Resizing and collet dies, do I use both?

[RooftopKorean]

I'm assuming that the answer is yes as the full-length sizing die removes spent primers, adjusts head space but both resize the neck; but the collet die strictly resizes the neck.

So do I need a collet if the resizing already does this function? Should I use the collet regardless after using the full-length sizing die?

 

[Carlos Hathcock]

Both neck size. Use one or the other. General consensus is full length is the better choice. There's two type of full length, bushing and non bushing. You can youtube to understand the differences and benefits.

 

[RooftopKorean]

Both neck size. Use one or the other. General consensus is full length is the better choice. There's two type of full length, bushing and non bushing. You can youtube to understand the differences and benefits.

Thanks.

 

[Darth]

You are jumping too far into the reloading deep end.

And I mean that it will suit you better if you learn why, and get experience before you talk about this higher level stuff like annealing or which way to resize.

Sometimes people use both, I do, but for different reasons.

Full length is a one stop shop, but it requires case lube and trimming and shortens brass life.

Neck sizing doesn't require lube or trimming, but after a few cycles the shoulder will need to be knocked back in a full length. It also will limit that brass to one rifle, until you full length resize again.

 

[repete]

^^ What he said!

 

[gun_slinger_boy]

You are jumping too far into the reloading deep end.

And I mean that it will suit you better if you learn why, and get experience before you talk about this higher level stuff like annealing or which way to resize.

Sometimes people use both, I do, but for different reasons.

Full length is a one stop shop, but it requires case lube and trimming and shortens brass life.

Neck sizing doesn't require lube or trimming, but after a few cycles the shoulder will need to be knocked back in a full length. It also will limit that brass to one rifle, until you full length resize again.

Is collet sizing intended for semi autos? I always thought collet sizing was meant more for bolt actions since you control the feeding into the chamber manually and there is less chance of something going wrong. From everything I've ever researched on this topic it seems like this is one of those things that some people recommend and others say does nothing over full length sizing. Some even say collet sizing is bad and FLS is the only way to go. If collet sizing actually does do something it leads me think that only the most meticulous, upper echelon long range shooters will really see a difference. In other words if you're just gonna be blasting targets at 50 yards you won't notice a difference.

 

[Darth]

Is collet sizing intended for semi autos? I always thought collet sizing was meant more for bolt actions since you control the feeding into the chamber manually and there is less chance of something going wrong. From everything I've ever researched on this topic it seems like this is one of those things that some people recommend and others say does nothing over full length sizing. Some even say collet sizing is bad and FLS is the only way to go. If collet sizing actually does do something it leads me think that only the most meticulous, upper echelon long range shooters will really see a difference. In other words if you're just gonna be blasting targets at 50 yards you won't notice a difference.

You pretty much always FL resize for semi.

Neck sizing is for those that want to prolong brass life, get (hypothetically) better accuracy as the case is already fire formed to the chamber, and do not want to size and trim if they are just using it in the same, non semi auto.

For me the big plus is not having to trim each time.

 

[gun_slinger_boy]

You pretty much always FL resize for semi.

Neck sizing is for those that want to prolong brass life, get (hypothetically) better accuracy as the case is already fire formed to the chamber, and do not want to size and trim if they are just using it in the same, non semi auto.

For me the big plus is not having to trim each time.

You've pretty much put everything I've researched about it here in a nutshell. I forgot about the not needing to trim part. I wonder if anyone could confirm the accuracy thing.

 

[meketrefe]

neck sizing is intended for brass to be used in the same gun it was fired from and to increase accuracy and extend brass life.
This is because a case that has been fired from that rifle has been fire-formed (conformed) to that very same chamber so
all that is left to do is to neck size given the brass is within spec from the 1st firing or prior brass trimming during preparation.
The collet system from Lee is a simple and inexpensive way to create consistent neck tension and little runout.
The brass should be turned 1/8 of a turn after the first pass and then with a 2nd pass the diameter will be precisely what is
dictated by the mandrel that came with the set. Lee has mandrels in small increments to adjust bullet tension.
The full length is recommended for hunting or with an auto-loader so we do not take any changes of having chambering
problems due to weather, chamber differences, small debris, etc...
For hunting I always slowly run my ammo through the gun to make sure they will chamber fine so I don't get a surprise at
the time of need. I also wax seal the primers and bullet base and put a slight crimp even w/o a cannelure.
Every time we full size bottle-necked cases we are pressing the shoulder and extending the case and that is why the case
might need to be trimmed back to spec and/or annealed to avoid splits. (depending on brass and caliber).
So that is why the neck sizing is used aside from accuracy considerations.

If your concern is accuracy let us know and will give you some other tips that are key for this type of use.

 

[RooftopKorean]

Thanks.

You are jumping too far into the reloading deep end.

And I mean that it will suit you better if you learn why, and get experience before you talk about this higher level stuff like annealing or which way to resize.

Sometimes people use both, I do, but for different reasons.

Full length is a one stop shop, but it requires case lube and trimming and shortens brass life.

Neck sizing doesn't require lube or trimming, but after a few cycles the shoulder will need to be knocked back in a full length. It also will limit that brass to one rifle, until you full length resize again.

I wasn't aware that asking questions to gain more information was a bad thing. The only reason I asked because my 6.5 Creedmoor die set came with one and the rest of the calibers I plan on reloading did not.

 

[RooftopKorean]

neck sizing is intended for brass to be used in the same gun it was fired from and to increase accuracy and extend brass life.
This is because a case that has been fired from that rifle has been fire-formed (conformed) to that very same chamber so
all that is left to do is to neck size given the brass is within spec from the 1st firing or prior brass trimming during preparation.
The collet system from Lee is a simple and inexpensive way to create consistent neck tension and little runout.
The brass should be turned 1/8 of a turn after the first pass and then with a 2nd pass the diameter will be precisely what is
dictated by the mandrel that came with the set. Lee has mandrels in small increments to adjust bullet tension.
The full length is recommended for hunting or with an auto-loader so we do not take any changes of having chambering
problems due to weather, chamber differences, small debris, etc...
For hunting I always slowly run my ammo through the gun to make sure they will chamber fine so I don't get a surprise at
the time of need. I also wax seal the primers and bullet base and put a slight crimp even w/o a cannelure.
Every time we full size bottle-necked cases we are pressing the shoulder and extending the case and that is why the case
might need to be trimmed back to spec and/or annealed to avoid splits. (depending on brass and caliber).
So that is why the neck sizing is used aside from accuracy considerations.

If your concern is accuracy let us know and will give you some other tips that are key for this type of use.

There was no concern regarding accuracy. I just wasn't 100% sure if it was interchangeable or required to have both done with the collet looked very similar to the full-length sizing die.

 

[Darth]

I wasn't aware that asking questions to gain more information was a bad thing. The only reason I asked because my 6.5 Creedmoor die set came with one and the rest of the calibers I plan on reloading did not.

I don't believe anybody said it was a bad thing. But I have seen your threads here recently and they are far too common with new reloaders. I know because I did the same thing when I started. Trying to learn it all, instead of the WHY behind each step will burn you out and make you have a weak foundation at the start. Things like annealing and neck vs. FL resizing are way down the road from the basics.

Hell, some people get so much info at once before making their first cartridge that it just becomes too much and they don't even end up loading at all and sell their stuff.

 

[RooftopKorean]

I don't believe anybody said it was a bad thing. But I have seen your threads here recently and they are far too common with new reloaders. I know because I did the same thing when I started. Trying to learn it all, instead of the WHY behind each step will burn you out and make you have a weak foundation at the start. Things like annealing and neck vs. FL resizing are way down the road from the basics.

Hell, some people get so much info at once before making their first cartridge that it just becomes too much and they don't even end up loading at all and sell their stuff.

Your logic is flawed. If someone makes mention of something such as annealing because it's not for a beginner I should ignore it? Should I not wonder why five of my six die sets didn't come with a collet?

Anything that's worth learning would never "burn" me out as you say. If I feel it's something that I need to learn about at the present time or something that I will file away in my head until I feel I need it is more of a logical approach.

 

[Darth]

Your logic is flawed. If someone makes mention of something such as annealing because it's not for a beginner I should ignore it? Should I not wonder why five of my six die sets didn't come with a collet?

Anything that's worth learning would never "burn" me out as you say. If I feel it's something that I need to learn about at the present time or something that I will file away in my head until I feel I need it is more of a logical approach.

You are welcome to learn the benefits of ogive bullet comparison right now if you want.

I wouldn't, but that's just 10+ years of reloading experience.

You seem to know what you need to be doing, so I'll let you get back to it.

 

[Acer-m14]

i don't know if i said this in one of your other thread so i will say it again just in case ..

when i was reloading for my 270win i did 2 different bullets ..

sierra game king soft point and hornady ( the ones with the plastic tip ) v-max i think .. same weight ..

two different bullet profiles ..

full sizing die used ..

got to the range and none of the hornady's would chamber in the savage bolt gun

wtf .. the bullet is skinny compared to the game kings .. wth fuck is going on ..

checking shit over .. hummm all the horaday loads are in remington brass ..

the fix .. 1/4 turn of the sizing die to kick the remington brass shoulder back just a bit more ..

i had a mix of brass , hornaday brass federal and rem .. just by chance the horaday bullets ended up in the rem brass

all the others chambered fine .

so if you run into this situation ... now you know ..

and on Die set with or with out the collect neck sizing die .. some just don't come with it .. when i got the 6.5 creed and the 243 win die sets for a
a Christmas gift i just happened to find the 4 die set when searching .. what that extra die for .. ahhhhh yes neck sizing just for that gun ..
so got that set for my friends .. will they ever use it .. no idea but they know what its for and have it just in case ..

how i learned about neck sizing ..

 

[RooftopKorean]

i don't know if i said this in one of your other thread so i will say it again just in case ..

when i was reloading for my 270win i did 2 different bullets ..

sierra game king soft point and hornady ( the ones with the plastic tip ) v-max i think .. same weight ..

two different bullet profiles ..

full sizing die used ..

got to the range and none of the hornady's would chamber in the savage bolt gun

wtf .. the bullet is skinny compared to the game kings .. wth fuck is going on ..

checking shit over .. hummm all the horaday loads are in remington brass ..

the fix .. 1/4 turn of the sizing die to kick the remington brass shoulder back just a bit more ..

i had a mix of brass , hornaday brass federal and rem .. just by chance the horaday bullets ended up in the rem brass

all the others chambered fine .

so if you run into this situation ... now you know ..

and on Die set with or with out the collect neck sizing die .. some just don't come with it .. when i got the 6.5 creed and the 243 win die sets for a
a Christmas gift i just happened to find the 4 die set when searching .. what that extra die for .. ahhhhh yes neck sizing just for that gun ..
so got that set for my friends .. will they ever use it .. no idea but they know what its for and have it just in case ..

how i learned about neck sizing ..

I'll be sure to keep my different brands of the same caliber brass separate. I didn't know that the brands would have differences.

 

[Acer-m14]

when your sizing different brass .. check each brand in your rifle to chamber before loading them all

i didn't either ..

 

[meketrefe]

the annealing is a must with high rate of case volume to bore ratio and specially if you value brass.
Lapua is expensive but it is also the 'most affordable' because I have reloaded 308 up to 30-40 times.
But because is good brass it requires some attention so it will last. All those are things to both
save money but also get a better overal experience and value. (more accuracy).

with the 6BR, 6.5BR I cannot afford not to anneal. Lapua and norma brass is expensive and it needs this step.
with the 6x47, 243, 260, creed, ... same thing.

 

[Acer-m14]

@meketrefe what do you use for annealing ??

I have seen this and looks pretty neat for the process ..