It was never an all out war. This is why it is called special military operation. Destroying Ukraine was never a goal, but it is an option.
Things are heating up in the Donbass
- Thread starter holdover
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It was never an all out war. This is why it is called special military operation. Destroying Ukraine was never a goal, but it is an option.
spat
.950 JDJ
Tell that to the families of the half a million dead Russians.
They're in the neighborhood of 10x the number of casualties they suffered in Afghanistan, and that was when they had the whole Soviet Union to draw from.
This number is way off, considering how many Russian troops were actually on the frontline.
spat
.950 JDJ
So, how many Russians do *you* think have been lost in Ukraine ?
How many do you think they lost in Afghanistan ?
We may never know, but it is easy to tell when the number is made up.
While Trump is trying to bring peace to Eastern Europe, Germany is doing everything to sabotage any possibility of a peace deal. Fourth Reich signed a deal with Ukraine to build and finance a long range missile factory in Ukraine. What can possibly go wrong with that, right.
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holdover
.475 A&M Magnum
I kinda think thats the plan. The only thing that will stop Ukraine from falling is a NATO intervention, Putin knows this , and will hold off as long as he can, If he strikes any NATO country, they will respond enmass , thats why he doesnt want to do it. Its a fucking trap. I can see it from here.
spat
.950 JDJ
The whole Ukraine thing was a trap, and he walked into it just like Saddam.
Maybe you're right and he learned his lesson, we will see.
holdover
.475 A&M Magnum
I know one thing I learned, the whole nature of warfare changed with the mass use of drones , Like in WW2, if you cant control the sky you cant move . I believe that has a lot to do with the static lines of this war , Its very difficult to mass your armor or troops without getting the shit droned out of you .
spat
.950 JDJ
Troops levels for *everyone* are a fraction of WWII.
And 2025 Russia is not the 1945 Soviet Union.
Russia would cease to exist as a country if they saw WWII soviet level casualties
holdover
.475 A&M Magnum
Like something out of a Hollywood movie or thriller novel Ukraine spec ops launched and succeeded in attacking multiple airfields and claiming to have destroyed 41 Russian bombers in a raid using short range drones, some of airfields were 4000 miles away from the Ukraine front lines, a submarine base in Murmansk was allegedly stuck with drones also . Looks like the drones were smuggled /flew in picked up by special trucks with hidden compartments in the roofs drove out side of airfields and launched, causing serious damage to Russia's strategic fleet. Russia was using these bombers to launch long range missile strikes into Ukraine . Ukraine video shows the bombers were out in the open without shelter. Putin has called an emergency meeting in Moscow
holdover
.475 A&M Magnum
holdover
.475 A&M Magnum
I watched those updates this morning and it's pretty shocking what just happened.
Ill make a longer post later but I think Ukraine just F'd around too much and now they're going to find out.
Russia has just had their ICBM bases compromised in the Largest Intel leak in their history now a major portion of irreplaceable strategic bombers are destroyed or damaged. That's 2/3 of the nuclear triad being significantly impacted. Russia has to be extremely nervous now that they are suddenly and unexpectedly more vulnerable. They may escalate to descalate.
Ill make a longer post later but I think Ukraine just F'd around too much and now they're going to find out.
Russia has just had their ICBM bases compromised in the Largest Intel leak in their history now a major portion of irreplaceable strategic bombers are destroyed or damaged. That's 2/3 of the nuclear triad being significantly impacted. Russia has to be extremely nervous now that they are suddenly and unexpectedly more vulnerable. They may escalate to descalate.
Putin is now boxed into a corner in some ways...he either responds in kind, or greater, or he might get ousted by Russian "Neo-Cons".
Russians that are like Lindsey Graham, John McCain, David Fromm and Bill Kristol.
Yes, they exist...and they'll have no compunctions about destroying Ukraine.
And, at this point, it may be too late.
Fuck all fUSA and EU Neo-Cons...nothing but Neo-Nazis.
Russians that are like Lindsey Graham, John McCain, David Fromm and Bill Kristol.
Yes, they exist...and they'll have no compunctions about destroying Ukraine.
And, at this point, it may be too late.
Fuck all fUSA and EU Neo-Cons...nothing but Neo-Nazis.
No way this is Ukrainian operation. What is also suspicious, Trump criticized only Putin when both sides attacked each other with drones few days ago. So this would look like Ukrainian retaliation instead of escalation.
U.S is a participant in the conflict, not a mediator. Trump may be doing "speak softly and carry a big stick" thing.
Putin needs to figure out what is going on and act accordingly. If there are NATO tracks, pulling out from negotiations and taking gloves off may be the only viable option for Russia.
U.S is a participant in the conflict, not a mediator. Trump may be doing "speak softly and carry a big stick" thing.
Putin needs to figure out what is going on and act accordingly. If there are NATO tracks, pulling out from negotiations and taking gloves off may be the only viable option for Russia.
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spat
.950 JDJ
What does "take the gloves off" mean ?
What gloves has Russia been wearing for the last 3 years, and why haven't they taken them off before now ?
Unleash Medvedev.
spat
.950 JDJ
To do what ?
I don't speak for Medvedev.
spat
.950 JDJ
So, nothing. Got it.
Non sequitur.
spat
.950 JDJ
The point is that you keep bringing up this rhetoric about "Russia has been holding back, but they're going to stop soon" for 3 years.
But you have no idea what either of those mean.
You don't know what they're supposedly holding back, and you have no idea what else they could possibly bring to the fight, but you are convinced there *must* be something.
It's like an article of faith for you.
But most of us have recognized for years now that Russia has nothing else to bring short of Nukes, so any threats to "escalate" are entirely hollow.
Does the word "Oreshnik" ring a bell?
holdover
.475 A&M Magnum
Multiple drone attacks across Russia. More airfields hit.
Is this the event that finally is a real red line in the sand that Russia takes substantial action against the west?
I think if Putin had considered a tactical nuke previously in 2022 or 23 then he has to be under considerable internal pressure to push the button to show the weather he's not Fing around and willing to tolerate this anymore.
I can see Russia starting to shoot down ISR aircraft and drones operating along its borders. I can see them claiming they are justified to strike western weapon factories and support.
Think about it this way, what Ukraine just did Russia can no longer afford to use their strategic bombers as cruise missile trucks anymore. They forced Russia to alter their tactics. Russia has a few options and they are all going to be considerably more destructive than an air launched cruise missile.
IMO Putin has to save face here and in order to prevent inviting future similar attacks by showing weaknesses and a lack of a response he almost has to over compensate and show Ukraine and the west MAKE MISTAKE, DO NOT PULL THAT AGAIN.
Imagine having this released
And then mere days later 30%+ of your strategic bombers capabilities are lost.
I'm completely expecting a massive cyber attack, attack on West/NATO support being used to kill Russians, or an actual EMP or nuclear strike somewhere. A low yield KT airburst over Ukraine would send the message.
Russias strategic posture has been altered and significantly degraded. They cannot allow that to go unanswered.
I think if Putin had considered a tactical nuke previously in 2022 or 23 then he has to be under considerable internal pressure to push the button to show the weather he's not Fing around and willing to tolerate this anymore.
I can see Russia starting to shoot down ISR aircraft and drones operating along its borders. I can see them claiming they are justified to strike western weapon factories and support.
Think about it this way, what Ukraine just did Russia can no longer afford to use their strategic bombers as cruise missile trucks anymore. They forced Russia to alter their tactics. Russia has a few options and they are all going to be considerably more destructive than an air launched cruise missile.
IMO Putin has to save face here and in order to prevent inviting future similar attacks by showing weaknesses and a lack of a response he almost has to over compensate and show Ukraine and the west MAKE MISTAKE, DO NOT PULL THAT AGAIN.
Imagine having this released
And then mere days later 30%+ of your strategic bombers capabilities are lost.
I'm completely expecting a massive cyber attack, attack on West/NATO support being used to kill Russians, or an actual EMP or nuclear strike somewhere. A low yield KT airburst over Ukraine would send the message.
Russias strategic posture has been altered and significantly degraded. They cannot allow that to go unanswered.
spat
.950 JDJ
You mean the bog standard IRBM Russia is hyping up like it's something new ?
Tell me again what it can do qualitatively better than the PGM19 Jupiter that we were fielding in the 1950s ?