Reloading manual's

[Robin]

Does anyone publish a manual with loads based on common AR barrel lengths and twist rate? My book lists for .223/5.56 a 24" barrel was used even thought the vast majority of rifles in the caliber are 16".
That equates to a 300 fps difference easily.
Robin

 

[dsdmmat]

When I get my stuff, I will look at my books. I think the Hornady book has a service rifle section.

 

[Target]

Hornady #9 does have a "Service Rifle" section . Lists barrel as 20" 1:9 twist . Gives data for 68gr-80gr bullets.

Lyman #49 lists a "universal reciver" at 24" & 1:12 twist and a AR15 at 20" & 1:7 twist as test rifles for their .223 loads.

 

[Xae289]

On Hodgdon's website, if you look under pistol data instead of rifle, they have load data for .223 tested from a 15" barrel. It's a 1:12 twist rate (who picks these stupid test barrels?), but velocity should be closer to what you'd get in a 16" carbine than the rifle data from a 24" test barrel.

 

[speedkills27]

Hornaday X has a service rifle section but I cant remember barrel length they used for testing

 

[kev74]

Time for a chronograph.

 

[tapper3]

On Hodgdon's website, if you look under pistol data instead of rifle, they have load data for .223 tested from a 15" barrel. It's a 1:12 twist rate (who picks these stupid test barrels?), but velocity should be closer to what you'd get in a 16" carbine than the rifle data from a 24" test barrel.

Would the twist rate make any difference? I'm clueless on stuff like this.

 

[Xae289]

Would the twist rate make any difference? I'm clueless on stuff like this.

Never looked into the twist rate effect on velocity, so I can't say. The only time I've paid attention to twist rate is in buying an AR because I wanted to get the same rate as the M16 & M4 use. Not for any special reason, mind you, just because at the time I wanted it to be as similar as possible to a rifle I was used to. The only thing I've retained from reading up on twist rate is that in 5.56, the faster rate does a better job of stabilizing heavier bullets. But I have no frame of reference, having only ever used 1:7 twist barrels. All I know is that 1:12 seems to be rare in ARs, which by now must be far away the most common rifle chambered in .223/5.56.

 

[Acer-m14]

i have no clue .. but were is the reloading manuals on Canons @Robin lol

 

[meketrefe]

No. They are useless. Length is only one factor.
What are you looking for specifically?

 

[Robin]

Would the twist rate make any difference? I'm clueless on stuff like this.

I don't know to what degree it would affect velocity but it would, twist rate does affect pressure. Everything affects everything and there are two questions to ask, To what degree(?), and , Is it positive or negative (?), to the situation at hand.
Robin

 

[Robin]

Time for a chronograph.

I do have one Kev. I usually work up a safe load, tweek it around if need be for accuracy, then time it. It would be nice to know what ball park I'm in when I start out though.
Robin

 

[kev74]

I do have one Kev. I usually work up a safe load, tweek it around if need be for accuracy, then time it. It would be nice to know what ball park I'm in when I start out though.
Robin

I think it's been a couple of years since I had mine out. Most of the loads I've worked up for accuracy tend to be closer to the start end of the range than the Max side, so I haven't bothered taking the time to check the velocities.

I probably should though - especially for some of the weaker pistol loads I run. Its discouraging when it takes 2 or 3 hits to knock down a steel popper at a match!

 

[meketrefe]

I don't know to what degree it would affect velocity but it would, twist rate does affect pressure. Everything affects everything and there are two questions to ask, To what degree(?), and , Is it positive or negative (?), to the situation at hand.
Robin

Everything affects pressure, speed, etc...

-Freebore & Actual chamber (Not all reamers are the same even for same advertised caliber. there are SAAMI reamers and then sometimes a huge selection of reamers that are compatible with the SAAMI spec depending on the caliber itself)
-The actual bore diameter. Sometimes from brand to brand, year to year and even batch to batch you might see some variations
specially if the "brand" rifle or even barrel supplier sources from different stock. .308 inches is not the same as .3078 as .3085.
- The rate of twist.
-The type of rifling.
-The type of alloy and finish. (Barrel makers have several different types like Shilen for example).
- Whether the bore was cleaned or not and what was used to clean it (including lapping if it was conditioned).
-The Powder, brand and batch/year.
-The brass used.
-The actual bullet brand and model.
-The temperature of the barrel and how the spreads were obtained.
-If you have a gas gun you have to include the size of the gas port and location. In many rifles this results in substracting anything from 100 to 200 fps depending on caliber and porting choice.

For example lets say you shoot a hpbt 75gr 5.56 on a 20" enfield rachet douglas barrel. the same everything with a different hpbt in the same price range might produce 100fps more. Also this hpbt loaded with a slight change in the chamber (also spec'ed out as 5.56) mith produce an extra 30fps on average. Then lets say instead of 5 rachet is a 3r wiht shallow grooves or a LW poly rifling and might add another 100fps.

..or the other way around you mimght be expecting X fps and you are shooting with an overgassed gas gun and you will see your speeds are 200fps lower than expected.

That is why the books are useless because they do not provide all the needed variables and it is hard to know until you go and do the testing.
Also how good is one's chrono? has it been tested against other chronos for accuracy. (they all give a % error).

Don't get me wrong, it is important to get a book specially for beginers (that can be found in libraries) and any books will give you and idea
an aproximation and potentialy safe starting loads. But they are also full or errors like the Lymans reloading manual so caution shoudl be used.

In any case, after knowing all the principals and having a decent method of reloading and testing all the basic reference information one
needs is out there and it is free from manufactures so no need to waste money on books.

..btw.. some ammo manufactures are kind to provide some average speed information of certain loads and what firearm was used to test them like sometimes Buffalo Bore, Grizzly and Double Tap do. From those one could reverse reengineer loads but not sure that is an efficient way
of development.

If you have a specific caliber, bullets and rifles in mind let us know and we might be able to provide more specific details.
I do keep a log of everything I test over the years commercial, reloads and wildcats so I might have some info you could use.

I hope this helps.

 

[tapper3]

I probably should though - especially for some of the weaker pistol loads I run. Its discouraging when it takes 2 or 3 hits to knock down a steel popper at a match!

Aahhh, don't worry about it. The RO's just have the poppers set heavy.

Unless you are shooting a .40 or .45.

Then, Jesus what a cheater !!!!!

 

[kev74]

Aahhh, don't worry about it. The RO's just have the poppers set heavy.

Unless you are shooting a .40 or .45.

Then, Jesus what a cheater !!!!!

I'm surprised some of the 9mm I used to shoot made it through the cardboard backer!

 

[tapper3]

^^^^^^ Yeah, that's a little light.

 

[Phauxtoe]

You can crunch data all day and never get to the shooting.
Do some research with your rifles specs in mind, load some and shoot it.

20” 1-7 223 wylde
Multiple sources said
24g of reloader 15 with a 77g Smk

off my backpack at 100yds
(2) 3 round groups 3/4” each

great starting point
Why reinvent the wheel?