Off-duty Park Police officer fatally shoots fellow cop in ‘dry fire’ fiasco: Police

[diggs223]

Off-duty Park Police officer fatally shoots fellow cop in ‘dry fire’ fiasco: Police

Fairfax County police on Sunday arrested an off-duty U.S. Park Police officer who authorities said unintentionally shot and killed another off-duty Park Police officer while “dry firing” a gun in McLean.

m.washingtontimes.com

 

[repete]

But I thought only the police were trained and qualified to handle firearms?

 

[RedBreast21]

But I thought only the police were trained and qualified to handle firearms?

The truth is the police are no different than citizen shooters. You have those that are firearm enthusiasts and those that aren't. Two weeks at the academy and annual qualification does not make an expert. Even any additional classes required by the department doesn't. The answer is airsoft for force on force stuff. Very cheap and the airsoft firearms they have now, give the user the same manual of arms repetitions required to be somewhat proficient.

 

[ManualF150]

The truth is the police are no different than citizen shooters. You have those that are firearm enthusiasts and those that aren't. Two weeks at the academy and annual qualification does not make an expert. Even any additional classes required by the department doesn't. The answer is airsoft for force on force stuff. Very cheap and the airsoft firearms they have now, give the user the same manual of arms repetitions required to be somewhat proficient.

Back in the day, me and quite a few buddies would go to abandoned warehouses and do skirmishes on the weekends. Lots of fun and damn does it improve your skills.

Used to do paintball too. Got tired of that due to it being messy.

Airsoft is so much fun though.

 

[RedBreast21]

I had so many discussion about firearms training and the benefits paintball and now airsoft would bring to the training environment with LEO's but they just dismissed my point of view. This from a military tactical and firearms training background. Nothing was real enough for them except to actually have experience in an officer involved shooting. Which obviously no cadet could possibly go through. This bothered me for sometime until it became clear most officers are not firearms enthusiasts and would rather accept the false notion the public bestows upon them as firearms experts. Even shooters with excellent skill sets dismissed the value of airsoft. Of course LEO started using simunitions but that is expensive. Anyway, I brought my kids up using airsoft and coming from military style training system of crawl walk run, when in came time to use the real thing, it took 25 rounds of ammo to mitigate recoil. My opinion confrimed.

Then an old shooting buddy sent me this.

 

[Dr. Evil]

They should reach out to Baldwin's attorney.

 

[Xae289]

The truth is the police are no different than citizen shooters. You have those that are firearm enthusiasts and those that aren't. Two weeks at the academy and annual qualification does not make an expert. Even any additional classes required by the department doesn't. The answer is airsoft for force on force stuff. Very cheap and the airsoft firearms they have now, give the user the same manual of arms repetitions required to be somewhat proficient.

This is way beyond that though. It's poor weapons handling at the most basic level. Alcohol involved, pointing a weapon at someone else, failing to check that the weapon was unloaded, and "dry-firing" a loaded and ready firearm.

But I thought only the police were trained and qualified to handle firearms?

I love people who say that. It lets me immediately know that they don't know jack shit and should either be ignored or educated.

 

[Acer-m14]

Off-duty Park Police officer fatally shoots fellow cop in ‘dry fire’ fiasco: Police

Fairfax County police on Sunday arrested an off-duty U.S. Park Police officer who authorities said unintentionally shot and killed another off-duty Park Police officer while “dry firing” a gun in McLean.

m.washingtontimes.com

who was the Armor ?? was he or she on the training grounds .. was it her or his fault ..

so much for a dry fire training ..

 

[dsdmmat]

I had so many discussion about firearms training and the benefits paintball and now airsoft would bring to the training environment with LEO's but they just dismissed my point of view. This from a military tactical and firearms training background. Nothing was real enough for them except to actually have experience in an officer involved shooting. Which obviously no cadet could possibly go through. This bothered me for sometime until it became clear most officers are not firearms enthusiasts and would rather accept the false notion the public bestows upon them as firearms experts. Even shooters with excellent skill sets dismissed the value of airsoft. Of course LEO started using simunitions but that is expensive. Anyway, I brought my kids up using airsoft and coming from military style training system of crawl walk run, when in came time to use the real thing, it took 25 rounds of ammo to mitigate recoil. My opinion confrimed.

Then an old shooting buddy sent me this.

Paintball and air soft can be good training tools but, the negative habit transfer must be guarded against. In both games concealment is cover and that will be deadly on a two way range with live ammo.

 

[Grimscale]

it became clear most officers are not firearms enthusiasts and would rather accept the false notion the public bestows upon them as firearms experts.

I've seen, first hand, how arrogant some cops can be about their supposed "skills", only to laugh as they get completely pwnd by enthusiast "civilians". And that is only on static target shooting.
Nothing replaces actual repetitive practice.

I'd even go one step further and recommend airsoft for those who are having a hard time with flinching. The lower report and recoil will train their muscles to not flinch when shooting. Normally I would recommend a .22 for that, but airsoft would be cheaper and easier to acquire in the People's Republik of New Yorkistan.

 

[spat]

I had so many discussion about firearms training and the benefits paintball and now airsoft would bring to the training environment with LEO's but they just dismissed my point of view. This from a military tactical and firearms training background. Nothing was real enough for them except to actually have experience in an officer involved shooting. Which obviously no cadet could possibly go through. This bothered me for sometime until it became clear most officers are not firearms enthusiasts and would rather accept the false notion the public bestows upon them as firearms experts. Even shooters with excellent skill sets dismissed the value of airsoft. Of course LEO started using simunitions but that is expensive. Anyway, I brought my kids up using airsoft and coming from military style training system of crawl walk run, when in came time to use the real thing, it took 25 rounds of ammo to mitigate recoil. My opinion confrimed.

Then an old shooting buddy sent me this.

Most of the tactical concerns *aren't* "how do I shoot this gun better" anyway.

They are about movement, communication, and use of cover.

You could get valuable training just running around trying to snap pictures of each other with your cellphones.

 

[RedBreast21]

I've seen, first hand, how arrogant some cops can be about their supposed "skills", only to laugh as they get completely pwnd by enthusiast "civilians". And that is only on static target shooting.
Nothing replaces actual repetitive practice.

I'd even go one step further and recommend airsoft for those who are having a hard time with flinching. The lower report and recoil will train their muscles to not flinch when shooting. Normally I would recommend a .22 for that, but airsoft would be cheaper and easier to acquire in the People's Republik of New Yorkistan.

Yep. It's unfortunate. I have many friends in LE and have been on their ranges instructing my friends and as soon as the officers know I am not one of them, they many times stop shooting. I have witnessed some the the most egregious safety violations on these ranges. What surprises me the most is that the more proficient police shooters and firearm enthusiasts say nothing. There is a culture among them that is a brotherhood of sorts but at the same time a gang mentality. lol

Anyone wanting to put their training to the test only needs to put on a pair of shorts, no tee shirt, safety goggles and square off one on one with another person with two airsoft pistols. That shit will lay to rest 99% of the YouTube BS. lol

For those LEO's in the tactical end of things, switch up your CQB range. Install framed out walls and doors covered in paper to simulate sheet rock. Use airsoft rifles and pistols and go force on force. The walls and doors now represent real world conditions for concealment and not cover. Make noise before entry and I'm lighting you up through the walls and doors.

Time to get rid of the Hollywood BS. lol

 

[kev74]

But I thought only the police were trained and qualified to handle firearms?

 

[Beerman]

I vaguely remember a similar incident with two cops a few years ago. A guy and his girlfriend, both cops, screwing around off duty, he shot her dead.

 

[Zerex]

Not much different than a hunting accident...................we are all trained, but some are fools.

 

[Hillbilly77]

Ahh, an old classic.

 

[RedBreast21]

Most of the tactical concerns *aren't* "how do I shoot this gun better" anyway.

They are about movement, communication, and use of cover.

You could get valuable training just running around trying to snap pictures of each other with your cellphones.

Many people ignore footwork but weapon manipulation is very important. I'm old and the crawl walk run sequence started with sticks for me. You would be surprised the number of times people flag using them

Still folks don't understand cover vs concealment.

 

[ManualF150]

I use concealment like you are behind a window curtain. Cover is like I'm behind a very thick steel door. Pretty easy to memorize and retain even in a tough situation.

 

[repete]

This is way beyond that though. It's poor weapons handling at the most basic level. Alcohol involved, pointing a weapon at someone else, failing to check that the weapon was unloaded, and "dry-firing" a loaded and ready firearm.

I love people who say that. It lets me immediately know that they don't know jack shit and should either be ignored or educated.

You do know that was sarcastic, right?

 

[Acer-m14]

and they get exempt from all the gun laws ..

 

[Acer-m14]

my bathroom has bullet proof rice paper on the shoji doors

 

[Xae289]

You do know that was sarcastic, right?