Temporary Restaining Order Issued For Concealed Carry Improvement Act (merged thread)

Saltwater60

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MikeyCNY said:
Long article at syracuse.com - left-leaning but still good information. They had to mention "muskets" in there of course..

www.syracuse.com

Can you bring a gun to the zoo? On a bus? Syracuse judge eagerly rewrites NY firearms law

U.S. Judge Glenn Suddaby is at the center of an effort to define gun rights after the U.S. Supreme Court tossed New York's law.
www.syracuse.com www.syracuse.com

And archive link in case it goes behind paywall - archive.ph judge struck down much of New York’s new gun law as unconstitutional. Suddaby painstakingly put to work Thomas’ historical test to decide the fitness of New York’s gun bans in dozens of locations.
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I was coming here to post it. I agree it was an interesting read for sure.
 
Grimscale

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Acer-m14 said:
whats the penalty ?? FFL ask for ID .. ok here .. whats your occipation .. porn star .. LOL .. whats the penelty for giving made up occupation ?
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"When you lie about your occupation it hurts the person who has to record it. They get disciplined, or lose their job, just because you want to play games. That's not right.
"If you come to me to buy ammo and give an obviously false occupation I will just deny the sale completely. I'm not risking my job for your ridiculous games."



- yes, I really heard that from someone who sells ammo
 
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This is what we are doing to sell ammo, I take a copy of your license, write down occupation and brand, caliber of ammo. It goes in a file in "a neat and orderly fashion". I have had an exotic dancer and a Santa. I don't believe it is up to me to police what you tell me. Now, you take the file which is at over an inch thick and multiply by gun shops all over the state and tell me how much of this will get recorded, *for now*. When the damn background check goes in, that will be a different story. For now, that folder is not where any one should have access, and I hope it winds up in the burning barrel. (Which is well ventilated ;))

We have to spend a bunch of $$ to put doors on the ammo in the next few days. I can hardly wait. I do not want to loose our customers, many of which have been repeat, some just pop in to say "hi". If it weren't for being damn stubborn and actually liking a bunch of you gun guys, we would be outta here. This state makes me ill some days.

I have heard a "rumor" there will be a lawsuit against the ammo regs and other crap which is in the one bill. It is a different bill than the CCIA which is the main focus at this time. Remember, there were ten laws passed at the beginning of June, including the Red Flag crap.
 
Deplorable Me

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How will they verify your "occupation"? Do you have to submit a resume and 3 references now? What happens if you have two jobs?

Were sorry sir that ammo is not in your job description.....................
 
rmosh

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Glock_USA said:
A new stay has been issued today. No more carrying in churches.

View attachment 181866
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It is pretty hard to win a game that is rigged by the opposition from the start. They make the laws, they control the judges, they have unlimited money (our money by the way), they have unlimited legal resources and they aren't bound by any consequences whatsoever. They even let us peasants "vote" so we feel like we have a say in anything. Ain't Amerika great? "The land of the free!" indeed. It's called the american dream because you have to be asleep to believe in it. This world has made me so fuckin cynical. Bah.
 
Saltwater60

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CaliberPlus said:
This is what we are doing to sell ammo, I take a copy of your license, write down occupation and brand, caliber of ammo. It goes in a file in "a neat and orderly fashion". I have had an exotic dancer and a Santa. I don't believe it is up to me to police what you tell me. Now, you take the file which is at over an inch thick and multiply by gun shops all over the state and tell me how much of this will get recorded, *for now*. When the damn background check goes in, that will be a different story. For now, that folder is not where any one should have access, and I hope it winds up in the burning barrel. (Which is well ventilated ;))

We have to spend a bunch of $$ to put doors on the ammo in the next few days. I can hardly wait. I do not want to loose our customers, many of which have been repeat, some just pop in to say "hi". If it weren't for being damn stubborn and actually liking a bunch of you gun guys, we would be outta here. This state makes me ill some days.

I have heard a "rumor" there will be a lawsuit against the ammo regs and other crap which is in the one bill. It is a different bill than the CCIA which is the main focus at this time. Remember, there were ten laws passed at the beginning of June, including the Red Flag crap.
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The lawsuit was posted here recently and yes the FFL regs are in there.
Not picking on you at all but there’s no way I’m going through this shit to buy ammo. I’m not asking for some one to unlock the cabinet and get an anal probe. I already passed up good cheap .22lr because the recording book. Don’t kid yourself that book will not be allowed to be burned and the NYSP will come collect it. They will scan and digitize it since it’s very easy these days to do that. They will know every ammo purchase that took place since this took affect.
I feel sorry for you and if your standard for leaving NYS is what it is your customers will slowly disappear and you will be gone from here and probably for the better. I will maybe buy a pistol in NYS anymore and that’s it. Mostly I’ll buy in another state and have it shipped here not to punish you or any other gun store, but to stop giving NYS tax money. I’m going to buy as much as I can when I vacation and travel now. I’m going to AZ in about a month and I’ll buy what I can there. I’m even thinking of buying my kids Christmas gifts and transporting them back.
 
FrankenCub

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All they need to do is show up with their phones. My S22 will convert pictures with text, to text files. I know theirs can.

I won't buy ammo in NY, and I've been wanting a 5.7 pretty bad but won't do it here. I don't plan on investing another dime firearms wise in NY. Hell, if I could afford a lawyer I'd fight the training requirement because it makes getting a CC permit financially unavailable for most, and impossible for those with disabilities due to very limited income.
I'm determined to not do shit for as long as I'm in NY. Fuck this state!
 
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Acer-m14

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CaliberPlus said:
This is what we are doing to sell ammo, I take a copy of your license, write down occupation and brand, caliber of ammo. It goes in a file in "a neat and orderly fashion". I have had an exotic dancer and a Santa. I don't believe it is up to me to police what you tell me. Now, you take the file which is at over an inch thick and multiply by gun shops all over the state and tell me how much of this will get recorded, *for now*. When the damn background check goes in, that will be a different story. For now, that folder is not where any one should have access, and I hope it winds up in the burning barrel. (Which is well ventilated ;))
Click to expand...

so your only selling ammo to those that have a pistol permit with a listed occupation on it ..

so like you work at walmart and will only sell 9mm to a permit holder ..
 
Darth

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Grimscale said:
"When you lie about your occupation it hurts the person who has to record it. They get disciplined, or lose their job, just because you want to play games. That's not right.
"If you come to me to buy ammo and give an obviously false occupation I will just deny the sale completely. I'm not risking my job for your ridiculous games."



- yes, I really heard that from someone who sells ammo
Click to expand...
"Porn Star."

"That's obviously fake."

"I'm glad you asked." *busts out pics*

Or deny me and get sued for denying rights. And yes, I support private stores denying, but if you want to go completely off the rails, here we go...
 
spat

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Saltwater60 said:
But it’s not a criminal act for the government enforcing unconstitutional/pass law. There is no federal or state law saying it’s a crime that I’m aware of, if there is please point it out. The Supreme Court will rule it is unconstitutional but the Supreme Court has no enforcement powers ie meaning they can’t and you can’t be arrested for their decisions. Rape is a crime everywhere in the USA that I’m aware of so poor comparison.
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Violating someone's constitutionally protected rights under color of law is a federal crime.

You should not be exempt from prosecution for that just because you did it by signing some unconstitutional law, or voting for it.

Legislators have a duty to read and understand any bill they vote for. Voting for one that is later found unconstitutional *should* be prosecuted.
 
spat

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Saltwater60 said:
Your pistol permit does though. I’m not sure why it matters about providing your occupation. I could also see the state reviewing these records and denying ammo transfers or prosecuting people for lying to a government agent. Think about it and don’t say the state won’t.
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What do they do if you just put "recreational amateur gynecologist" down for profession ?

Go ahead, prove me wrong....
 
Saltwater60

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spat said:
What do they do if you just put "recreational amateur gynecologist" down for profession ?

Go ahead, prove me wrong....
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I’d say the first word in your statement being recreational would indicate it’s not your profession or occupation.
Occupation is generally seen as your principle work and the main way you make your income. It’s on your taxes so I think they will know. I’m just warning about what our futures might hold. I think listing or asking for occupation is the dumbest thing I’ve ever heard since what indication does it give about a person’s personality? We just had the governor and superintendent of state police have to resign for misconduct of some sorts.
I’m just warning that lying to a government entity can be a crime and can be punishable and when the “real” background checks for ammo come into play this could be an issue. I’m sure you will sign a form saying it’s all truthful statements because why not right? Of it doesn’t match I’ll bet at the very least you get denied the sale. My PPO says if I don’t update my occupation they can revoke my pistol permit. I do not ever plan to have an ammunition background check so I don’t plan on this being an issue for me.
 

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Grimscale

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Acer-m14 said:
so like you work at walmart and will only sell 9mm to a permit holder ..
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Walmart stopped selling pistol ammo a long time ago.
who cares that it could be used in a carbine. They were already demanding a pistol permit to buy it, then just decided it wasn't worth the effort.

Saltwater60 said:
I’m just warning that lying to a government entity can be a crime
Click to expand...

Which is most likely their reasoning.
They intend on scanning these in and then going after those who lied. Since they own the judiciary it won't matter that you only lied to an FFL. They'll bend the definition of words until you look worse than Dahlmer.


Does the law that set up the background check for ammo state that you have to give this information NOW, until the database and actual background checks are in place?

If not, then by enforcing it FFLs in the State are nothing more than a branch of heil hochul's gestapo.
 
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Here's my problem with all of this... with anyone that has just a weeee bit of gun knowledge, knows that most smaller cartridges can and have been used for pistols and rifles (long guns).

Let's look at the 22LR... that is a universal cartridge for BOTH handguns and long guns. 9mm can be used in handguns and long guns too. So can 45ACP. As well as 17HMR... let's go bigger into rifle rounds... how about 7.62X39... they make pistols (PAK1) for that rifle round too.

So give me a break.... Walmart (and other stores) not selling pistol ammo is BS, because they actually are. They ain't fooling anyone who knows about guns.

It's just "feel good tactics".
 
FP1201

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Acer-m14 said:
so your only selling ammo to those that have a pistol permit with a listed occupation on it ..

so like you work at walmart and will only sell 9mm to a permit holder ..
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I bought .35 Remington at the PX last week: they had a three ring binder with a page that had ME write my name, address, DOB, occupation, and what the ammunition was for (Marlin 336) the Clerk wrote the make, model, and quantity.
Many are making the motions so they can claim compliance, others are overkilling it, even more don't give a fat-flying fuck.
 
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