You didn't build that... AR

[Robin]

I don't see the problem, you buy parts and put them together. Is it gun smithing, no, not in the traditional sense, but so what. There is still a sense of accomplishment in that, plus the fact that it is a usable piece of equipment that you have some connection with beyond just shooting it.
Robin

 

[Uzi]

Ok. Then. I concede. You guys are correct. I built my AR by putting the upper and lower together along with putting in a different stock, buffer, and spring.

I also built the coffee table I bought from Wayfair by putting together the legs with an allen wrench.

You too? This April I built from scratch my one off coffee table design with a custom chinese lattice pattern to replace a shitty one I built made out of predrilled and laminated particle board. The only difference was one was built from scratch into a table.

 

[Marine Cpl]

I don't see the problem, you buy parts and put them together. Is it gun smithing, no, not in the traditional sense, but so what. There is still a sense of accomplishment in that, plus the fact that it is a usable piece of equipment that you have some connection with beyond just shooting it.
Robin

It isn't a problem. We are just trying to figure out at what point can you say assemble vs build for the purpose of using the correct terminology in the english language.

 

[gun_slinger_boy]

I'm still slightly confused though and don't want to go around telling people I did something when I didn't.

I replaced the rims and exhaust on my Jeep along with the radio and speakers. Did I build it?

Nope. You replaced parts on something that was already a totally functional item. I think you guys are confusing fabrication with building.

 

[Uzi]

I'm still slightly confused though and don't want to go around telling people I did something when I didn't.

I replaced the rims and exhaust on my Jeep along with the radio and speakers. Did I build it?

No. You answered your question before you asked it. You never built anything, you just replaced your rims, exhaust and speakers for different ones.

 

[Uzi]

ugh too slow.

 

[Marine Cpl]

No. You answered your question before you asked it. You never built anything, you just replaced your rims, exhaust and speakers for different ones.

Why? Because the chassis was already there?

 

[ECU Pirates]

This tread is going to make me
Assemble my scotch collection and build a high bac.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[spat]

No. You answered your question before you asked it. You never built anything, you just replaced your rims, exhaust and speakers for different ones.

Close, the question is "did you end up with a new jeep, or the same one you started with ?"

You don't build something by starting with that item. That is just repairing or modifying.

If the thing you end up with is a "new" item, then you built it.

That IKEA table, was it whole in the factory and you just put it *back* together ? Assembling. If the first time that wood was ever a complete table, then you built it (not alone, the ikea factory guys get some credit too, but you did build it).

Put some new parts on your jeep, was it enough that you consider it a new jeep ? Tires and rims and a radio, probably not. New engine, tranny, axles and power train, probably.

 

[Uzi]

Why? Because the chassis was already there?

It's because you stated yourself that you replaced them.

 

[Marine Cpl]

It's because you stated yourself that you replaced them.

Ok. So if I start off with a stripped lower, then I'm not replacing anything and I'm building it. Got it.

But what happens if I have a complete rifle and replace the entire upper along with the stock and trigger group? Is that not building? Probably not since I replaced right?

Would that be a rebuild?

 

[gun_slinger_boy]

Ok. So if I start off with a stripped lower, then I'm not replacing anything and I'm building it. Got it.

But what happens if I have a complete rifle and replace the entire upper along with the stock and trigger group? Is that not building? Probably not since I replaced right?

Would that be a rebuild?

...

 

[spat]

Ok. So if I start off with a stripped lower, then I'm not replacing anything and I'm building it. Got it.

But what happens if I have a complete rifle and replace the entire upper along with the stock and trigger group? Is that not building? Probably not since I replaced right?

Would that be a rebuild?

Did you end up with a new rifle ? If it's a new rifle, then someone built it, and you are the principal suspect.

If you've just got the same old rifle, with some updates, then no, someone else already built it so it wasn't you.

 

[Marine Cpl]

Did you end up with a new rifle ? If it's a new rifle, then someone built it, and you are the principal suspect.

If you've just got the same old rifle, with some updates, then no, someone else already built it so it wasn't you.

Even if brought back down to the stripped lower and I replaced everything else?

 

[spat]

Even if brought back down to the stripped lower and I replaced everything else?

Doesn't matter, did you get a new rifle out of it ?

If you make enough changes to consider it a new rifle, then you built it.

If you tear it completely apart and refurbish it to "like new", but end up with the same rifle, you rebuilt it.

If you just made modifications, but don't consider what you ended up with a "new", then you can't have built it, because someone else did it once before.

It really comes down to this, everything that was built was built by someone. Who is it ?

The legal distinction is probably not relevant for this sort of a discussion, but it would say the first person who assembled a working rifle on that serialized lower built it. Everyone else was gunsmithing. But if you took it apart and put a pistol upper on it, then you built an SBR. Even if taking it apart and putting a different rifle upper on it wasn't building a new rifle. The law is insane about this sort of thing, so I don't think we should look to it for guidance.

 

[Marine Cpl]

It really comes down to this, everything that was built was built by someone. Who is it ?

You are confusing me again. Aren't the pieces built by someone else?

 

[spat]

You are confusing me again. Aren't the pieces built by someone else?

Yes, but the guy who built your trigger isn't the guy who built the rifle. When did the rifle first become a new rifle, and who did that. That's your builder.

 

[Marine Cpl]

Yes, but the guy who built your trigger isn't through guy who built the rifle. When did the rifle first become a new rifle, and who did that. That's your builder.

Ok. Got it. That makes sense now. It wasn't a complete rifle so you built it with parts.

So when I got my fully assembled upper in the mail and added it to a completed lower from a different manufacturer, did I build it because it was never a complete rifle?

 

[spat]

Ok. Got it. That makes sense now. It wasn't a complete rifle so you built it with parts.

So when I got my fully assembled upper in the mail and added it to a completed lower from a different manufacturer, did I build it because it was never a complete rifle?

You've now got a rifle that never existed before. Who built it if it wasn't you ?

 

[Marine Cpl]

You've now got a rifle that never existed before. Who built it if it wasn't you ?

Great. I'm a rifle builder!

 

[Uzi]

Ok. So if I start off with a stripped lower, then I'm not replacing anything and I'm building it. Got it.

Okay, glad we got the main consensus settled, let's move on to something different now.

But what happens if I have a complete rifle and replace the entire upper along with the stock and trigger group? Is that not building? Probably not since I replaced right?

Would that be a rebuild?

If you have a rifle built already, then you would agree that you can replace whatever you'd like on it. At that point, sure you could call it a rebuild if you'd like after replacing those parts. That would seem to be more accurate since it was already built. I'm not entirely sure what this has to do with the original topic anymore, but...

 

[spat]

Great. I'm a rifle builder!

You didn't build it from scratch, but how "raw" your raw materials have to get to qualify for that is another discussion entirety

Think if it like this, if you say you baked some cookies, all it means is that you put them in the oven and turned the dough into cookies. Even if you just bought the pre made stuff in a tube and dropped it on a cookie sheet you still baked them.

Baked them from scratch ? Well, you probably didn't mill your own flour and raise your own chickens, maybe there needs to be another category beyond "from scratch" for someone who did....

 

[NY Chamorro]

ok, can I chime in without getting my head chopped off? If you bought an AR KIT, then you assembled it, If you bought every piece individually, to your liking {specs} then I would assume you built it. JM2cents

 

[ECU Pirates]

Whoever built the part with the serial number built the rifle or pistol in my opinion but who in the F cares. Can't will post another frying pan video?

 

[Marine Cpl]

You didn't build it from scratch, but how "raw" your raw materials have to get to qualify for that is another discussion entirety

Think if it like this, if you say you baked some cookies, all it means is that you put them in the oven and turned the dough into cookies. Even if you just bought the pre made stuff in a tube and dropped it on a cookie sheet you still baked them.

Baked them from scratch ? Well, you probably didn't mill your own flour and raise your own chickens, maybe there needs to be another category beyond "from scratch" for someone who did....

I think that's a bad analogy. Baking is the act of cooking something with dry heat.
bake
bāk/
verb

1. 1.
   cook (food) by dry heat without direct exposure to a flame, typically in an oven or on a hot surface.
   "they bake their own bread and cakes"
   synonyms: cook, oven-bake, roast, dry-roast
   "bake the fish for 15–20 minutes

 

[spat]

I think that's a bad analogy. Baking is the act of cooking something with dry heat.
bake
bāk/
verb

1. 1.
   cook (food) by dry heat without direct exposure to a flame, typically in an oven or on a hot surface.
   "they bake their own bread and cakes"
   synonyms: cook, oven-bake, roast, dry-roast
   "bake the fish for 15–20 minutes

It is generally creating a new thing from other things. So while not perfect, it is an apt analogy. You are looking ato a more literal definition of bake than I am thinking, perhaps "make" would be better. You can make a salad without doing anything more than dumping a bunch of pre cut veggies from a bag into a bowl for instance.

 

[Marine Cpl]

Whoever built the part with the serial number built the rifle or pistol in my opinion but who in the F cares. Can't will post another frying pan video?

That's what I'm saying but these guys are trying to confuse me. Because that is the firearm according to the ATF.

I guess someone else built the firearm and I built the rifle.

I'm so confused.

 

[Marine Cpl]

It is generally creating a new thing from other things. So while not perfect, it is an apt analogy. You are looking ato a more literal definition of bake than I am thinking, perhaps "make" would be better. You can make a salad without doing anything more than dumping a bunch of pre cut veggies from a bag into a bowl for instance.

English is my forte. Sorry. I'll try not to take things literal.

 

[ECU Pirates]

That's what I'm saying but these guys are trying to confuse me. Because that is the firearm according to the ATF.

I guess someone else built the firearm and I built the rifle.

I'm so confused.

Technically if a company outsources their lower production one could argue whoever made the lower is the builder. But not according to the ATF.

 

[Marine Cpl]

Can Will post another frying pan video?

I like this one. There are multiple tests in this one.