The story of a flintlock from the 1700's

[Pissed Off Patriot]

I picked this up a while back, in 2017. It was sold as a "1700's blunderbluss" wall hanger, though I seriously doubt it was ever a true blunderbuss, even if the flared end was cut off in the distant past. I believe it originally started out as a "fowler" from the 1700's, which is pretty much the same thing as a shotgun.

I never planned to shoot it, as it appeared to have a couple of issues. One issue was the end of the cut down barrel that looked as though it had been used as a battering ram at one time. The inside looked like it had some pitting, so I wasn't comfortable about the overall condition.

Then there was the lock itself, which was not sitting flush with the stock at the rear, and the wood was damaged.

Regardless, it still intrigued me as a piece that I could hang over the fireplace.

As I mentioned before, the barrel had been cut down. Obviously a very very long time ago, based on the patina. The barrel now measures 15 7/8", and with an overall length of the gun at approx. 31 1/2". They also apparently added a bead sight.

Some more pics, in no particular order.

The butt plate overhangs the stock at the bottom, as if the stock was cut down a little, or the gun was cobbled together from various parts.

Then last year, I put some serious effort into trying to take it apart. Most of the screws I could never get out, even after hours of work. In fact the only part I could get off was the lock itself. That's when i found out why the lock was not sitting flush with the stock. One of the screws had backed out, and was preventing the lock from going all the way into the stock.

I scraped out years of crud from the lock, and put it back together. Fixed! The lock sits nice and flush in the stock now.

Finally, I manufactured an appropriately short ramrod for it, as it didn't have one, and stained and aged it to match as closely as I could. Not too shabby for a first try.

I think I will actually try and shoot this old thing sometime this spring. I managed to obtain a small quantity of black powder. I'm not going to bother with anything resembling a full load. It will be a light load, and I doubt I'll even bother with any shot. I'll strap it to a tire and use a string for the first test. It does need a new flint.

I think I'll bring it the the Albany Gun Show this Saturday the 26th and source a flint there.

 

[Pissed Off Patriot]

Oh yeah, it's impossible to know why the barrel was cut down, but it's fun to imagine.

Perhaps the barrel simply got damaged. Or maybe it was used as a stagecoach gun, or behind the bar at a rowdy saloon. Or perhaps it was our nations very first "Bubba" from 200 years ago, making a home defense gun. It's possibly even old enough that it could have been used against Redcoats in the Revolutionary War. If only it could talk.

 

[BDinPutnam]

Nicely done. I assume no proof-marks or anything you can find (for figuring out what the heck it started out as)?

Very cool.

 

[masterswimmer]

What, no torx screws in there?

Nice work there PoP. It was used in the Boston Tea Party. Owner had to cut off the flare for ease of concealment.

 

[JohnD13]

The lock is similar to a French Charleville lock. Wood stocks tend to dry out and shrink a bit over 200 years or so, probably the reason for some furniture overhanging your stock. You have a nice piece of history there.

 

[Pissed Off Patriot]

Nicely done. I assume no proof-marks or anything you can find (for figuring out what the heck it started out as)?

Very cool.

Nope, nothing. American made, according to the seller.

 

[Robin]

Looks like a re-stock, maybe for the second or third time, using a variety of parts. Lock, to me, looks like a Brown Bess Tower lock , I'd have to study it out more, barrel is cut down, trigger guard may be from an old Bess. Pull the barrel and look for proof marks.
Robin

 

[Pissed Off Patriot]

Pull the barrel and look for proof marks.
Robin

Believe me, I tried to get the barrel out. The screw at the top will not come out. I finally got it to turn, after much coaxing, enough that I could get the edge of a screwdriver under and try to pry it up as I was continuing to turn it, but it just spins and spins. Strangely enough, it will tighten right back up in a couple of turns.

 

[Robin]

That sounds odd. The screw is threaded into the trigger plate, or a boss incorporated onto the plate. Should be two pins holding the trigger guard in place, one for and one aft, Tap out those pins and remove the guard. It should reveal where its tang screw comes through the trigger plate, unless its a blind hole going into a boss, I doubt that but it is possible.If exposed you can put pressure on it while un screwing.
Trigger itself looks like it came from an old 1803 Harpers Ferry, first standardized rifle made by an American Armory.
Robin

 

[Robin]

Another thing!!!!!!!!!! Stick a ram rod down the bore and make sure it isn't holding a charge. Many of these old guns spent their last days as a home defense weapon and were loaded and ready, if the powder is dry, it's still good to go. I was in a gun shop one day and a lady and her three little kids came in toting an old fowler muzzleloader, all nasty looking. She said they bought a house and this was in the basement.
I checked it, oh yeah, it was loaded, she got a little pale, as well she should have. Even experienced gun restorers forget to check and there has been more than one near disaster.
Robin

 

[Pissed Off Patriot]

Another thing!!!!!!!!!! Stick a ram rod down the bore and make sure it isn't holding a charge. Many of these old guns spent their last days as a home defense weapon and were loaded and ready, if the powder is dry, it's still good to go.

Yes. I checked it multiple times. LOL!

 

[BDinPutnam]

Excellent point, @Robin!

 

[Robin]

I've had a few in my shop, one I was so excited to see that I pawed over it, took measurements and was just plain in awe of it. After the guy left and I was working for a while and thought, I had never checked it out and remembered a guy, much more experienced than I, telling me about one like that he had and was doing a restoration on, he had the barrel in his vice for whatever reason he touched off the load he never checked for. Blew a hole in his shop wall and thankfully the fellow with him was not in the line of fire. Never hurts to be reminded of the most basic of safety procedures.
Robin

 

[BDinPutnam]

I call bullshit.

There's someone more experienced than you?

 

[JohnD13]

Looks like a re-stock, maybe for the second or third time, using a variety of parts. Lock, to me, looks like a Brown Bess Tower lock , I'd have to study it out more, barrel is cut down, trigger guard may be from an old Bess. Pull the barrel and look for proof marks.
Robin

If I recall the Brown Bess locks had a "swan necked" hammer while the French muskets had the throated hammer that we're looking at here. Then again, the 1816 Springfield musket had a very similar hammer to the pictures. I think you are correct in the variety of parts being used, not uncommon in early days.

Great reminder about checking the old timers for loaded barrels! I caught one over the years, and one that someone at some time put a folded wood shim down the barrel, maybe to prevent it being loaded?

 

[Robin]

There were many incarnations of the Bess, one was called the 'Tower' I believe it had a re-enforced neck. It does indeed look like Charleville cock, but if you look close there is a double line engraving around the perimeter of both the lock plate (which has had the pointed tail rounded off) and the cock typical for Bess, both are rounded, If I remember correctly the Charleville not as wide. That and the two screw holes back side of the cock for the sear spring and bridle is typical of a Bess. With proper light and magnification, maybe wet it a bit and I wonder if you can see the word tower engraved just aft of the screw holes, maybe a crown too in front of the cock or toward the tail. I am not well versed on military arms of the era though I do like the Bess, and especially like the Charleville, but I have picked up a few things, maybe more than I realize, just not enough to be 100% on my call, Hah!
Robin

 

[Pissed Off Patriot]

With proper light and magnification, maybe wet it a bit and I wonder if you can see the word tower engraved just aft of the screw holes, maybe a crown too in front of the cock or toward the tail.

Tried wetting it a bit, and it didn't make one bit of difference. Still no markings of any kind to be seen.

Perhaps it is just an American copy of a Brown Bess pattern.

I'm definitely bringing it to the Albany Gun Show on Saturday. There are always quite a few tables geared towards older stuff like this, and I do need a better flint.

 

[Pissed Off Patriot]

The screw is threaded into the trigger plate, or a boss incorporated onto the plate. Should be two pins holding the trigger guard in place, one for and one aft, Tap out those pins and remove the guard. It should reveal where its tang screw comes through the trigger plate, unless its a blind hole going into a boss, I doubt that but it is possible.If exposed you can put pressure on it while un screwing.

I'll try this at some point. Maybe this weekend if I get motivated.

 

[Robin]

Sometimes holding a light at the right angle can make it visible.
Robin