short barreled uppers

[stuck in ny]

Is there any way to own a short upper without a PP in ny?
I was wondering if there was any obscure way that this might be allowed, like spade grips or something.

 

[Cavalry]

I assume we are talking about an AR upper?

Its just parts and is not regulated. You can buy as many as you can afford in any configuration you want and and have them delivered to your door. Putting that upper on a lower without the correct paperwork is where it becomes a completed gun/firearm. I do not believe NY has constructive intent but having a completed short upper and a completed lower that are separated and have no other mates is probably not the best combinations to have.

To answer your other question, yes if you have a gun that is defined as a "firearm" by federal standards then yes you can have a short barrel without it being a pistol or SBR. Its up to you to decide if its scary enough looking that the average LEO is going to confiscate it thinking its illegal and you will need to pay far in excess of its value to get it back.

 

[Darth]

AR pistol.

Fix the mag.

 

[Marine Cpl]

Then there is this. It's neither a pistol nor a rifle.

Franklin Armory's New AR-15 Is Neither A Pistol Nor A Rifle And No NFA Paperwork Required - The Truth About Guns

 

[PartyHardyMarty]

That would still need to be on a pistol permit in ny wouldn't it? I like it though great job Franklin armory!

 

[Marine Cpl]

That would still need to be on a pistol permit in ny wouldn't it? I like it though great job Franklin armory!

There is disagreement on that. I say no because it isn't a pistol.

 

[Acer-m14]

this is why we should have no gun laws .. only laws when you use a gun in a bad moral manner ..

thou shall not Kill unless being attacked
thou shall protect the neighbors hot wife or GF

 

[PartyHardyMarty]

I was not able to find the definition of a pistol in NYS's penal code.. it defines shotguns and rifles well enough, but simple refers to pistols and revolvers. At least where i was looking.

Is there a part of NYS law that talks about weapons that aren't otherwise defined?

 

[Marine Cpl]

I was not able to find the definition of a pistol in NYS's penal code.. it defines shotguns and rifles well enough, but simple refers to pistols and revolvers. At least where i was looking.

Is there a part of NYS law that talks about weapons that aren't otherwise defined?

Nope. There is no definition for all other firearms. That's why there is a debate on the matter on the firearm linked above. It isn't a rifle or shotgun as per NYS definition.

Since there is no definition for a pistol, who knows? As per the ATF however, it isn't a pistol, shotgun, or rifle. All that it is considered is a generic firearm.

The kicker is that in NY, all firearms are illegal as per Penal Law 265 unless exempted. Rifles and shotguns aren't considered firearms unless they have short barrels. Stupid right? You can be exempted by either being in the military under performance of ones duties, a law enforcement officer, or a pistol license holder. A pistol licence holder would be exempted for the firearms he carries. (Pistols and revolvers)

Since this generic firearm is neither a pistol nor a rifle, how can you get an exemption from Penal Law 265? You can't legally as a regular citizen.

 

[Airborneguy]

There was a whole thread on this just recently. It's not legal. "Firearms" are illegal in NYS. And I don't know about upstate, but down here cops can't have that either.

 

[PartyHardyMarty]

Lol nys.. pathetic smh..

 

[DrBleachCocktail]

I assume we are talking about an AR upper?

Its just parts and is not regulated. You can buy as many as you can afford in any configuration you want and and have them delivered to your door. Putting that upper on a lower without the correct paperwork is where it becomes a completed gun/firearm. I do not believe NY has constructive intent but having a completed short upper and a completed lower that are separated and have no other mates is probably not the best combinations to have.

To answer your other question, yes if you have a gun that is defined as a "firearm" by federal standards then yes you can have a short barrel without it being a pistol or SBR. Its up to you to decide if its scary enough looking that the average LEO is going to confiscate it thinking its illegal and you will need to pay far in excess of its value to get it back.

So owning a short upper is legal as long as you don’t assemble it with a lower?

 

[BDinPutnam]

So owning a short upper is legal as long as you don’t assemble it with a lower?

 

[Cavalry]

So owning a short upper is legal as long as you don’t assemble it with a lower?

Holy post dig.
Absolutely. One can have a pile of 7" uppers and no "pistol" lower. Me personally, I would not have a rifle lower without a rifle upper assembled if I was going to have a short barreled upper floating around.

 

[dsdmmat]

Holy post dig.
Absolutely. One can have a pile of 7" uppers and no "pistol" lower. Me personally, I would not have a rifle lower without a rifle upper assembled if I was going to have a short barreled upper floating around.

To add to above. If you Only have a pistol upper and a rifle lower the ATF has a constructive possession rule under the NFA they will charge you with if it came to that. If you have all the parts to build a pistol ( lower, buffer, blade, parts kit and upper) you would be fine and NY state does not have a constructive possession law.

 

[gun_slinger_boy]

Zombie resurrection. Neither an upper or a lower on an AR is a firearm. It's the truth. Only when you put them together is it a firearm. But the question is are you willing to risk it. #stillhappynotinNY

 

[DrBleachCocktail]

Zombie resurrection. Neither an upper or a lower on an AR is a firearm. It's the truth. Only when you put them together is it a firearm. But the question is are you willing to risk it. #stillhappynotinNY

Okay I have 2 questions.
1) If a complete lower separately is not a firearm in NY I can own a lower receiver that accept a detachable magazine as long as in NY it’s not assembled to an upper?

Holy post dig.
Absolutely. One can have a pile of 7" uppers and no "pistol" lower. Me personally, I would not have a rifle lower without a rifle upper assembled if I was going to have a short barreled upper floating around.

2) Why not just get a “Other” lower receiver slap a 10.5 inch barrel with a VFG, Pistol brace and 26.5 in length and have a legal NY other? Knowing NY I’ll just keep it separately until I travel out of state Since a lower and a upper together is not a firearm and please correct me if I’m wrong.

 

[gun_slinger_boy]

Okay I have 2 questions.
1) If a complete lower separately is not a firearm in NY I can own a lower receiver that accept a detachable magazine as long as in NY it’s not assembled to an upper?

The AR lower not being a firearm isn't an established thing. So disregard that. I was just pointing out that per the ATF's rules it's not a firearm. But it's still considered one and has been for decades. It's just never been challenged. So forget I said that completely! I'll let someone else explain the whole receiver as a pistol or rifle thing. I honestly don't care to.

 

[Cavalry]

Okay I have 2 questions.
1) If a complete lower separately is not a firearm in NY I can own a lower receiver that accept a detachable magazine as long as in NY it’s not assembled to an upper?


2) Why not just get a “Other” lower receiver slap a 10.5 inch barrel with a VFG, Pistol brace and 26.5 in length and have a legal NY other? Knowing NY I’ll just keep it separately until I travel out of state Since a lower and a upper together is not a firearm and please correct me if I’m wrong.

Yes to both federally (in free America) and possibly state, but do you want to be a test case?