No Obama-care fix, GOP will lose seats

bobbyd3 · Mar 23, 2017

Trumps pretty much been a joke so far.
THats what we get when you are given your choice of 2 turds to eat.
But hey, we can keep our guns for at least 4 more years.

Hate to say it but if he keeps up doing what hes doing he will hand the entire government over to the democrats next election and we are screwed.

Criticalt · Mar 23, 2017

Its not over yet.
However, if the GOP keeps playing this all or nothing game, they will end up with nothing.

Calculon · Mar 24, 2017

The fix proposed was a band aid approach and would have completely let barry and the dems off the hook. Trump and repubs would then own the rising rates and ultimate failure of obamacare. The Dems wanted this to pass by a Repub majority so they could wash their hands of it.

I see 2 positives: 1) they can put in a real market based replacement as obamacare collapses under its own weight destroying barrys legacy legislation and leaving Dems responsible, and 2) RINO Ryan takes a black eye and Trump now now has leverage to neutralize/undermine him as speaker. This may well have been Trumps plan all along.

Midterms are 2 years away - Trump needs to focus on jobs, the economy and a real replacement.

Grimscale · Mar 24, 2017

Right now, the GOP is in a very bad position.
1) Pass this obnoxious P.O.S. replacement legislation and many of the Democrats that voted for Trump will vote Dem in the upcoming mid-term, thus ending the GOP super-majority.
2) Don't pass this, and many of the Republicans that voted for Trump might very well vote against the GOP in retaliation.

Their only saving option is if they come up with a valid plan that would actually maintain health care for everyone while lowering costs (and getting rid of that ridiculous 'fee' if you cannot afford health care).

prambo · Mar 24, 2017

Calculon said:
The fix proposed was a band aid approach and would have completely let barry and the dems off the hook. Trump and repubs would then own the rising rates and ultimate failure of obamacare. The Dems wanted this to pass by a Repub majority so they could wash their hands of it.

I see 2 positives: 1) they can put in a real market based replacement as obamacare collapses under its own weight destroying barrys legacy legislation and leaving Dems responsible, and 2) RINO Ryan takes a black eye and Trump now now has leverage to neutralize/undermine him as speaker. This may well have been Trumps plan all along.

Midterms are 2 years away - Trump needs to focus on jobs, the economy and a real replacement.

^^^^^^^
Exactly. Let Obamacare collapse - the POS pushed by Ryno was a cut-and-paste mess. I looked at it for about 10 minutes and gave up. They say it's a multi-step process to replace it. But you don't have to screw people over again in the process.

A few simple things would help people until a proper replacement can be put together - let people buy across state lines and buy from who they like.

Not a free-market favorite would be locking ALL medical costs, and rolling some things back. It's ludicrously expensive. Malpractice tort reform is needed to stop all frivolous lawsuits - like the clowns who advertise on TV.

prambo · Mar 24, 2017

From J.J. Sefton at Ace of Spades HQ -

"Good morning, kids. Before my computer dies I want to post this, sans artwork this morning. The big story is the President aligning with Paul Ryan and the GOP-e to force a vote on by any honest metric is a joke. I find it interesting that the same people who have been screaming for years about the sell-out traitors in the GOP are now complaining that the Freedom Caucus is grandstanding because they aren't getting 100% of what they want. Dear Lord, this is not a friggin' game to see who is swinging the biggest dick. We're talking about doing away with an evil edict that is the centerpiece of socialism that kills freedom, kills our economy and kills people. I voted for Donald Trump among other things to repeal this thing root and branch, not to suck up and appease the very people and forces he claimed to be fighting against. His ultimatum of take it or leave it is really, to be charitable, unacceptable to me and insulting. There's no defense of him hitching his wagon to this shit show and then railing against anyone who opposes him. I call it like I see it."

Ace of Spades HQ

MothMan · Mar 24, 2017

Maybe ya all would like Obama back? I could care less about health care being passed. During my adult life I know of no one that has been refused health care of some sort when it was needed. That's that Medicaid thingy.

This election was and is about slowing/stopping the entrenchment of socialism in the US. This will be accomplished by the placement of conservative justices in the courts. Not by listening/reading to keyboard/tv pundits and gnashing your teeth at every little thing. Breath people breath.

MilesTeg · Mar 24, 2017

bobbyd3 said:
Trumps pretty much been a joke so far.
THats what we get when you are given your choice of 2 turds to eat.
But hey, we can keep our guns for at least 4 more years.

Hate to say it but if he keeps up doing what hes doing he will hand the entire government over to the democrats next election and we are screwed.

Could you please expand on this because I have seen the opposite. He's moving at a lightning pace even with every imaginable road block thrown his way. I do think this legislation will be a milestone for the next few election cycles. So if the repub's get this wrong they will take a beating for a long time. We have a chance to prove our ideology works and befits the people and were on the edge of losing, all because the establishment is trying to stay in power.

Phazer · Mar 24, 2017

prambo said:
From J.J. Sefton at Ace of Spades HQ -

"Good morning, kids. Before my computer dies I want to post this, sans artwork this morning. The big story is the President aligning with Paul Ryan and the GOP-e to force a vote on by any honest metric is a joke. I find it interesting that the same people who have been screaming for years about the sell-out traitors in the GOP are now complaining that the Freedom Caucus is grandstanding because they aren't getting 100% of what they want. Dear Lord, this is not a friggin' game to see who is swinging the biggest dick. We're talking about doing away with an evil edict that is the centerpiece of socialism that kills freedom, kills our economy and kills people. I voted for Donald Trump among other things to repeal this thing root and branch, not to suck up and appease the very people and forces he claimed to be fighting against. His ultimatum of take it or leave it is really, to be charitable, unacceptable to me and insulting. There's no defense of him hitching his wagon to this shit show and then railing against anyone who opposes him. I call it like I see it."

Ace of Spades HQ

My sentiments exactly!

"Binary choice: For the bill or For Obamacare," says Ryan. BULLSHIT! That is complete crap, Senator Ryan.

I stand with the Freedom Caucus (read: the only Constitutional Conservatives in the whole damn Republican caucus). I want the Republican congress to do exactly what they promised: Repeal the Affordable Care Act and enact legislation the fixes our health care system with fiscally sound methods (competition through open markets, putting people with preexisting conditions into state-run high risk pools, treating 26-year olds like the premium-paying adults that they should be, allowing American citizens to select plans that they want with feature that they decide are best for them).

If people are poor, they can apply for Medicaid. If people are over 65 years of age, they qualify for Medicare. Stop destroying the system that should make healthcare affordable for the rest of the American citizenry. And, while you're at it, stop allowing illegal aliens to "buy into" our health insurance plans. They'll do nothing more than get credits and subsidies as handouts to secure their Democrat votes in the future. Nobody is being turned away from emergency rooms (see: EMTALA laws). So, no emergent care will ever be denied to anybody.

DO NOT simply prop-up and patch the Democrat disaster known as Obamacare. Patching the failing ACA with only Republican support will merely serve to transfer the Democrats' failure to the Republicans. Why do that? As the old adage goes: Do not murder a man that is in the process of committing suicide.

The person Trump should blame for this fiasco is Paul Ryan. It was Ryan and his establishment cabal that cobbled together a half-baked band-aid for Obamacare, ignored the Freedom Caucus' input, and worked in secret after having had 7 years to do something substantial. On this issue, Rand Paul is correct.

John Stark · Mar 24, 2017

Not a single Republican in the House or Senate voted for Obamacare when it passed, claiming it was not only bad for the health care "industry," but unconstitutional because it was forced association (First Amendment). They spent 8 years hammering these and many other points home.

The Republicans passed a relatively simple bill, a full-repeal of Obamacare, at least 6 different times while the Obamanation was in office... knowing he would veto it every time. Which he did.

They ran on this to get the House, then the Senate, then the White House from 2010 to now.

What exactly is stopping them this time around? They have the numbers in both the House and the Senate to pass that exact same bill that they had already debated and voted on numerous times. Did they lose the bill?

Anwser: They want their noses in the trough of health care, which is 1/6th of the American economy, just as much as the Ds do.

And they want to have control over all of us just as badly as the Ds do.

They are as derelict in their duties on this matter as they are in every other aspect of our lives that they seek to control, by force when necessary.

Government in the United States has become a theater of the absurd, window dressing to keep us from peeking behind the curtain and seeing just how corrupt and evil these people are.

These public displays are nothing more than a bouncing ball to keep our eyes moving away from their continued efforts to entrench themselves in more power and wealth, at our expense, pain, and ruin.

They get away with this kabuki theater, because we let them. The real decisions are made behind closed doors, without any real consideration for the American People and their Rights in the first place.

The American experiment has failed, because the American People are asleep at the chicken switch.

Deplorable Me · Mar 24, 2017

I would like to think, GOP people who can't fix the country get challenged and made insignificant in the GOP primaries. Keep in mind that's exactly how Trump got into the Whitehouse. His performance in the primaries set him up for the grand win.

Phazer · Mar 24, 2017

John Stark said:
Government in the United States has become a theater of the absurd

And the rhinoceros are certainly running wild in D.C.

Karpteach · Mar 24, 2017

Calculon said:
The fix proposed was a band aid approach and would have completely let barry and the dems off the hook. Trump and repubs would then own the rising rates and ultimate failure of obamacare. The Dems wanted this to pass by a Repub majority so they could wash their hands of it.

I see 2 positives: 1) they can put in a real market based replacement as obamacare collapses under its own weight destroying barrys legacy legislation and leaving Dems responsible, and 2) RINO Ryan takes a black eye and Trump now now has leverage to neutralize/undermine him as speaker. This may well have been Trumps plan all along.

Midterms are 2 years away - Trump needs to focus on jobs, the economy and a real replacement.

I think you hit it on the head with #2. Trump IMHO gets rid of Ryan with this Fiasco. He also knows that Obamacare is on the verge of imploding. Hopefully, he's played his cards right!!!

livingston · Mar 24, 2017

Health care is a sticky widget no matter who puts it in place. We have an ageing population that will demand the best care they can get. At the same time medical innovation pushes forward . That is great but expensive . Look at all the drugs being pushed at the public on TV alone . We as a population almost demand that new pill that will give us pain relief to say a 4 pain threshold level and that Tylenol will leave you at a say 5 pain level . .. Fine but at a cost of say $50-100/ month more for the new and improved pill . This is just an example . There are a thousand other examples dealing with our health care system. ... Could go on and on all day I am sure there is a lot of waste ... A lot of tests preformed just to cover a Doctors butt in a lawsuit that may come about. .
I will say what would be in a new bill should have been hammered out 5 years ago. .. Not created in the last few weeks and have everyone upset .

fartgamer · Mar 24, 2017

When the dems win they run the gov't.
When the dems lose they run the gov't.

fartgamer · Mar 24, 2017

Pubs should back up and let this turd fail, but they can't after running their mouths for 8 years.
The folks are hooked on "what's in it for me?" As soon as they lose a dime they'll revolt against the taker.
We're done, the dems win the battle of giveaways, no way to counter it, sadly.

Snappo · Mar 24, 2017

RDN said:
I voted for Trump mainly to protect the 2nd Amendment from H.Clinton's gun-grabbing agenda.
Secondly to protect our southern boards from illegals. (and to deport the bad ones that are here)
Thirdly to bring back jobs to US.

If the GOP can't fix Obamacare, that's on them. They ran on that agenda for 7 yrs. Trump ran on signing whatever bill GOP passed. Every year congressional House seats go up for election. And some Senate seats also.

If / when Gorsuch gets in, I'll be happy with that. Even more so if Gingsberg would just go away. - just saying

Ugh. I wanted Ovomitcare to be gone and replaced with something way more fiscally responsible. And now I have to watch Pelosi's shit eating grin on Fox news right now. Fuck I wish she would just die.

Snappo · Mar 24, 2017

fartgamer said:
Pubs should back up and let this turd fail, but they can't after running their mouths for 8 years.
The folks are hooked on "what's in it for me?" As soon as they lose a dime they'll revolt against the taker.
We're done, the dems win the battle of giveaways, no way to counter it, sadly.

That's not how I am reading it. Ovomitcare will explode. It will be de-funded, and there will be zero carriers interested in selling Ovomitcare insurance in any States. Then all the democraps in office will get replaced in elections. There are states that will not be covered this year, and next year there won't be any states with coverage.

fartgamer · Mar 24, 2017

Once it's "defunded" the blame will be on the defunders, watch.

Snappo · Mar 24, 2017

fartgamer said:
Once it's "defunded" the blame will be on the defunders, watch.

I kind of think the anger will be among people who had ACA and can no longer afford it, or in States where there isn't even one single insurance vendor willing to sell you a policy. And that will fall at the feet of the Dumbocraps. But you bring up a good point - those fake news outlets like CNN are gonna try and spin it as the fault of the GOP for not writing the $2 Trillion check to keep it running.

Jmac00 · Mar 24, 2017

bobbyd3 said:
Trumps pretty much been a joke so far.
THats what we get when you are given your choice of 2 turds to eat.
But hey, we can keep our guns for at least 4 more years.

Hate to say it but if he keeps up doing what hes doing he will hand the entire government over to the democrats next election and we are screwed.

not so fast, this is just a set back. I believe Trump moved to fast on Health care, he should have waited another 6 or 7 months when NObama Care premiums are even higher. This would have given him more time to put a better plan together.

and

If Trump can get the economy going and bring jobs back to America and give us a tax break, he has an excellent chance of being re-elected.

Gorsuch is pretty much a shoe in. Republicans are just going going to have to use the Democrats Nuclear option. the Democrats invented the nuke option and it's going to get used against them. I can't wait to hear schumer go into a melt down

Snappo · Mar 24, 2017

Jmac00 said:
not so fast, this is just a set back. I believe Trump moved to fast on Health care, he should have waited another 6 or 7 months when NObama Care premiums are even higher. This would have given him more time to put a better plan together.

and

If Trump can get the economy going and bring jobs back to America and give us a tax break, he has an excellent chance of being re-elected.

Gorsuch is pretty much a shoe in. Republicans are just going going to have to use the Democrats Nuclear option. the Democrats invented the nuke option and it's going to get used against them. I can't wait to hear schumer go into a melt down

Can't Congress put together a new healthcare bill any time they are in session? Tomorrow, 2 months from tomorrow, 6 months from tomorrow, etc?

What's the "nuclear option"?

kev74 · Mar 24, 2017

fartgamer said:
When the dems win they run the gov't.
When the dems lose they run the gov't.

You spelled ruin wrong.

fartgamer · Mar 24, 2017

The "nuclear option" is the Senate requiring 51 votes(or in case of a 50-50 tie, the VP would break that tie) instead of 60 to cut off a filibuster and get to a vote. The Pubs hold 52 seats in the Senate.

prambo · Mar 24, 2017

Calculon said:
The fix proposed was a band aid approach and would have completely let barry and the dems off the hook. Trump and repubs would then own the rising rates and ultimate failure of obamacare. The Dems wanted this to pass by a Repub majority so they could wash their hands of it.

I see 2 positives: 1) they can put in a real market based replacement as obamacare collapses under its own weight destroying barrys legacy legislation and leaving Dems responsible, and 2) RINO Ryan takes a black eye and Trump now now has leverage to neutralize/undermine him as speaker. This may well have been Trumps plan all along.

Midterms are 2 years away - Trump needs to focus on jobs, the economy and a real replacement.

Karpteach said:
I think you hit it on the head with #2. Trump IMHO gets rid of Ryan with this Fiasco. He also knows that Obamacare is on the verge of imploding. Hopefully, he's played his cards right!!!

Perhaps Trump was doing exactly as stated above - putting the shiv in Ryan. It's already being tossed about as a possibility -

Exclusive — Discussion About GOP Replacement to Paul Ryan as Speaker of the House Intensifies in White House, Congress - Breitbart

Health Care Bill's Failure: Just Part of the 'Art of the Deal' - Breitbart

fartgamer · Mar 24, 2017

Phazer said:
My sentiments exactly!

"Binary choice: For the bill or For Obamacare," says Ryan. BULLSHIT! That is complete crap, Senator Ryan.

I stand with the Freedom Caucus (read: the only Constitutional Conservatives in the whole damn Republican caucus). I want the Republican congress to do exactly what they promised: Repeal the Affordable Care Act and enact legislation the fixes our health care system with fiscally sound methods (competition through open markets, putting people with preexisting conditions into state-run high risk pools, treating 26-year olds like the premium-paying adults that they should be, allowing American citizens to select plans that they want with feature that they decide are best for them).

If people are poor, they can apply for Medicaid. If people are over 65 years of age, they qualify for Medicare. Stop destroying the system that should make healthcare affordable for the rest of the American citizenry. And, while you're at it, stop allowing illegal aliens to "buy into" our health insurance plans. They'll do nothing more than get credits and subsidies as handouts to secure their Democrat votes in the future. Nobody is being turned away from emergency rooms (see: EMTALA laws). So, no emergent care will ever be denied to anybody.

DO NOT simply prop-up and patch the Democrat disaster known as Obamacare. Patching the failing ACA with only Republican support will merely serve to transfer the Democrats' failure to the Republicans. Why do that? As the old adage goes: Do not murder a man that is in the process of committing suicide.

The person Trump should blame for this fiasco is Paul Ryan. It was Ryan and his establishment cabal that cobbled together a half-baked band-aid for Obamacare, ignored the Freedom Caucus' input, and worked in secret after having had 7 years to do something substantial. On this issue, Rand Paul is correct.

With the help of the media the Pubs will be blamed for any shortcomings in healthcare going foward, count on it. No matter the problem it now becomes a Pub problem.
Again, they should have just let the whole thing collapse. One fingerprint on this failed obummacare and it will be traced back to Trump and the Pubs.
The media is just itching to get this blame the Pubs thing going.

Defilade · Mar 24, 2017

The Dems will lose seats! They own this Obamacare and no working family is happy with it. Not one and it will get worse.. Not to mention their support for illegals with a open door policy. All I can say Dems is, Keep up the riots and protests and please keep wearing pussy earred hats! Your going to lose Bigly!

No Obama-care fix, GOP will lose seats

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