Supreme Court strikes down Biden student loan forgiveness

[Rocpo]

It’s not just the colleges themselves, in many cases it’s well meaning but misinformed parents. One of my sons friends didn’t want to go to college and his parents said it was college or he’d be kicked out and would “end up a ditch digger”. I’ve heard similar from other parents I know.

The issue is that a high school diploma doesn’t mean as much in this country as it used to. My parents generation didn’t need a college diploma to provide for a family but nowadays unless you go into a trade, you do.

That's their own fault for being close minded. I should not be on the hook because their offspring chose to appease them.

 

[MikeM]

^^^^^
This

My kids went to expensive schools knowing that if they didn't stick with their major or changed to one that wouldn't let them pay their loans, they would have to switch to a cheaper school.

The best thing to do is show them an amortization schedule. It was an eye opener when he planned on borrowing about 180 k and he saw that he would have to pay back 330 k.

 

[ManualF150]

^^^^^
This

My kids went to expensive schools knowing that if they didn't stick with their major or changed to one that wouldn't let them pay their loans, they would have to switch to a cheaper school.

The best thing to do is show them an amortization schedule. It was an eye opener when he planned on borrowing about 180 k and he saw that he would have to pay back 330 k.

They don't teach kids in high school basic home/personal finances. They don't even know what an loan amortization schedule is.

I learned this in Home Ec and went over it again in math class...

Kids in school think money grows on trees that same way their own school gets expensive shit. Unlimited budget funded by everyone else.

In my eyes, forgiving loans is bad not only for the economy, but sets an example.

 

[spat]

It’s not just the colleges themselves, in many cases it’s well meaning but misinformed parents. One of my sons friends didn’t want to go to college and his parents said it was college or he’d be kicked out and would “end up a ditch digger”. I’ve heard similar from other parents I know.

The issue is that a high school diploma doesn’t mean as much in this country as it used to. My parents generation didn’t need a college diploma to provide for a family but nowadays unless you go into a trade, you do.

Someone should have shown him how much a ditch digger (heavy equipment operator) makes these days. It's more than half the PHD's out there.

The higher education scam has been so successful that skilled trades are frequently a better option.

 

[repete]

"The minimum payments in many cases are less than the interest charges so as you pay your balance owed actually goes up."
That was one of the things that jumped out at me, Why would anyone agree to that? I mean these are supposedly smart people so they should know to read the contract and should understand most of it. I just don't understand, guess I'm not smart enough to go to collage!

 

[ManualF150]

"The minimum payments in many cases are less than the interest charges so as you pay your balance owed actually goes up."
That was one of the things that jumped out at me, Why would anyone agree to that? I mean these are supposedly smart people so they should know to read the contract and should understand most of it. I just don't understand, guess I'm not smart enough to go to collage!

It's the same ones when they go to the car dealer and don't negotiate. They just take it up the butt and sign it off. It's a lost talent with these youths.......

 

[SonOfSun]

The solution is to put things back on the colleges.

They are the ones in a position to determine who will be able to make use of what degree.

They are also the ones that are really taking advantage of the kids. The banks are just accomplices.

Let the kids with the $200k worthless degree sue the colleges (with punitive damages) and you'll see the prices of the degrees drop back where they belong. You'll see the fundamentally worthless degrees disappear altogether.

I think putting things on the college is part of it, but only a small part. If they are promising unrealistic outcomes then they should be responsible for that as false advertising, but that's really about as far as it should go.

I really think that making loans dischargeable AND the government no longer providing college loans would solve it. If it was only private lenders giving out loans that could be reduced/eliminated via bankruptcy you'd see sanity return to tuition prices and course offerings overnight. Most people wont do what i did, so if there was no money for "basketweaving" type degrees they would immediately disappear since no sane lender would take that risk. No money for those degrees = no students for those degrees = no professors for those degrees, etc. That would also have the benefit of getting rid of unnecessary and wasteful government beaucracy by being private only.

 

[SonOfSun]

^^^^^
This

My kids went to expensive schools knowing that if they didn't stick with their major or changed to one that wouldn't let them pay their loans, they would have to switch to a cheaper school.

The best thing to do is show them an amortization schedule. It was an eye opener when he planned on borrowing about 180 k and he saw that he would have to pay back 330 k.

You're not wrong. However most people are far far too stupid to do that. I bet 70% of people don't even know what an amortization schedule is. I bet a lot of people think interest and principal are paid off evenly throughout the loan. People are fucking dumb.

 

[ManualF150]

You're not wrong. However most people are far far too stupid to do that. I bet 70% of people don't even know what an amortization schedule is. I bet a lot of people think interest and principal are paid off evenly throughout the loan. People are fucking dumb.

Also they don't read the fine print between fixed APR and variable APR... they don't have a clue how that could potentially jeopardize their living.

 

[Acer-m14]

You're not wrong. However most people are far far too stupid to do that. I bet 70% of people don't even know what an amortization schedule is. I bet a lot of people think interest and principal are paid off evenly throughout the loan. People are fucking dumb.

any time i have the extra cash .. i can walk into the bank .. here is 500.00 to put on the principal of my personal loan ( for the new to me used car)

doing that every few months can take your 5 yr loan and have it payed off in 2yrs and your saving $$$$$$$

 

[Saltwater60]

Idk, I'm sort of in the middle and I don't see these rulings as bad things, in fact I agree with the rulings. Loans are loans, not gifts. Even if they weren't, the president shouldn't have unilateral authority to just forgive money owed to the federal govt. That type of action requires legislation.

I agree and don’t support broad scale student loan forgiveness. All I said is this will give the left more ammo to gripe about how the court is set up currently. I also believe it may impact the outcome of the elections moving forward since the left will surely use it against the right. The right is t doing well in the long game and this is another thing to add to that is all I’m saying.
My wife and son both may have potentially gotten money out of this and I agree it should not have been done. This will have an impact on the economy moving forward and people will lose homes and cars over this and the left will blame the right for it. People took their student loan money and bought houses and cars with it. Many also refinanced their loans and are now paying more than they were before this because they are now in income driven plans.
INO If people were promised forgiveness and they refinanced to a higher payment they should be able to return to the cheaper payment if their loans were not forgiven.

 

[Deplorable Me]

Loan forgiveness or vote buying scheme?

 

[Saltwater60]

You’re assuming a few things here. One, we live nowhere close to an urban area. My son cannot drive to any school with a CPA program, so he will have to dorm which significantly raises costs, to about 24,000 per year in fact.

You’re assuming a 30 hour work week as well. Ha! Fat chance getting anything close to those hours these days at a fast food joint. He works forty hours here in the summer but near campus the best he can find is 20hrs a week because of his class schedule.

I take your point that if you worked essentially a full time job while going to school and spend your money on virtually nothing else then you *just might* be able to eke it out, but he will be a full time student in a demanding program. I’ve made it clear to him that academics come first. Criticize me all you want for that but it will be no good if he spends that money on tuition only to flunk out because he’s exhausted with no time to study.

I know my son is a hard worker who will pay back his loans and has made responsible decisions, but it should not be this difficult in this county for our youth to get an education. The fact is that tuition can and should be lower, and interest rates on federal student loans need to be lowered and capped as well. The system is broken and it is our children who are suffering.

We’re in the same boat as you are except my son does not have to from and we are very grateful for that. He has been able to only work very limited amounts up until this point because of how much time he has to put I t studying. He’s only been able to work one 4-hour shift per week. Colleges do not make the schedule easy or accommodating for working students these days. My son has switched to an easier program so hopefully he can work 8-12 hours this coming semester or next but I do t know his schedule will even accommodate that.
I was able to work and pay my college as I went but my college set up a schedule for that but that seems to not happen these days anymore.

 

[Saltwater60]

College tuition is what it is because of wasteful spending on the colleges part. My son is going to UB and we toured the college with him and their biggest claim to fame was they had just spent a ton of money on a new state-of-the-art video gaming center for competitive gaming sports. I thought to myself really, how is this a good thing? Oh but kids can’t skip class and go there because their key card knows when they should be in class so it’s great right? Another college by me built a stone wall 3 feet high all the way around campus because they had money to burn. A friend went to Princeton and said they have enough in their endowment to give free tuition to all students but won’t. They will redo dorms or do other stupid shit with the money though for sure. This is the problem and it doesn’t cost that much for people to attend college.
My son is doing a research project and said the professor he’s working under spent a boatload of money and thinks he bought a $60,000 microscope for the project alone, paying my son and another guy $15/hour at 30 hours a week total, not each and then wanted a van to transport the kids so they didn’t have to drive two cars. This guy was cut off and is then leaving at the end of this semester. All this money spent and the project will never be finished and the project was useless to begin with but hey my son is getting $300 paychecks and getting experience so for him it’s good.

 

[spat]

College tuition is what it is because of wasteful spending on the colleges part. My son is going to UB and we toured the college with him and their biggest claim to fame was they had just spent a ton of money on a new state-of-the-art video gaming center for competitive gaming sports. I thought to myself really, how is this a good thing? Oh but kids can’t skip class and go there because their key card knows when they should be in class so it’s great right? Another college by me built a stone wall 3 feet high all the way around campus because they had money to burn. A friend went to Princeton and said they have enough in their endowment to give free tuition to all students but won’t. They will redo dorms or do other stupid shit with the money though for sure. This is the problem and it doesn’t cost that much for people to attend college.
My son is doing a research project and said the professor he’s working under spent a boatload of money and thinks he bought a $60,000 microscope for the project alone, paying my son and another guy $15/hour at 30 hours a week total, not each and then wanted a van to transport the kids so they didn’t have to drive two cars. This guy was cut off and is then leaving at the end of this semester. All this money spent and the project will never be finished and the project was useless to begin with but hey my son is getting $300 paychecks and getting experience so for him it’s good.

The cost of education has skyrocketed at several times the rate of inflation for decades.

The reason is obvious. It's all the money the government has dumped into it.

If you think something is expensive, wait until it's "free".

 

[rushmore]

We’re in the same boat as you are except my son does not have to from and we are very grateful for that. He has been able to only work very limited amounts up until this point because of how much time he has to put I t studying. He’s only been able to work one 4-hour shift per week. Colleges do not make the schedule easy or accommodating for working students these days. My son has switched to an easier program so hopefully he can work 8-12 hours this coming semester or next but I do t know his schedule will even accommodate that.
I was able to work and pay my college as I went but my college set up a schedule for that but that seems to not happen these days anymore.

That certainly is something to be grateful for that you son doesn’t have to dorm. While we love living as rural as we do, it has its downsides sometimes.

You’re not kidding about how hard colleges make it to accommodate a job while in school, at least for freshman year. Sophomore year it looks like he may be able to take some online courses that will free up his schedule some, we will see.

 

[Saltwater60]

The cost of education has skyrocketed at several times the rate of inflation for decades.

The reason is obvious. It's all the money the government has dumped into it.

If you think something is expensive, wait until it's "free".

Maybe but I see a lot of waisted money on stupid shit. Look at all the dorms UB has built by me and they are very, very nice. They are now redoing the old dorms as well and shutting more down. They have a housing shortage in the area for the college students and I know a lady with an Airbnb that charges $1,300/month for a room rental for the college. That’s just crazy money for the room.
UB has constant shuttles running to get kids around and while it’s nice I didn’t know college tuition included transportation.

 

[rushmore]

You dont need to live in an urban area. You dont need to stay in a dorm and pay extortion rates. I lived in a 4 bedroom upper flat in North Buffalo. Rent and all utilities was about 320 a month when split 4 ways. I moved to walking distance of campus. I didn't say it was easy.. that's the whole point. Life isn't always easy, but some sacrifices pay off in the long run. It's hard but it can be done - I know this for a fact because I did it.

It sucked, but do you know what sucks worse? 40k+ of college debt because you want to go to school the "easy" way.

If I can do it anyone can. You just have to have the desire and will. There was nothing required skill wise except the will to endure the suck.

The closest four year college to us is almost 2 hours away through rugged mountainous terrain. If there was a way we could make it work without dorming, we would. But I don’t want him driving alone 4+ hours a day, on top of studying and working. Not to mention how treacherous those roads can be in the winter, even for experienced drivers with brand new cars. My wife would be worried sick.

 

[rushmore]

College tuition is what it is because of wasteful spending on the colleges part. My son is going to UB and we toured the college with him and their biggest claim to fame was they had just spent a ton of money on a new state-of-the-art video gaming center for competitive gaming sports. I thought to myself really, how is this a good thing? Oh but kids can’t skip class and go there because their key card knows when they should be in class so it’s great right? Another college by me built a stone wall 3 feet high all the way around campus because they had money to burn. A friend went to Princeton and said they have enough in their endowment to give free tuition to all students but won’t. They will redo dorms or do other stupid shit with the money though for sure. This is the problem and it doesn’t cost that much for people to attend college.
My son is doing a research project and said the professor he’s working under spent a boatload of money and thinks he bought a $60,000 microscope for the project alone, paying my son and another guy $15/hour at 30 hours a week total, not each and then wanted a van to transport the kids so they didn’t have to drive two cars. This guy was cut off and is then leaving at the end of this semester. All this money spent and the project will never be finished and the project was useless to begin with but hey my son is getting $300 paychecks and getting experience so for him it’s good.

UB built that to attract a larger portion of their (already) growing population of foreign students. Competitive gaming is HUGE in Asia. Personally I think UB should focus more on their students in Buffalo.

 

[SonOfSun]

The closest four year college to us is almost 2 hours away through rugged mountainous terrain. If there was a way we could make it work without dorming, we would. But I don’t want him driving alone 4+ hours a day, on top of studying and working. Not to mention how treacherous those roads can be in the winter, even for experienced drivers with brand new cars. My wife would be worried sick.

You and your wife don't need to move. He can. I shared an apartment with 3 other people to make it affordable. We each had our own bedroom and shared the kitchen, bathrooms, and living room. Yes it's a cost.... but so is a car. I lived within walking distance of the college.. so I saved the car cost and applied it to the housing cost, they were roughly equal (a bit over $300 for the apartment and utilities). Find an apartment close to his school and ditch the car. If he really needs to get somewhere on occasion he can get a bike or take an uber (wasn't around back then for me).

Edit: I see you talking about UB, that's where I went. Lived in an apartment on Lisbon Ave on main street by thr campus.

 

[rushmore]

You and your wife don't need to move. He can. I shared an apartment with 3 other people to make it affordable. We each had our own bedroom and shared the kitchen, bathrooms, and living room. Yes it's a cost.... but so is a car. I lived within walking distance of the college.. so I saved the car cost and applied it to the housing cost, they were roughly equal (a bit over $300 for the apartment and utilities). Find an apartment close to his school and ditch the car. If he really needs to get somewhere on occasion he can get a bike or take an uber (wasn't around back then for me).

Edit: I see you talking about UB, that's where I went. Lived in an apartment on Lisbon Ave on main street by thr campus.

I went to UB back in the day, and one of my nieces is enrolled currently. I now live upstate.

My son will be attending Brockport, which has a policy for incoming students that they dorm the first two years, unless they are local. It would be tough for him to find roommates anyways as he hasn’t met anyone yet, hopefully by junior year he’ll have made friends and they can move off campus.

 

[dwa12479]

Lets also not lose sight of what this case was REALLY about. The content (student loan debt forgiveness) is not what was really the debate. The case was solely about Executive overreach. It was about a President making a decree that he had NO POWER in which to do so. Only Congress has the authority in this matter. If the bill was property written and voted on by Congress, then it's the law of the land.

 

[spat]

Maybe but I see a lot of waisted money on stupid shit. Look at all the dorms UB has built by me and they are very, very nice. They are now redoing the old dorms as well and shutting more down. They have a housing shortage in the area for the college students and I know a lady with an Airbnb that charges $1,300/month for a room rental for the college. That’s just crazy money for the room.
UB has constant shuttles running to get kids around and while it’s nice I didn’t know college tuition included transportation.

Right, but that is just a symptom.

The cause is the fire hose of money the government has unleashed.

The spending you are talking about are just attempts by the administration to spend the money.

The more they spend, the more they can justify.

 

[Acer-m14]

which has a policy for incoming students that they dorm the first two years, unless they are local.

 

[rushmore]

I’m so glad it’s funny to you.

 

[Acer-m14]

I’m so glad it’s funny to you.

u miss the point ..

good thing he is not a exchange student .,,, per policy you can't live with your host family ..

we need more of your money .. its dorm life for you ..