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Kzak305

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Hello all, I hope everyone is doing well considering the current political climate both locally and on a federal level.

im here seeking information which I never thought I’d need; my 33yr old son has lost his CCW. He was drinking and apparently said something in his state of inebriation that lead him to be taken to a local hospital and involuntarily committed as mentally unstable but released from the hospital the next morning (as I am told). He has turned his firearm in and just received the paperwork for appeal but he won’t be able to afford to meet their demands to appeal it currently. Which leads Le to seek information on how I go about legally purchasinghis handgun and having it transferred to my FFL for my possession. If anyone has any insight, I’d greatly appreciate it. It was his stupidity that cost him so I’m not going to pay for an attorney, and even if I did, I have no idea if he has went to far to ever get his permit back.
Thanks to everyone for any Information you may be able to provide me with. These times are trying for us all and I for one don’t have patience for stupidity. I’m quite upset with his actions to say the very least!

regards,
Karl
 
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Kzak305

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Maybe a lawyer eventually, but not now. Just need to settle the situation at hand. I have an FFL who is going to walk me through the process of rescuing the firearm. He is going to have to get his ducks in a row before he makes an attempt to get it reinstated. It sucks but life is about choices and choices have consequences- right?
 
Drinkthekoolaid

Drinkthekoolaid

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Karl,

Terribly sorry to hear this. Obviously we all wish your son well.

This is a major concern in the gun community that no one is willing to seek treatment for mental illness for fear of having their guns taken and of being unjustly red flagged having a right violated with no due process or clear path of recourse.

Please keep us informed perhaps we will be able to assist, and it's possible your son's experience may help others in the future.

Good luck.
 
Calculon

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Welcome and sorry to hear your son's situation. IANAL but there are times in life when we need to buck up and absorb some legal expenses and IMO this is one. The laws are very specific on these matters and any mistake or oversight on the part of the police or health care workers involved may get the case thrown out. Unfortunately our legal system is designed to require expertise and is not something the inexperienced should navigate alone especially in a state like NY that is hostile to 2A rights. Your son needs a good lawyer and he should do whatever it takes to get one (payment plan, sell assets, work 2 jobs, etc.). If you're able to help him out, do what you can and make him pay you back. If he takes the easy way out now due to money he may never be able to get his rights restored. Best of luck.
 
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Mk44

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I assume your son does not live with you (under the same roof).
(If he does live with you, they probably won't transfer his guns to you because your son can/may access to them.)

I suggest calling your FFL to get the details for the transfer.

In my county, we have to hire a licensed FFL that's willing to go to the Police property dept. to pick up the firearms (not all FFL's provide this service.) Once the firearms are in the FFL's possession, the FFL can then transfer them to you.
The firearms are still in your son's name. But the police is holding them. As far as purchasing the guns, any agreed $$ amount is between you and your son (you pay your son.)
The FFL is hired for his/her service: to pickup the guns from the police and handle the transfer.
 
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Criticalt

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Your FFL should be able to give you the correct process to acquire your sons guns.
As far as your son, hes an adult and will figure things out with his permit.
I understand your wanting to help him out but we are all responsible for our actions.
But like mentioned by others, tell your son to make sure the authorities followed the proper laws and protocols. Rarely do officials cross all their Ts and dot all their Is....leaving room for your son to get his permit back without an appeal.
 
Chevusa

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Maybe the focus should first be on getting your son the help he needs. Obviously there are issues there. I’d hate for something to happen to him. Who’s to say the next time he hits the bottle there won’t be an even worse episode? Keep your eye on the ball.
 
Darth

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Maybe I am confused, but why is an FFL needed?

A son and father can transfer firearms between themselves without an FFL. They just fill out the amendment paperwork.

Unless I am missing something?
 
dsdmmat

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Darth said:
I know from a personal similar experience that is untrue.

Are they referencing some imaginary law, or did something change?
Click to expand...
Darth said:
I know from a personal similar experience that is untrue.

Are they referencing some imaginary law, or did something change?
Click to expand...
They (the NYSP) just would not release my son’s guns to me. They took them to my dealer and I picked them up from there. That was the only way I could get them back.
 
Darth

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dsdmmat said:
They just would not release my son’s hubs to ne. They took them to my dealer and I picked them up from there. That was the only way I could get them back.
Click to expand...
In my case the person that added the removed pistols just had to get them added and pick up.
 
dsdmmat

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Darth said:
In my case the person that added the removed pistols just had to get them added and pick up.
Click to expand...
Yeah, these were long guns but, in my case 19 some odd years ago the NYSP wouldn’t even release my handguns to me. My buddy was holding on to my pistols under his badge while my license was in the process. He committed suicide and the NYSP took my guns and held onto them until my license came in. Then they transferred them to an FFL of my choosing for me to pick them up.
 
Darth

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dsdmmat said:
Yeah, these were long guns but, in my case 19 some odd years ago the NYSP wouldn’t even release my handguns to me. My buddy was holding on to my pistols under his badge while my license was in the process. He committed suicide and the NYSP took my guns and held onto them until my license came in. Then they transferred them to an FFL of my choosing for me to pick them up.
Click to expand...
Seems like gestapo being gestapo.
 
drowhawk

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A lawyer tried to tell me the other day you can keep your long guns if your PP is revoked. I thought you lost all guns if PP was revoked for any reason...

How does this work since long guns are not registered? What if you sold it out of state?
 
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HANK the CRANK

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drowhawk said:
A lawyer tried to tell me the other day you can keep your long guns if your PP is revoked. I thought you lost all guns if PP was revoked for any reason...

How does this work since long guns are not registered? What if you sold it out of state?
Click to expand...
I tend to agree with you.I was lead to believe if you lose PP you can no longer own long guns as per the Unsafe Act?
 
Cooolone

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33 yr old son lost his CCW? How so?... What automation mechanism caused this? Who involuntarily had him admitted and based on what criteria? It's completely subjective, and could be arbitrary and capricious even if issued by a judge. Of course, in the name of "Safety" Law and Constitution is completely disregarded and is why in these situations legal counsel is highly suggested!

As for co-owners of firearms with the other party having forfeiture if their property due to the other having legal issues... Ummmm, just no, not possible! And any attempt to do anything remotely similar to such action would require immediate and escalated legal action with prejudice! They don't even take cars from DUI's because someone else in the household uses the vehicle for work, etc. As noted, only sticky situation comes if the person under order resides in the same household and then is considered to have access, even if they're secured.

OP hasn't been back... So, we're left to wonder what's happening ;)
 
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Kzak305

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OP is back. Here is what I have done in the meantime.

-had my FFL go to the property office at the sheriff DEPT and was refused any possibility to take possession. I was told that is because my sons permit is suspended; not revoked so he still owns it.

-PP DEPT told me to have him write a letter asking the judge to allow him to legally dispose of the firearm currently on his ACTIVE but suspended permit. If the judge agrees then I can have my FFL pick it up with a signed receipt from my son.

-as for a lawyer; no way am I paying for a lawyer for his mistakes. He IS going through some difficulties between loosing his job and the pandemic, not being able to find gainful employment BUT he screwed up, plain and simple. I personally believe the correct actions were taken against his possession of a CCW. It is sad that even if he wanted to go for help with any mental struggles he may or may not be experiencing; his permit would’ve likely been in jeopardy anyways. I believe I have the correct process to take legal possession of the firearm but only time will tell.
He does not live at the same residence so I am not concerned about the relationship being a factor in the matter.
Times they are a’changin’!

thanks guys!
stay safe!
Shoot straight!
 
Criticalt

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Darth said:
Seems like gestapo being gestapo.
Click to expand...
Like most other states a pistol permit should be enough to for go the FFL.
I believe it used to be that way in NYS but I got my permit in 2014 so I dont know.
 
Criticalt

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HANK the CRANK said:
I tend to agree with you.I was lead to believe if you lose PP you can no longer own long guns as per the Unsafe Act?
Click to expand...
I have never read this in the law but I do have an anecdotal story.
A guy I know lost his Erie county pp due to an accident he caused while on his prescription medicine while carrying a pistol.
This is the way I was told so I dont want an argument please :) .....this is the very probable story.
Anyways, the EC sheriff took possession of his pistols but said his long guns were fine to keep.
Their explanation was that he didnt become disqualified from owning a gun.....but the issuing agent revoked his pistol permit due to driving and crashing on pain meds, anxiety meds and anti depressants.....:( This was about 4 years ago.
So im thinking that if you lose your permit for a crime that makes you unable to own a gun, then you lose permit and long guns. But if you just pissoff the issuing judge, he revokes it.
 
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