$36B Union Bailout - 357,000 Pensions "Saved"

[TEOTWAWKI inc.]

Are any of you union guys getting your $100,000.00 cut of this?

Biden administration awards $36 billion to save the pensions of 357,000 union workers | CNN Politics

The Biden administration awarded $36 billion Thursday to prevent cuts to the pensions of roughly 357,000 union workers and retirees. It's the largest federal award of its kind, according to the White House.

www.cnn.com

At least it isn't the originally promised $86B, right?!?!?!

The democrats fascination with unions makes me sick, and the favoritism (corruption) labeled as 'workers rights' should be illegal.

You want to be in a union? Cool. Good for you. I know some awesome people that are union members. They shouldn't be more equal than me though.

I had to go support a site once, while their workers were on strike. I most enjoyed "crossing the line" and being a "scab". Very memorable assignment.

I interviewed a guy the other day that literally smelled lazy. He mentioned unions a few times too.

Anywho... At least this puts us a little closer to hitting bottom. I do question how much longer I am willing to be a productive member of society.

 

[Carlos Hathcock]

More free money. This truly has become the country of milk and honey. No matter what bad decisions you make, no worries. There won't be any consequences.

 

[Depick]

Another vote buy paid for by the taxpayers

 

[Jezman]

Hedge funds is what caused this. Do some research and you can connect the dots. The hedge funds raped many Union employed companies and took there pensions!

 

[Saltwater60]

Why give this money to the unions? Having the unions dole it out costs more than .gov doing it. This is crazy. Maybe the government should have just picked up the pensions if they were going to do anything at all. Why is it my fault or my responsibility to pay for them?

 

[spat]

Hedge funds is what caused this. Do some research and you can connect the dots. The hedge funds raped many Union employed companies and took there pensions!

No, union leadership mad bad choices about who to get in bed with, and their members were going to take it on the nose for trusting them.

People need to learn to live with the consequences of their bad choices. Bailouts are bad for society, even beyond the dollar cost.

 

[Drinkthekoolaid]

If your union screws you tough shit. Maybe unions should be held accountable.

It's not the taxpayers fault or obligation. This is a private agreement between willful members and elected representatives.

Maybe unions need to be held responsible and sued or driven to being insolvent.

The next time your "local rep" rolls up in a Cadillac DeVille telling you to vote in solidarity maybe you should consider who really is benefitting.

Let it burn.

 

[tirwin1]

No, union leadership mad bad choices about who to get in bed with, and their members were going to take it on the nose for trusting them.

People need to learn to live with the consequences of their bad choices. Bailouts are bad for society, even beyond the dollar cost.

And the union leadership did not (nor will not) suffer from the consequences of their bad choices.

 

[Paxal]

People in pain are angry people. Angry people are the ones who take to the streets and dust off their guns. Give them bread. Give them circuses and they will stay home.

 

[Jezman]

No, union leadership mad bad choices about who to get in bed with, and their members were going to take it on the nose for trusting them.

People need to learn to live with the consequences of their bad choices. Bailouts are bad for society, even beyond the dollar cost.

I would like to point out the hedge funds FIRED 75 percent of the work forces mostly affecting the Teamsters, through Change of Operations. There was no one left to pay into the Retirement A Union can not tell a Company how to run there Business. They can only Represent you for Collective Bargaining.

 

[spat]

I would like to point out the hedge funds FIRED 75 percent of the work forces mostly affecting the Teamsters, through Change of Operations. There was no one left to pay into the Retirement A Union can not tell a Company how to run there Business. They can only Represent you for Collective Bargaining.

Hedge funds don't employ union workers.

Last time I checked, there was no stockbrokers union.

Now, the employers may have done that, but not the Hedge funds. The Hedge funds just manage maybe some of the money in the retirement accounts. They would have nothing to do with union workers.

It's also why any pension scheme that requires existing workers to pay in in order to pay out to retired workers is basically a pyramid scheme.

Union leadership should be prosecuted for getting their people stuck in something like that to begin with

 

[technicalgadget]

All hear this...

Mismanage Pensioner Money = Government Bailout

 

[spat]

People in pain are angry people. Angry people are the ones who take to the streets and dust off their guns. Give them bread. Give them circuses and they will stay home.

Till you run out of bread.

Then the masses start taking up carpentry.

 

[Jezman]

Hedge funds don't employ union workers.

Last time I checked, there was no stockbrokers union.

Now, the employers may have done that, but not the Hedge funds. The Hedge funds just manage maybe some of the money in the retirement accounts. They would have nothing to do with union workers.

It's also why any pension scheme that requires existing workers to pay in in order to pay out to retired workers is basically a pyramid scheme.

Union leadership should be prosecuted for getting their people stuck in something like that to begin with

No They just bought enough stock to run the business.

 

[Truebeliever]

Are any of you union guys getting your $100,000.00 cut of this?

Biden administration awards $36 billion to save the pensions of 357,000 union workers | CNN Politics

The Biden administration awarded $36 billion Thursday to prevent cuts to the pensions of roughly 357,000 union workers and retirees. It's the largest federal award of its kind, according to the White House.

www.cnn.com

At least it isn't the originally promised $86B, right?!?!?!

The democrats fascination with unions makes me sick, and the favoritism (corruption) labeled as 'workers rights' should be illegal.

You want to be in a union? Cool. Good for you. I know some awesome people that are union members. They shouldn't be more equal than me though.

I had to go support a site once, while their workers were on strike. I most enjoyed "crossing the line" and being a "scab". Very memorable assignment.

I interviewed a guy the other day that literally smelled lazy. He mentioned unions a few times too.

Anywho... At least this puts us a little closer to hitting bottom. I do question how much longer I am willing to be a productive member of society.

So, is this how you feel about social security too? You paid into it, correct? So you should get it right?
The pensions aren’t much different except for a few facts.
It was contract made between the government and employees. The reason the pension plans were in trouble is a simple one. The government failed to put in the required contributions as normally required. It would be like you were promised your 401k match from your employer, told it was there, but then when it came time to withdraw, found out they didn’t make the matching contributions at all.
Ever wonder why New York doesn’t have a pension deficit problem? Because due to the 1970’s fiscal crisis, New York was required to fully fund its pension as it went as opposed to what Chicago and California does, which is eat the shortfall for the year and hope for stock market excesses to make up the difference the following year.

New York Pension Systems Outperform California - PublicCEO

New York state pension systems are better funded than California state pension systems, currently take a smaller bite out of state and local government budgets, and still provide pension benefits well above the national average. […]

www.publicceo.com

Also look how much is put into a public employee’s pension fund

The New York employer contribution rates for 2016, the same for state and local government, were 17.9 percent of pay for miscellaneous employees and 25.6 percent for police and firefighters, according to the NYSLRS annual financial report.”

Also, unlike other states, union leaders in NY have blocked the raiding of the pension fund for political pet projects, for example : when Cuomo tried to use the pension funds to finance the Mario Cuomo Bridge. Chicago and California have raided their pension funds often to fund public housing and such.

And this is went wrong with Central state

Actually, Central States' Pension Plan Is Fully Funded

Too good to be true? Yes, there are two plans that share this name.

www.forbes.com

 

[spat]

So, is this how you feel about social security too? You paid into it, correct? So you should get it right?
The pensions aren’t much different except for a few facts.
It was contract made between the government and employees. The reason the pension plans were in trouble is a simple one. The government failed to put in the required contributions as normally required. It would be like you were promised your 401k match from your employer, told it was there, but then when it came time to withdraw, found out they didn’t make the matching contributions at all.
Ever wonder why New York doesn’t have a pension deficit problem? Because due to the 1970’s fiscal crisis, New York was required to fully fund its pension as it went as opposed to what Chicago and California does, which is eat the shortfall for the year and hope for stock market excesses to make up the difference the following year.

New York Pension Systems Outperform California - PublicCEO

New York state pension systems are better funded than California state pension systems, currently take a smaller bite out of state and local government budgets, and still provide pension benefits well above the national average. […]

www.publicceo.com

Also look how much is put into a public employee’s pension fund

The New York employer contribution rates for 2016, the same for state and local government, were 17.9 percent of pay for miscellaneous employees and 25.6 percent for police and firefighters, according to the NYSLRS annual financial report.”

Also, unlike other states, union leaders in NY have blocked the raiding of the pension fund for political pet projects, for example : when Cuomo tried to use the pension funds to finance the Mario Cuomo Bridge. Chicago and California have raided their pension funds often to fund public housing and such.

And this is went wrong with Central state

Actually, Central States' Pension Plan Is Fully Funded

Too good to be true? Yes, there are two plans that share this name.

www.forbes.com

And why should the taxpayers in Texas be responsible for the malfeasance of the California or Illinois legislators ?

Shouldn't it be the voters in those states alone that have to pay for not properly supervising those legislators ?

 

[TEOTWAWKI inc.]

So, is this how you feel about social security too? You paid into it, correct? So you should get it right?
The pensions aren’t much different except for a few facts.
It was contract made between the government and employees. The reason the pension plans were in trouble is a simple one. The government failed to put in the required contributions as normally required. It would be like you were promised your 401k match from your employer, told it was there, but then when it came time to withdraw, found out they didn’t make the matching contributions at all.
Ever wonder why New York doesn’t have a pension deficit problem? Because due to the 1970’s fiscal crisis, New York was required to fully fund its pension as it went as opposed to what Chicago and California does, which is eat the shortfall for the year and hope for stock market excesses to make up the difference the following year.

New York Pension Systems Outperform California - PublicCEO

New York state pension systems are better funded than California state pension systems, currently take a smaller bite out of state and local government budgets, and still provide pension benefits well above the national average. […]

www.publicceo.com

Also look how much is put into a public employee’s pension fund

The New York employer contribution rates for 2016, the same for state and local government, were 17.9 percent of pay for miscellaneous employees and 25.6 percent for police and firefighters, according to the NYSLRS annual financial report.”

Also, unlike other states, union leaders in NY have blocked the raiding of the pension fund for political pet projects, for example : when Cuomo tried to use the pension funds to finance the Mario Cuomo Bridge. Chicago and California have raided their pension funds often to fund public housing and such.

In regards to social security:

Like many, I have paid into it my entire adult life.

I'm sure I have mentioned this at least several times here since joining, and say the same exact thing to everyone in real life that will listen.

If it was my choice, I would forfeit every penny I have paid into social security, and every penny that I am owed, as long as not a single penny is ever withheld from me again. My private investments with those funds would likely provide better security for me in retirement.

Anyone that has paid into social security and is currently receiving benefits should continue to receive them. Anyone that is currently paying into the system should continue the withholding, but get to decide how it is invested going forward, with themselves as the sole beneficiary (basically put into an individual brokerage account. No withdrawals until retirement age). All new/future taxpayers can join the new system, or opt out of it. The government can pick up the tab from the time the money runs out in the current system, until there are no recipients remaining.

 

[Truebeliever]

In regards to social security:

Like many, I have paid into it my entire adult life.

I'm sure I have mentioned this at least several times here since joining, and say the same exact thing to everyone in real life that will listen.

If it was my choice, I would forfeit every penny I have paid into social security, and every penny that I am owed, as long as not a single penny is ever withheld from me again. My private investments with those funds would likely provide better security for me in retirement.

Anyone that has paid into social security and is currently receiving benefits should continue to receive them. Anyone that is currently paying into the system should continue the withholding, but get to decide how it is invested going forward, with themselves as the sole beneficiary (basically put into an individual brokerage account. No withdrawals until retirement age). All new/future taxpayers can join the new system, or opt out of it. The government can pick up the tab from the time the money runs out in the current system, until there are no recipients remaining.

Never going to happen but you can dream -lol
As for me. Show me the money -lol

 

[Truebeliever]

And why should the taxpayers in Texas be responsible for the malfeasance of the California or Illinois legislators ?

Shouldn't it be the voters in those states alone that have to pay for not properly supervising those legislators ?

Oh, I can agree with you on that. I think they should have passed a law allowing those funds to seize the debtor’s property and sell it to pay the debt. Can’t pay? — the city hall building now belongs to the creditor let him charge rent or sell it. Detroit had 600 million dollars in art when it declared bankruptcy. They should have been forced to sell it

 

[SomeSoldier]

Didn't they say unions gave pension money to FTX. Nice scheme this is.

 

[Acer-m14]

In regards to social security:

Like many, I have paid into it my entire adult life.

me too .. so we should get the same pay as the presidents pay check .. when we retire

 

[SonOfSun]

So, is this how you feel about social security too? You paid into it, correct? So you should get it right?
The pensions aren’t much different except for a few facts.
It was contract made between the government and employees. The reason the pension plans were in trouble is a simple one. The government failed to put in the required contributions as normally required. It would be like you were promised your 401k match from your employer, told it was there, but then when it came time to withdraw, found out they didn’t make the matching contributions at all.
Ever wonder why New York doesn’t have a pension deficit problem? Because due to the 1970’s fiscal crisis, New York was required to fully fund its pension as it went as opposed to what Chicago and California does, which is eat the shortfall for the year and hope for stock market excesses to make up the difference the following year.

New York Pension Systems Outperform California - PublicCEO

New York state pension systems are better funded than California state pension systems, currently take a smaller bite out of state and local government budgets, and still provide pension benefits well above the national average. […]

www.publicceo.com

Also look how much is put into a public employee’s pension fund

The New York employer contribution rates for 2016, the same for state and local government, were 17.9 percent of pay for miscellaneous employees and 25.6 percent for police and firefighters, according to the NYSLRS annual financial report.”

Also, unlike other states, union leaders in NY have blocked the raiding of the pension fund for political pet projects, for example : when Cuomo tried to use the pension funds to finance the Mario Cuomo Bridge. Chicago and California have raided their pension funds often to fund public housing and such.

And this is went wrong with Central state

Actually, Central States' Pension Plan Is Fully Funded

Too good to be true? Yes, there are two plans that share this name.

www.forbes.com

I say we end social security tomorrow. Full stop. Its a big ponzi scheme, they use today's money to pay off people who "invested" 50 years ago. Fuck that.

 

[Truebeliever]

I say we end social security tomorrow. Full stop. Its a big ponzi scheme, they use today's money to pay off people who "invested" 50 years ago. Fuck that.

It was a program that expanded beyond its original purpose but it was contract that people made their financial decisions based upon it. It’s here to stay

 

[That_FNG]

If your union screws you tough shit. Maybe unions should be held accountable.

It's not the taxpayers fault or obligation. This is a private agreement between willful members and elected representatives.

Maybe unions need to be held responsible and sued or driven to being insolvent.

The next time your "local rep" rolls up in a Cadillac DeVille telling you to vote in solidarity maybe you should consider who really is benefitting.

Let it burn.

Do you mean escalade? Because cadillac hasn’t made a Seville since 2006 which means they would be rolling up in an almost 20 year old vehicle.

 

[Drinkthekoolaid]

Do you mean escalade? Because cadillac hasn’t made a Seville since 2006 which means they would be rolling up in an almost 20 year old vehicle.

You get the point. When I was in teamsters in the 00's that's what the guy drove

 

[SonOfSun]

It was a program that expanded beyond its original purpose but it was contract that people made their financial decisions based upon it. It’s here to stay

It's not a contract, it's a government program. They get cut and discontinued all the time.

As to people making financial decisions on it - they were stupid. They voted for politicians that promised them a bunch of stuff but then didn't fund it. Well, I can "promise" myself a mansion and 6 Rolls Royce cars, but unless I make a proper fiscal plan it's not going to happen. Cutting unfunded promises is a perfect place to start when it comes to addressing the budget woes we have.

 

[spat]

It's not a contract, it's a government program. They get cut and discontinued all the time.

As to people making financial decisions on it - they were stupid. They voted for politicians that promised them a bunch of stuff but then didn't fund it. Well, I can "promise" myself a mansion and 6 Rolls Royce cars, but unless I make a proper fiscal plan it's not going to happen. Cutting unfunded promises is a perfect place to start when it comes to addressing the budget woes we have.

To be a contract we would have had to have a choice.

You can't take money from someone at gunpoint and call it a contract.

If it was a contract, people who be able to simply not sign up for it (and honestly, what 20 or 30 something in their right mind would).

 

[Truebeliever]

It's not a contract, it's a government program. They get cut and discontinued all the time.

As to people making financial decisions on it - they were stupid. They voted for politicians that promised them a bunch of stuff but then didn't fund it. Well, I can "promise" myself a mansion and 6 Rolls Royce cars, but unless I make a proper fiscal plan it's not going to happen. Cutting unfunded promises is a perfect place to start when it comes to addressing the budget woes we have.

Yes, it’s a government program. But it’s also a social contract because are promised that if you pay in , you will get your benefit.
And when was the last time a government social program was cut? It’s very rare when it happens if you can name any.

When social security started, it wasn’t a problem because the life expectancy was lower, and the payout didn’t include Medicare. Then the program expanded.

 

[spat]

Yes, it’s a government program. But it’s also a social contract because are promised that if you pay in , you will get your benefit.
And when was the last time a government social program was cut? It’s very rare when it happens if you can name any.

When social security started, it wasn’t a problem because the life expectancy was lower, and the payout didn’t include Medicare. Then the program expanded.

There was a tax put in place to pay for the Spanish American War.

It was promised to be a tax on the very wealthy only, so the taxed what at the time was a high end luxury good. 3% on telephone service.

When it was originally levied in 1898, that was certainly true.

You may remember still seeing that on your phone bill in 2005.

If it hadn't become the poster child for government tax abuse it would no doubt still be around.

Telecom tax imposed in 1898 finally ends

Levied on wealthy Americans with phones in 1898 to help fund Spanish-American War, tax was discontinued Tuesday.

www.cnet.com

 

[Drinkthekoolaid]

There was a tax put in place to pay for the Spanish American War.

It was promised to be a tax on the very wealthy only, so the taxed what at the time was a high end luxury good. 3% on telephone service.

When it was originally levied in 1898, that was certainly true.

You may remember still seeing that on your phone bill in 2005.

If it hadn't become the poster child for government tax abuse it would no doubt still be around.

Telecom tax imposed in 1898 finally ends

Levied on wealthy Americans with phones in 1898 to help fund Spanish-American War, tax was discontinued Tuesday.

www.cnet.com

Just like the irony on NY thruway authority. At first the tolls were only to pay for the road once the road was paid off the tolls would go away.

Next we've had regular rate increases.

Just recently they eliminated all the toll takers jobs and replaced them with electric sensor's so they are saving a ton of money there. Not only did they significantly reduce operating expenses now they are passing that along in the form of another rate hike.