thisIslandEarth
.357 mag
As the world famous great actor Patrick Swayze once said in some movie: "You ain't seen bad but it's coming."
Ammo background checks to begin mid-September?
- Thread starter Beerman
- Start date
Slacker43
.40 S&W
Honestly I hope it goes exactly as predicted here. The worse it is the better we could be. Funds may wake the fuck up. This isn't their usual incremental bullshit. This is a pile on that is much harder to defend. Bring it all on. Let's just get there already.
Vinson57
.475 A&M Magnum
FUDDS - guess the spell check got you. I hope it all goes down, the day before gun season opens where all the FUDDS are in line wanting a box of ammo for bambi.
2013 was the warning notice.
Willyone
6.5 Creedmoor
I'm not disagreeing, as I don't know shit lol. But it would seem that if PA G&A or any PA gun shop is following PA law, and it's legal in PA for a dealer to sell ammo to a NY'r, then our NY tubby can threaten all she wants but in reality can't do shit about it. That said, maybe she and some other assholes in NY government could suck enough of the right dicks in PA government to get PA to make it illegal to sell ammo to NY'rs.
Question... In NYS is it legal for a NY resident to buy ammo in a free state and then bring it home to NY? If it's illegal what I expect NY to do eventually, and they might already be doing it, is to monitor PA or other neighboring state gun shops for NYrs buying ammo out of state, then pull them over when they cross over into NY.
Hochulsucks1234
.44 mag
If they have the Gestapo patrolling the PA border then I will resort to having ammo shipped privately to me from out of state. Have Fedex drop me a 50lb box of "Chewy dog food" a couple times a year. The cost of sales tax and the cost of the background check multiple times, it would probably still be cheaper to ship.
Saltwater60
20×102mm Vulcan
It’s not illegal to purchase ammo in another state yet. They have no reasonable suspicion to pull you over right now and even if they do you have broken no laws. There is no requirement for the purchaser to go through a background check in the law that I’m aware of. It’s illegal for the seller of ammo to not be registered or run the background check the way I read it. You and I could in pa and sell each other ammo and not break a law.
Beerman
6.5 Creedmoor
The ammo background check is a registry, plain and simple. If you lawfully own guns, you’ve gone through the 4473 and are not a prohibited person. If you’re buying ammo and submitting to the BGC, it’s just not likely that you’re going to be a prohibited person. The plan is to find out who has what, where it is, how much, what caliber… exceed some secret threshold and expect someone to notice. What that leads to is to be determined.
The new system for guns will be just like it has been, except the 4473 data will be transmitted through the private contractor that NYS has hired to run this show. They’re just a pass-through for all “proceed” transactions, but “delayed/denied” will be held up and sent to the NYSP.
Ammo will go to the vendor, who will run a state BGC likely very similar (or identical) to the one that is done for pistol licenses. I am expecting every detail of those transactions to be retained by the NYSP for tracking and investigation. Call me a pessimist.
The new system for guns will be just like it has been, except the 4473 data will be transmitted through the private contractor that NYS has hired to run this show. They’re just a pass-through for all “proceed” transactions, but “delayed/denied” will be held up and sent to the NYSP.
Ammo will go to the vendor, who will run a state BGC likely very similar (or identical) to the one that is done for pistol licenses. I am expecting every detail of those transactions to be retained by the NYSP for tracking and investigation. Call me a pessimist.
I feel for those stuck in New Yorkistan, including friends who are FFL's there. I haven't purchased any ammo from NYS since I moved in 2018, but from now on, I will NEVER purchase any ammunition in NYS. I cannot imagine the purple tie squad ever showing up here in SC to inquire as to my ammunition purchases or what I have on hand.
Then again, I was somewhat surprised to see when an official New York State Police tow truck drove down here to Chester, SC to pick up the Long Island serial killer Rex Heuermann's old Chevy Avalanche to take it back to NYS.
This BS is out of hand.
Then again, I was somewhat surprised to see when an official New York State Police tow truck drove down here to Chester, SC to pick up the Long Island serial killer Rex Heuermann's old Chevy Avalanche to take it back to NYS.
This BS is out of hand.
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thughes
.44 mag
Fuck yeah it's legal, no federal law mandating any conditions on ammo sales (except maybe age). Not sure how your overlords will deal with you bringing ammo back into the state but elsewhere in most of free America, NY'rs and any other person over the age of 18 can walk into a gun shop, hardware store, etc., and purchase a box of ammo no questions asked. There is no requirement to show state-issued ID, or register the purchase, or submit to a BG check, or anything! So at this point I'd say that if/when you are traveling though the free states, stock up on contraband ammo and sneak it back into NY.
tl;dnr: Yes, you can buy ammo outside of NY with no hassle at all.
Acer-m14
20×102mm Vulcan
Absolute bullshit.
If NYS wants to become the man-in-the-middle then they can do it themselves. No farming MY info out to some private company, likely owned by one of these corrupt tyrants, to sell willy-nilly or offer up free without a warrant.
Given their intelligence level, I fully expect her to come out with unverifiable threats "We've notified (out of State) Dealers that they are not in compliance" Same with the incomplete receivers: throw out a blanket statement saying that you've identified merchants not in compliance and threaten Legal action even when you haven't a clue... I believe they call that a "bluff"?
Having visited or traveled through every State East of the Mississippi, stopping at Shops and Shows along the way, no one has ever asked me a damn things about ammunition besides "will there be anything else Sir?"
NICS is required by Federal Law to destroy/delete information withing 30(?) days, but I doubt NYS is required to do so, therefor all the 4473's submitted through them will become a DeFacto Registration. While we do not know if additional information such as make, model, serial , etc. will be required, and that really doesn't matter because Dealers are to submit their Records twice a year to the NYSP: Lock & Key: You do a NICS check, the SP can pull up your Name and identify the Dealer who submitted the request, then request that Dealers Records (of find them in their archives) and know what you bought.
Welcome to 1984!
Slacker43
.40 S&W
Are the NY FFL's actually sending the hard copy 4473's to the state? That seems to be breaking some laws if so. They must be making copies of their bound books as they cannot be sending the books to the state? From being on an FFL in PA all of this seems wrong on the records being sent to the state twice a year. PICS does the checks but that is where they stop. No actual records sent to them other than payment for the check. FFL's maintain the records per ATF regulations. I know, I know, the NYSP will do whatever they want with no regard for laws just as all NYS .gov. There just seem to be so many avenues to challenge this that it is crazy that they went this far all at once.
Beerman
6.5 Creedmoor
You think a court case in our favor would be honored, obeyed, respected, complied with by NYS?
I know you’re simply pointing out the holes in the law that are begging to be enjoined/restrained/struck down. But NYS is a python- the more you struggle, the tighter it gets.Hochulsucks1234
.44 mag
New State Police system will include ammunition background checks and fees
A Bergen retailer has a lot of concerns.
nystateofpolitics.com
"We do have to wait until the law actually takes effect and we're affected by it but we will be (suing). We're rallying support. We're working with our partners Firearms Policy Coalition. They're a group of lawyers out in California. They have several, I want to say five lawsuits, that are currently going in New York State,"
Maybe by 2030 they will strike the laws down only for the tyrants in the Legislature to pass new laws that ignore the rulings in one day.
Cavalry
.338 Win Mag
They need to relay all firearm sales info to the state I believe quarterly. Since the NYSP will already have this information, what purpose does it serve other than to infringe?
End goal of the state is to make it as hard as possible for an individual to buy guns and ammo while tracking that in totality. As a bonus they are making it as hard as possible for a FFL to stay compliant with their bullshit rules. Small FFLs will go out of business either from ATF audit issues, or the state making it too difficult. Individuals will get sick of jumping through the hoops, fees and delays and stop buying which will cascade to more FFLs going out of business.
They do not need to ban guns, they just need to make it unpopular. Within a generation I predict a sharp decline in interest.
We do not know: We do not know of we're to photo copy 4473's, the Bound Book(s), or Sales Slips.
We do not know if those records or the collection of data is to start 9/13 or from what date.
The Law says (to the effect) that Dealers will submit their records to the State Police twice a year.
The NICS/PICS is a separate line of Legislation as another requirement having ostensibly nothing to do with the Records submittal process spoken of.
Saltwater60
20×102mm Vulcan
It’s about inconveniencing us, building a database, increasing red flags, and tracking us. Right from a dems mouth.
Democratic state Assemblywoman Pat Fahy said the end goal is an extra layer of safety. She pointed out background checks could at least inconvenience someone who has obtained a firearm illegally but attempted to purchase ammo at a retailer.
She also said the new database complements the state's now stricter Red Flag laws.
"We do think data is important and the fees that are going to be assessed are going to help pay for this data system and we know that what is being done on the federal level is falling short," Fahy said.
Democratic state Assemblywoman Pat Fahy said the end goal is an extra layer of safety. She pointed out background checks could at least inconvenience someone who has obtained a firearm illegally but attempted to purchase ammo at a retailer.
She also said the new database complements the state's now stricter Red Flag laws.
"We do think data is important and the fees that are going to be assessed are going to help pay for this data system and we know that what is being done on the federal level is falling short," Fahy said.
thisIslandEarth
.357 mag
Unfortunately, there are not enough Federal judges that get it like the judge from San Diego who rejected a California proposal for ammunition background checks back in 2020:
"At the end of the ruling he referenced both the longstanding principle that constitutional rights provide a shield from the tyranny of the majority. Maintaining Second Amendment rights are especially important in times like these. Keeping vigilant is necessary in both bad times and good, for if we let these rights lapse in the good times, they might never be recovered in time to resist the next appearance of criminals, terrorists, or tyrants.”
Reference
"At the end of the ruling he referenced both the longstanding principle that constitutional rights provide a shield from the tyranny of the majority. Maintaining Second Amendment rights are especially important in times like these. Keeping vigilant is necessary in both bad times and good, for if we let these rights lapse in the good times, they might never be recovered in time to resist the next appearance of criminals, terrorists, or tyrants.”
Reference
Notice how these justifications come from Democrats?
The abject fear and lack of self control associated with members of that Party allows their higher echelon the rational needed for further erosions and controls all under the disguise of "Public Safety" which is liberal for "fuck your Rights!".
The abject fear and lack of self control associated with members of that Party allows their higher echelon the rational needed for further erosions and controls all under the disguise of "Public Safety" which is liberal for "fuck your Rights!".
ALL while hiding behind heavily armed guards in gated communities. Fucking hypocritical diseased socialist libs.
2WheelGnnr
6.5 Creedmoor
So anyone gonna go out and buy some ammo on the 13th just to test the system??? I wonder if I should not get a box of 9 or something just to see heads explode or what exactly happens???
Bigfoot
.475 A&M Magnum
I'm not but some others might. So on September 13th and thereafter, I think that this thread is going to really take off. It will be talking mostly about unknown surprises, confusion, frustration, and anger. With some WTF's thrown in.
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Beerman
6.5 Creedmoor
That could be just about every thread on NYGunforum.
But I think you’re right about this one starting 9/13/23.
CaliberPlus
.45 acp
I have started the registration process. I stopped at the payment part. I have to decide whether CC or bank account. A CC can be frozen at any time and has been when fraudulently used. A bank account, ugh, gives me a bad feeling. I have no idea how easily their system can (will be I predict) be hacked.
I have to register using a .gov account. We have two. One account is used to pay sales tax and the other has been used for main business information. Again, just more information being put out there for hackers. If this system is typical of the state...well, one more reason to get more gray hair.
I have to register using a .gov account. We have two. One account is used to pay sales tax and the other has been used for main business information. Again, just more information being put out there for hackers. If this system is typical of the state...well, one more reason to get more gray hair.
ManualF150
.308 Win
Don't worry, NYS will be using an old unpatched version of MoveIT....
Our backgrounds are safe and secure.
maverick52
.223 Rem
Your right. They have already been keeping track of purchases for a year now. FFLs have had to record every purchase of ammo in a log book. I haven’t bought any ammo since that started and will continue to buy out of state. Don’t give them the satisfaction