bump from fired dimension recommended as the least you want for reliable feeding). You can also follow the setup directions that came with the die and it should get you to SAAMI specs but it will probably be slightly smaller than the two methods mentioned above.

Use this comparator tool to measure shoulder bump. You can also use pistol brass instead of the fancy kit if you can find a size that sits on the shoulder of the rifle case you're loading. Keep the same piece of pistol brass, don't alter it in any way and you'll get fairly repeatable measurements session to session.

While we're on the subject, you might want to check the headspace of your reloaded ammo. If you have a caliber specific gauge like this one, that would be best. Alternatively, you can use the comparator or pistol case to compare to factory. If you're shorter than factory by more than a thou or two, that's probably why you're popping primers. Factory ammo is usually made toward the small end of the spec.

If your ammo is headspaced properly, pressure is the only reason I can think of that you'd be losing primers using a bolt gun. Do the rounds that retained primers show markings where the ejector and extractor holes are? Is there soot around the primers that stayed in? Did the bolt lift hard? All these are pressure signs.

Don't mix brands of brass, especially when loading near max. Each brand of brass is slightly different (things like wall thickness and web thickness will vary brand to brand) and will have different internal capacities. If you put the same amount of powder and same bullet at the same depth using two different cases, the pressures will be different. Every time you change a component (to include primer and brass) start low and work the load up again.

ETA: The split neck made something occur to me. Maybe you're at end of life on these cases? I know that loose primer pockets is a common failure mode when brass is done. Seems odd that it's happening after only 3 loads though. If that's common with .243 Hornady brass, you should be able to find that with an internet search.

 

[Carlos Hathcock]

I dont try to load near max. I like to stay a couple loads down from what's listed. All my dies are Hornady full length and only a couple are match grade (bushing) dies. 6mm and .223 are the only ones I have match grade. I trim within .001 of spec and never leave cases long. Those cases were only fired twice if I remember and only the one had a split neck. Could've been coincidence. Bolt didnt lift hard.

I do remember seeing some marks on the back of the cases, I think.


The gases did a pretty good job of gunking up the ejector pin spring and deforming the bottom end of the spring. Still works but it's not what it was.

 

[gun_slinger_boy]

After you resize do you clean the brass again?

 

[Carlos Hathcock]

After you resize do you clean the brass again?

After sizing I towel them to remove excessive lube (wipe on lube). Only lube prob left behind is the RCBS case spray. Not excessive in my opinion.

 

[gun_slinger_boy]

Hmmm. Just asking because in that last picture it kinda looks gunky in the primer pocket. Could just be the angle but if lube was in the primer pocket it could cause problems. Not saying that it would be related to the blown primers or split neck. Just an observation.

 

[Carlos Hathcock]

Hmmm. Just asking because in that last picture it kinda looks gunky in the primer pocket. Could just be the angle but if lube was in the primer pocket it could cause problems. Not saying that it would be related to the blown primers or split neck. Just an observation.

Nope. No lube in there. Spotless before priming.

 

[ForceOptions]

just joined this site and i admit i didn't read every single post but are you using a chronograph for your testing or just looking at the target and the brass?

 

[ManrisFrack]

Yep, that's brass flowing back into the ejector hole. I'd say you're too hot.

Nosler's data lists 39.0gr of H4350 as max with 95gr and 100gr bullets. The Hodgdon data above is for a boat tail I think. You're using a flat base Pro-Hunter, right? Longer bearing surface on the flat base resulting in more resistance going down the barrel, maybe. Little stuff like bearing surface, case volume, seating depth and even the temperature of the round can make "safe" loads hot. You use the books (notice this is plural) to get close but you have to pay attention to the rifle, brass and velocity if you have a chrono. Unless you duplicate the book loads EXACTLY (same brass, primer, charge seating depth, etc.), you will get different results. Even then, you're chamber is probably slightly different than the test barrel and that can have an effect too.

The book should never be allowed to trump what the brass, rifle and chrono are telling you.

 

[Carlos Hathcock]

Yep, that's brass flowing back into the ejector hole. I'd say you're too hot.

Nosler's data lists 39.0gr of H4350 as max with 95gr and 100gr bullets. The Hodgdon data above is for a boat tail I think. You're using a flat base Pro-Hunter, right? Longer bearing surface on the flat base resulting in more resistance going down the barrel, maybe. Little stuff like bearing surface, case volume, seating depth and even the temperature of the round can make "safe" loads hot. You use the books (notice this is plural) to get close but you have to pay attention to the rifle, brass and velocity if you have a chrono. Unless you duplicate the book loads EXACTLY (same brass, primer, charge seating depth, etc.), you will get different results. Even then, you're chamber is probably slightly different than the test barrel and that can have an effect too.

The book should never be allowed to trump what the brass, rifle and chrono are telling you.

I absolutely agree. I was having issues with my chrono all day and think I figured that out so next time I'm out in should be able to monitor that as well. I suppose the bullet design could have an effect, I just dont see how. Again, new to the game so still learnig. I will try again a and provide more feedback.

 

[ManrisFrack]

I absolutely agree. I was having issues with my chrono all day and think I figured that out so next time I'm out in should be able to monitor that as well. I suppose the bullet design could have an effect, I just dont see how. Again, new to the game so still learnig. I will try again a and provide more feedback.

I'm definitely not an expert either and maybe someone like @meketrefe could explain better. As I understand it, the rifling deforms the bullet as it the bullet engages the rifling. This creates a lot of resistance and is one of the reasons pressure peaks at the beginning of the whole firing event. If you have a bullet that is at maximum diameter over a longer portion of it's length, this will keep the pressure bottled up longer, probably resulting in a higher peak pressure. Similarly, the hardness and thickness of the jacket alloy can make the rifling grooves easier or harder to form.

You have to remember, the powder is still burning as the bullet begins moving so this is continually adding tons of energy to the little pressure vessel that you've created. Even minute changes to how fast the vessel is enlarged and eventually uncorked (i.e. bullet moving down and exiting the barrel) can have relatively large effects on the pressure curve.

 

[Carlos Hathcock]

I'm definitely not an expert either and maybe someone like @meketrefe could explain better. As I understand it, the rifling deforms the bullet as it the bullet engages the rifling. This creates a lot of resistance and is one of the reasons pressure peaks at the beginning of the whole firing event. If you have a bullet that is at maximum diameter over a longer portion of it's length, this will keep the pressure bottled up longer, probably resulting in a higher peak pressure. Similarly, the hardness and thickness of the jacket alloy can make the rifling grooves easier or harder to form.

You have to remember, the powder is still burning as the bullet begins moving so this is continually adding tons of energy to the little pressure vessel that you've created. Even minute changes to how fast the vessel is enlarged and eventually uncorked (i.e. bullet moving down and exiting the barrel) can have relatively large effects on the pressure curve.

I think that makes sense. What's kind of confusing was the longer 115gr DTAC's were not doing this but the shorter Sierra's did. I'd have thought it would be reversed.

 

[Phauxtoe]

I got into reloading because of FUAC and that damn Database that still is not built .. nuff said .. Shhhhhh Reloading is a secret for now

I would like a unlike on that last photo .. damn GOVT workers .. .. i would go see the postmaster and get payment to fix that box .. WTH .. FKin Lazy asses

now if you want to make anti tank rounds .. just turn that die down a few turns .. LOL ..

[/
QUOTE]
i am not familiar with this round, would Love to see the gun!

 

[Phauxtoe]

Got motivated and took this as far as I want to for now. Until I start using it, I'm not sure what I want to change, modify, etc.

Set up on 4 locking casters, 2 lower shelves, and a simple back and hood for tools and lights. Everything plugs into a multi port power strip so one button shuts everything down.

My lock-n-load press and tumbler came in on Thursday. Special thanks to Midsouth Shooters Supply for shipping it "adult signature required" to add some extra horseshitery to my week. Had to blow close to 3 hours picking it up from UPS central terminal because of it. It's a reloading press, not enriched Plutonium.

Mounted to table top and assembled. Just need to get the right die and shell plate combo for .223 and 6mm.

Ran the tumbler with walnut media. Works pretty good on lightly tarnished brass. Dirtier brass, not so much. Will experiment with other media. I have some sandblasting media. Wondering if that would be OK?

Snagged 2 LED light bars from VALU hardware as they were on sale for $15 each. Plenty bright.

All in all, it filled up quick but I didnt want to create something too big. Even being on wheels it's pretty solid and stable. I think the height is perfect. About 42". Makes the press low but when I use my mechanics seat I can sit perfectly with what I want to see right up close.
View attachment 38388 View attachment 38389 View attachment 38390

NICE CLUBHOUSE!

 

[Carlos Hathcock]

NICE CLUBHOUSE!

No girls allowed.

 

[Phauxtoe]

No girls allowed.

oh come now, what if she is Hot and Wants to do it on the bench?

 

[Carlos Hathcock]

oh come now, what if she is Hot and Wants to do it on the bench?

As long as she doesnt disturb my setup.....maybe.

 

[meketrefe]

Full size the brass and put and old primer and measure the water capacity of the cases.
Do the same with a few winchester cases.
39gr is aproaching the red zone and things like actual case capacity, primer, bullet, crimp and freebore have a compounding effect.
I dont trust hdong with their tables nor the cocnsistency of certain powders.

 

[meketrefe]

Dta

I think that makes sense. What's kind of confusing was the longer 115gr DTAC's were not doing this but the shorter Sierra's did. I'd have thought it would be reversed.

Dtacs need a 7 twist and longer freebore. They work best with the XC and the awesome 6x47 lapua chambers given the proper twist.

 

[Carlos Hathcock]

Dta

Dtacs need a 7 twist and longer freebore. They work best with the XC and the awesome 6x47 lapua chambers given the proper twist.

I heard so. I thought I'd give it a try to see for myself what the results would be. These were really purchased for my RPR, which are supposed to shoot quite well in it.

 

[meketrefe]

Vom

I heard so. I thought I'd give it a try to see for myself what the results would be. These were really purchased for my RPR, which are supposed to shoot quite well in it.

I do believe commercial rifles have 1:8 twist that is marginal. Rpr has 7.7 or correctme of Inam wrong. It is better but there is alot of varialility depending on pressure temp.speed and doatance. For dtacs at full range the way to go is 7.5 to assure stability in all ranges and conditions. I would say 3r and poly are among the best cuoices to help with torque and presure. You are normally talking about custom barreling jobs whether they are 243 match chamber or othwr of the less.powerful offspring from the 243(308) casing

 

[Carlos Hathcock]

Vom

I do believe commercial rifles have 1:8 twist that is marginal. Rpr has 7.7 or correctme of Inam wrong. It is better but there is alot of varialility depending on pressure temp.speed and doatance. For dtacs at full range the way to go is 7.5 to assure stability in all ranges and conditions. I would say 3r and poly are among the best cuoices to help with torque and presure. You are normally talking about custom barreling jobs whether they are 243 match chamber or othwr of the less.powerful offspring from the 243(308) casing

Yes, 7.7. Theres a vid on you tube on these and apparently they stabilize just fine. I'm going to be trying a couple different weights (105, 107) but I think 108 seems most popular.

I was curious about one thing though. Is the expander ball designed to size the neck after the die compresses it on the up stroke? I'd think that would be the case but what about with a bushing die where you "dial in" neck tension based on the die? Is the expander ball used more for new unfired brass?

 

[gun_slinger_boy]

I was curious about one thing though. Is the expander ball designed to size the neck after the die compresses it on the up stroke?

Never thought about this. On the downstroke the ball is in the case at the bottom of the stroke. On the upstroke the ball does make contact with the neck. I think it may just be for concentricity of the mouth if you have one that is bent? The way to test would be to size a piece of brass with the pin and one without then measure the mouth openings. I'm leaning towards concentricity since I know that you can load ammo sizing brass without the pin.