.

[Marine Cpl]

On a side note, what specifically bans 10 round .458 Socom (or similar) mags in NYS?

Nothing.

 

[Marine Cpl]

I hope I have to keep waiting, but at least I'll have another proper rifle in a proper configuration during that time.

Weight? yeah that "pistol grip" you're using is very lightweight I bet. Very ergonomic too, I'm sure your follow up shots are high up on accuracy with that precision compliant barrel.

My AR with the Thordsen stock is slightly over 6 lbs. Follow-up shots are no different. I can easily put all my rounds in an 8 inch circle at 100 yards.

 

[Podmonkey]

Nothing.

Then y'all should buy theses. Problem solved.

There are a variety of manufacturers producing .458 Socom marked magazines, including Lancer.

 

[Uzi]

Oh, that's inreresting. Is this some kind of AR modification that hurls invectives instead of bullets? I want one!! Very useful for traffic jams.

Really? A tiny spelling error that I already corrected quickly and timely enough that the reply didn't even show it was even revised, and you had to jump on that minutes after I posted it. I'm glad you thought it was "inreresting" though.

 

[Podmonkey]

Really? A tiny spelling error that I already corrected quickly and timely enough that the reply didn't even show it was even revised, and you had to jump on that minutes after I posted it. I'm glad you thought it was "inreresting" though.

.................You mean that I can't fire nasty complaints out of my AR?! Damn, I was all excited for this! I was gonna build an "insult upper" for it!
Someone needs to get on this ASAP.

P.S. Lightens ups eh? I was just being silly. Its fun to be silly.

 

[Uzi]

My AR with the Thordsen stock is slightly over 6 lbs. Follow-up shots are no different. I can easily put all my rounds in an 8 inch circle at 100 yards.

You mentioned "no different"; no different as compared to what exactly?

Would it be no different from a barrel with, I don't know, perhaps the same firearm that uses an actual recoil and muzzle lift reduction device with mags freely able to be changed? or compared to a fixed mag rifle with those same exact devices on it at 100 yards with quick follow up shots? I'm pretty sure an amature shooter such as myself would notice that difference in controllability and accuracy out to 100 yards in comparison with each follow up shot.

 

[Uzi]

.................You mean that I can't fire nasty complaints out of my AR?! Damn, I was all excited for this! I was gonna build an "insult upper" for it!
Someone needs to get on this ASAP.

P.S. Lightens ups eh? I was just being silly. Its fun to be silly.

Lighten up you say? Well, I'm actually loading up on pizza right now. I find it entertaining, much like Will has described before.

 

[Podmonkey]

Lighten up you say? Well, I'm actually loading up on pizza right now. I find it entertaining, much like Will has described before.

Yay! Pizza!! I haven't haf any pizza in over a month now!

 

[Uzi]

Yay! Pizza!! I haven't haf any pizza in over a month now!

Can't say I've ever been as much as a week to a week and a half without pizza before. That's serious dedication.

 

[Podmonkey]

Can't say I've ever been as much as a week to a week and a half without pizza before. That's serious dedication.

I've dropped two sizes of pants y'know.

 

[Marine Cpl]

You mentioned "no different"; no different as compared to what exactly?

Would it be no different from a barrel with, I don't know, perhaps the same firearm that uses an actual recoil and muzzle lift reduction device with mags freely able to be changed? or compared to a fixed mag rifle with those same exact devices on it at 100 yards with quick follow up shots? I'm pretty sure an amature shooter such as myself would notice that difference in controllability and accuracy out to 100 yards in comparison with each follow up shot.

I don't know dude. There's hardly any recoil. We aren't talking a .30.06 here. I can put any round I want in an 8 inch circle while standing and unsupported firing at a decent speed. If I want MOA, I can shoot it supported.

I don't feel handicapped one bit compared to a standard AR whether I grip the Thordsen normally or shift my grip to be straighter like a standard AR.

 

[Marine Cpl]

HAHA! here we go again.... I wouldn't be using the fixed mag rifle in a firefight? It's a toy, If I wanted to go into a some fantasy call of duty battle, I'd put the spring in and use the detachable magazines again, or just use my detachable magazine AR that I already have that has all the features. Stop comparing what complaint rifle you think is better, they both suck and would be retarded to use in that fashion. I never stated specifics on what a specific muzzle device does and doesn't do. They exist for a reason however and aid in reducing recoil, muzzle flash, and muzzle lift depending on what type you use. You constantly seem to answer to your own statements out of context, you do it all the time and it makes no sense. I specifically stated it's a toy and that I wouldn't use it like that in it's configuration? My comparison of the two complaint options was to show that a featureless rifle used in combat would also really suck, and you defend its configuration for practical use. So you're telling me, if a round gets stuck inside the feed lips on my fixed rifle, I cannot clear that jam? Next time I go back in time, I'll tell myself that I wasn't supposed to be able to do that, thanks.

I missed this post. Why would a featureless rifle in combat suck? Would a Mini 14 rifle suck? Would it suck because of recoil or flash. US troops don't use muzzle brakes and a flash suppressor minimizes flash. It doesn't eliminate it. Does their lack of a muzzle brake mess up their combat effectiveness?

As far as double feed go, I said on top of the feed lips. You need a screwdriver to get those rounds out. No amount of oil will remedy that. I guess you weren't having double feeds. That's where it happens. On top with the bolt stuck part way in the buffer tube.

 

[Uzi]

I missed this post. Why would a featureless rifle in combat suck? Would a Mini 14 rifle suck? Would it suck because of recoil or flash. US troops don't use muzzle brakes and a flash suppressor minimizes flash. It doesn't eliminate it. Does their lack of a muzzle brake mess up their combat effectiveness?

As far as double feed go, I said on top of the feed lips. You need a screwdriver to get those rounds out. No amount of oil will remedy that. I guess you weren't having double feeds. That's where it happens. On top with the bolt stuck part way in the buffer tube.

Wow, did you really think I cleared my double feeds with oil, wtf? Bottom line, you weren't there so to pretend like you know what happened to my firearm that I was shooting is nonsense. Why would I lie about having double feeds anyways? The ejection port is large enough to excess with a tool if needed around the receiver for one. Number two, all you literally have to do if you cannot take a magazine out is drop the follower down a little bit, that's it. The reason my bolt was getting stuck back into the buffer was because it was pushing the second round against the other closest to the chamber while retaining tension from the follower. Once you pull the bolt back and relieve tension from the follower, the secondary double fed cartridge should freely fall out (in my case) or you may need to assist it a little bit. The problem was additional friction from the pre-break in period. Since the bolt was short stroking with my 223 wylde barrel, I would get a round spent with not enough force for the extractor to catch properly, the bolt would recoil back and come home while stripping another round right behind the failure to eject. So, it was essentially a bolt action until I chambered a round manually with the bolt assist until the following round would eject, then it would follow the same pattern by not engaging fully into battery. Once I lubed the bolt carrier like a sonofabitch, I blew through 200 rounds without a hiccup. They were double feeds, certain of it.

I don't get why you're defending a state compliant rifle so much? No I don't think a frankenstein featureless rifle that lacks any proven grounds in testing in battle is a going to perform as well as a standard rifle configuration that's been well established for decades. Do I really need to reiterate why something simple like an a2 flash hider can be an additional attribute over not having anything at all in combat? Would you really choose to run your compliant rifle into war while everyone else is using standard pistol grips, stocks able to be adjusted to length that they feel and shoot comfortable with, and a threaded barrel able to accept a specific device that would keep muzzle rise or flash down, even a little bit? They exist for a reason...

 

[Marine Cpl]

Wow, did you really think I cleared my double feeds with oil, wtf? Bottom line, you weren't there so to pretend like you know what happened to my firearm that I was shooting is nonsense. Why would I lie about having double feeds anyways? The ejection port is large enough to excess with a tool if needed around the receiver for one. Number two, all you literally have to do if you cannot take a magazine out is drop the follower down a little bit, that's it. The reason my bolt was getting stuck back into the buffer was because it was pushing the second round against the other closest to the chamber while retaining tension from the follower. Once you pull the bolt back and relieve tension from the follower, the secondary double fed cartridge should freely fall out (in my case) or you may need to assist it a little bit. The problem was additional friction from the pre-break in period. Since the bolt was short stroking with my 223 wylde barrel, I would get a round spent with not enough force for the extractor to catch properly, the bolt would recoil back and come home while stripping another round right behind the failure to eject. So, it was essentially a bolt action until I chambered a round manually with the bolt assist until the following round would eject, then it would follow the same pattern by not engaging fully into battery. Once I lubed the bolt carrier like a sonofabitch, I blew through 200 rounds without a hiccup. They were double feeds, certain of it.

I don't get why you're defending a state compliant rifle so much? No I don't think a frankenstein featureless rifle that lacks any proven grounds in testing in battle is a going to perform as well as a standard rifle configuration that's been well established for decades. Do I really need to reiterate why something simple like an a2 flash hider can be an additional attribute over not having anything at all in combat? Would you really choose to run your compliant rifle into war while everyone else is using standard pistol grips, stocks able to be adjusted to length that they feel and shoot comfortable with, and a threaded barrel able to accept a specific device that would keep muzzle rise or flash down, even a little bit? They exist for a reason...

Lol. Proven in battle? What is wrong with you? It's the same rifle with a different stock. You are the one defending fixed mags. That's a different rifle. The whole loading mechanism and the ability to clear malfunctions has changed.

If you seriously cannot see that then I don't know what to tell you. Holy crap. Stick to UZI's then. That's a joke.

The oil was your words. Now you need a screw driver to just push down the follower. You never had a real double feed them. Look them up. They are hard to clear even with a standard rifle.

Can't say I've ever needed to clear any jam or malfunction on my pistol build, but when I was breaking in my rifle build under constant double taps and rapid fire (all it needed was more lube) I was doing that over and over again, double feed after double feed.

Dude. You have a toy for looks that you cannot train with. Just admit it already and be done with it.

And no. You don't need to reiterate the importance of a flash hider. Before safe it wasn't important was it? You had a muzzle brake that didn't suppress flash. In previous wars it wasn't important either was it? After the first AWB that was federal, it wasn't important either.

You are getting beyond making a fool of yourself in this particular topic. Sorry to tell you the truth.

 

[Podmonkey]

 

[Uzi]

Lol. Proven in battle? What is wrong with you? It's the same rifle with a different stock. You are the one defending fixed mags. That's a different rifle. The whole loading mechanism and the ability to clear malfunctions has changed.

If you seriously cannot see that then I don't know what to tell you. Holy crap. Stick to UZI's then. That's a joke.

The oil was your words.



Dude. You have a toy for looks that you cannot train with. Just admit it already and be done with it.

Not sure what's amusing about something being tested and proven to be adequate functionality wise to use by armed forces and other units to something that has not and exists solely because of loophole gun control laws. I'm not defending any compliant rifle, still. I'm stating yet again that they're not well suited for that application. A fixed magazine would be much better suited however when you factor in only one minor change needed. In your case, you'd have to put on a pistol grip, add a stock, and get your barrel threaded if you wanted to be on par with a minimum standard configuration. More time, more money, more effort. I can train all day everyday with a normal configured AR, it's not foreign to me. Just because I or anyone else can't train traditional reloads and malfunctions when they're using a fixed mag, doesn't make it useless or not worth owning or having. It's still very much a firearm and a deadly one at that.The parts alone are worth the value to me. Knowing that you have the capability of easily having a great tool when needed quickly is desirable. Finally, I have purchased many firearms mostly because they look cool, who cares? As long as I'm enjoying myself and doing what I choose, it shouldn't matter.

 

[Marine Cpl]

Not sure what's amusing about something being tested and proven to be adequate functionality wise to use by armed forces and other units to something that has not and exists solely because of loophole gun control laws. I'm not defending any compliant rifle, still. I'm stating yet again that they're not well suited for that application. A fixed magazine would be much better suited however when you factor in only one minor change needed. In your case, you'd have to put on a pistol grip, add a stock, and get your barrel threaded if you wanted to be on par with a minimum standard configuration. More time, more money, more effort. I can train all day everyday with a normal configured AR, it's not foreign to me. Just because I or anyone else can't train traditional reloads and malfunctions when they're using a fixed mag, doesn't make it useless or not worth owning or having. It's still very much a firearm and a deadly one at that.The parts alone are worth the value to me. Knowing that you have the capability of easily having a great tool when needed quickly is desirable. Finally, I have purchased many firearms mostly because they look cool, who cares? As long as I'm enjoying myself and doing what I choose, it shouldn't matter.

I don't need a barrel threaded. I don't need a muzzle device for my rifle to function. It functions just fine as it is. I can keep the stock as it and have a functioning rifle and be able to use it for home defense SHTF or if the real SHTF where there are no laws I can still leave it the same or just slip a collapsible stock over a naked buffer tube that's already there. It just slips on without tools and locks on the ridges. The grip is easily replaced with the removal of one screw. It literally takes less than 4 minutes to remove one screw and put the grip on. I can do that in the dark What are you talking about in regards to time? No way is replacing the magazine release faster.

I have a tool that is functional in both configurations.

If a muzzle device really bothers you, I can get a flash can. None of that is necessarily however.

 

[Uzi]

I don't need a barrel threaded. I don't need a muzzle device for my rifle to function. It functions just fine as it is. I can keep the stock as it and have a functioning rifle and be able to use it for home defense SHTF or if the real SHTF where there are no laws I can still leave it the same or just slip a collapsible stock over a naked buffer tube that's already there. It just slips on without tools and locks on the ridges. The grip is easily replaced with the removal of one screw. It literally takes less than 4 minutes to remove one screw and put the grip on. I can do that in the dark What are you talking about in regards to time? No way it's replacing the v magazine release faster.

If a muzzle device really bothers you, I can get a flash can. None of that is necessarily however.

I understand that you don't need all the standard equipment for your rifle to physically go bang. Slam fire actions don't need much to function either, but the overall picture is that many people WOULD choose to have those basic options used on the rifle without having to go through additional steps and buy more expensive compliance related items they don't actually want. I think I paid $18 total for my magazine button with its tiny set screw. I don't think I ever said a featureless rifle doesn't function, I just continue to focus on the point that overall I think the fixed mag option is a better gun to convert to a standard configuration both financially and mechanically. I'm glad you can do it in the dark though, I'm impressed.

 

[kev74]

I've dropped two sizes of pants y'know.

Ha ha! Podmonkey dropped his pants!


...got nothin.

 

[Marine Cpl]

I just continue to focus on the point that overall I think the fixed mag option is a better gun to convert to a standard configuration both financially and mechanically.

At the cost of having a non functioning rifle that you cannot train with or defend yourself with now. That's my point.

You have a rifle for the future when you move away or the laws go away. The latter isn't happening anytime soon if ever. But regardless, if it is for the future then I agree. The fixed magazine is a better option.

For now to actually put it to use to serve a roll other than a toy to be used for defense or training, featureless is a better option.

 

[spat]

On a side note, what specifically bans 10 round .458 Socom (or similar) mags in NYS?

Nothing, just don't get caught with any unless you have a matching upper.

And definitely don't get caught with any 5.56 rounds in one.....

 

[freddy]

Then y'all should buy theses. Problem solved.
View attachment 17351
There are a variety of manufacturers producing .458 Socom marked magazines, including Lancer.

I don't understand. The Lancer version seems to be modified for the Socom (not to mention $30 each). Are you saying the modded mag will cycle 5.56?

 

[freddy]

So not having a muzzle brake or compensator is not having a full functioning rifle?

No, not full-functioning, obviously.

Taking apart your magazine catch on your lower is faster than removing a grip screw, pulling off the stock, putting a standard grip back on, screwing it in, and sliding a collapsible stock on the buffer tube?

Much faster. About 3 to 5 seconds total. The wrench needed is physically on the rifle at all times.

Now, time your method - please include time spent strolling to the tool box and finding tools (under fire). Also add time for walking over to the parts bin and finding the parts needed. Still, after all that - no flash suppressor.

 

[freddy]

Really? A tiny spelling error that I already corrected quickly and timely enough that the reply didn't even show it was even revised, and you had to jump on that minutes after I posted it. I'm glad you thought it was "inreresting" though.

HA!

 

[freddy]

Why not just get a Mini 14 instead of trying to convert an AR to a Mini 14? I love my Mini 14!

 

[Marine Cpl]

No, not full-functioning, obviously.




Much faster. About 3 to 5 seconds total. The wrench needed is physically on the rifle at all times.

Now, time your method - please include time spent strolling to the tool box and finding tools (under fire). Also add time for walking over to the parts bin and finding the parts needed. Still, after all that - no flash suppressor.

What? It's one fucking screw. You know what the grip screw is right? You are using a standard magazine release with a set screw. We are taking about T nuts and epoxied bullet buttons here.

 

[Marine Cpl]

Why not just get a Mini 14 instead of trying to convert an AR to a Mini 14? I love my Mini 14!

Since you don't read all the posts in this thread, the answer is accuracy, weight, and reliability.

 

[Marine Cpl]

And with that Prince 50, your rifle has the ability to accept a detachable magazine so you might as well use a standard magazine release.

 

[freddy]

Jeesh. Somebody woke up on the wrong side of the bed.

 

[Marine Cpl]

Jeesh. Somebody woke up on the wrong side of the bed.

I did not. Just stating the truth. Check out an edit on an above post 1 or 2 up. I added additional information.