Chest Holster for Revolver

[Edwardteach72]

I just hate when these oath breakers put out info like, this saying that "the handgun hand holster may be carried in plain view....." when we all know that any slight amount of printing and these "cops" will joyfully gun us "citizens" down in the blink of an eye

 

[Marine Cpl]

Ok Will so what does the PL say it is a license for?

 (f) have and carry concealed, without regard to employment or place of possession, by any person when proper cause exists for the issuance thereof;

 

[BDinPutnam]

So your Sheriff writes law.

See, this whole thread is why Sullivan entirely needs to go away. Has the NY State Constitution no equal protection clause?

 

[BDinPutnam]

 (f) have and carry concealed, without regard to employment or place of possession, by any person when proper cause exists for the issuance thereof;

Good. So "Restrictions: Sports Person" on mine carries no weight of law. That is my understanding, and my belief. With that said, there is no way I am strapping on my vaquero rig and my P227 and heading down to Walmart tonight.

 

[Edwardteach72]

So your Sheriff writes law.

See, this whole thread is why Sullivan entirely needs to go away. Has the NY State Constitution no equal protection clause?

He doesn't no (he is now our county Executive) but he did set our judge straight and turned chemung into a shall issue county more or less, then he ran with Astorino as LT Gov. Came back to be sherriff and now county Executive

 

[JaguarJaguarGolf]

Maybe Dara Holsters?

 

[Edwardteach72]

Good. So "Restrictions: Sports Person" on mine carries no weight of law. That is my understanding, and my belief. With that said, there is no way I am strapping on my vaquero rig and my P227 and heading down to Walmart tonight.

Oh and I am just curious what the penalty for OC would be, like we all know what it is for say drinking and driving, or stealing, or breaking any other laws,

But yea I wonder what the text is for penalties for OC


(And for the other question about the sheriff, the Judge is still the issuing officer and so all polices would have to be approved by him who would be doing so in accordance with the law, and I'm sure he has a pretty decent understanding of law as he is a judge an has a law degree and practices law

 

[BDinPutnam]

So then my follow up question is (not just you Ed)- does your "licensing officer" have written policies about the execution of his or her duties. I know in Putnam the definitions of the different permit types are spelled out on the permit application itself. With that said, this falls under that whole discretion of the licensing officer bullshit and the common language on all permits I have seen tends to be the bit about can be revoked at any time and can't be used in NYC without blah blah blah.

I guess here's the hypothetical- lets say I own a laundromat, a strip club, and a convenience store. I'm full carry permitted in say Putnam. I move to Westchester (or even better, Manhattan) and want to transfer my permit. And obviously either way (I transport lots of cash every day and regardless, I think its right and proper I have a carry permit) I want the same permit. Am I getting it? Snowballs chance in hell. How is that not arbitrary and capricious and how doesn't that violate state equal protection (again assuming NY has an equal protection clause)?

Sullivan is a crock, I think at least that, all of us can agree on.

 

[Marine Cpl]

The Penalties for any violation of Penal law 400 is a misdemeanor. That goes for improper listing of a caliber on your license, carrying on an expired license, failure to maintain a current recertification, etc.

Instead of speculation, it should be read.

New York Consolidated Laws, Penal Law - PEN § 400.00 | FindLaw

15. Any violation by any person of any provision of this section is a class A misdemeanor.

 

[S&W Fan]

Sooooo, @1075tech @Gonzobird, how’s that shoulder holster working out for you?

 

[Hillbilly77]

Sooooo, @1075tech @Gonzobird, how’s that shoulder holster working out for you?

This thread turned into a fucking shit show.

 

[spat]

This thread turned into a fucking shit show.

Not even a new shit show, just the same old one rising from the grave like a flock of cicadas.

 

[Gonzobird]

Well I like it. I took it with me camping and it is comfortable and the gun fits well and was out of the way while chopping wood and other campside activities.

Keep in mind I have no one around me and I am not using it while going around to the different attractions during the day. Using my little baby rock .380 with an IWB holster I just got for it as I need to concel under a t-shirt.

Great holster for what it is designed for and that inst NYS daily carry.

 

[Upstate43]

Correct. It doesn’t. It says that possession is illegal. Possession is carrying. Someone without a license issued via Penal law 400 cannot carry one. Unless you are saying that they can because you aren’t possessing it when you are carrying it. Now someone issued a Premise license is immune from Penal law 265. Your argument would be that they can carry concealed or open because they are licensed. That is false. They need a carry license to carry license to carry on their person just like you do. And what is your carry license for? Concealed or open?

I think we're talking in circles at this point. My takeaway from reading both Penal Codes (265 and 400): there are several different permit types, the one that we most commonly refer as 'unrestricted' contains "have and carry concealed" language. You could interpret that to mean that open carry is illegal by default, but there is no part of 265 or 400, or any other law, which specifies that.

What you don’t understand or don’t want to understand is that laws are written poorly. The DEC isn’t saying that you can carry openly. They are just saying that you can carry during hunting season. Why don’t they bother you? Because it’s stupid to bother you.

Here’s another poorly written law in Penal law 265.

15. “Loaded firearm” means any firearm loaded with ammunition or any firearm which is possessed by one who, at the same time, possesses a quantity of ammunition which may be used to discharge such firearm.

If you read that, just having ammunition nearby constitutes having a loaded firearm. That one too is ignored. Why? Because you will always have a loaded firearm. With that law, they can charge you just by having the ammunition nearby when you are in a place where it must be unloaded like in a vehicle during hunting season but they don’t because it’s stupid and the law is written poorly. They instead use common sense just like they do with carrying openly because it’s stupid to carry concealed while hunting.

Do you see my point now on why law enforcement has to ignore some laws? They have to because they don’t make sense.

Again, you're failing to recognize the fallacy of your argument. You think that the only reason the DEC allows for handgun hunting is because they, and all the other LE, are too lazy to enforce the supposed prohibition on open carry? That's just way too far-fetched.

When DEC is saying that handgun hunting is allowed, they are, by extension, authorizing (or at least acknowledging) the use of open carry for pistols....there is just no way around that.

 

[Marine Cpl]

I think we're talking in circles at this point. My takeaway from reading both Penal Codes (265 and 400): there are several different permit types, the one that we most commonly refer as 'unrestricted' contains "have and carry concealed" language. You could interpret that to mean that open carry is illegal by default, but there is no part of 265 or 400, or any other law, which specifies that.

Yes. We are going in circles. I already showed you that according to Penal law 265. someone without a license cannot possess or carry openly or concealed unless exempted by a license issued by Penal law 400. Those that are exempted by Penal law 400 have licenses to have and carry concealed. That’s the exemption. There is no other exemption to carry openly. There is no need to say if open carry is legal. It isn’t by default or else someone without a license would be able to carry openly or someone with just a premise license would be able to carry openly. That is fact that they cannot or else just a possession license issued to you would suffice for carry. It doesn’t suffice so another license is issued to you and that’s to carry concealed.

Again, you're failing to recognize the fallacy of your argument. You think that the only reason the DEC allows for handgun hunting is because they, and all the other LE, are too lazy to enforce the supposed prohibition on open carry? That's just way too far-fetched.

When DEC is saying that handgun hunting is allowed, they are, by extension, authorizing (or at least acknowledging) the use of open carry for pistols....there is just no way around that.

Again we are going in circles and you refuse to acknowledge that the DEC is in no where saying that open carry is legal. They are just letting you hunt with a pistol. That’s it. You are implying that because they let you hunt with a pistol, that makes open carry legal. That’s not how laws work. They could easily enforce concealed carry while hunting since that’s what your license to carry is for but they just don’t because it doesn’t make any sense just like other laws don’t make any sense that you refuse to acknowledge that also are ignored.

You totally ignored the point that just having nearby ammo constitutes a loaded weapon according to the Penal law and it also is ignored by law enforcement . If you refuse to acknowledge that one too, then it makes total sense why you’ll also refuse to acknowledge that the open carry is ignored as well.

 

[Upstate43]

Again we are going in circles and you refuse to acknowledge that the DEC is in no where saying that open carry is legal. They are just letting you hunt with a pistol. That’s it. You are implying that because they let you hunt with a pistol, that makes open carry legal. That’s not how laws work. They could easily enforce concealed carry while hunting since that’s what your license to carry is for but they just don’t because it doesn’t make any sense just like other laws don’t make any sense that you refuse to acknowledge that also are ignored.

You totally ignored the point that just having nearby ammo constitutes a loaded weapon according to the Penal law and it also is ignored by law enforcement . If you refuse to acknowledge that one too, then it makes total sense why you’ll also refuse to acknowledge that the open carry is ignored as well.

When you brandish a pistol to shoot an animal (with the proper license of course) that constitutes open carry.

When you brandish a pistol to shoot at a target, on state land or private land, that too constitutes open carry.

Even if NY mandated that all pistols be concealed up until the point of shooting (which it doesn't), there is still some amount of open carry entailed in those 2 activities.

DEC enforces conservation law. Conservation law recognizes that handgun hunting is legal. Open carry is entailed in handgun hunting, whether it be brief or continuous. The DEC, and other LE agencies, aren't simply allowing for hunters to open carry handguns because they "don't care" or are lazy on enforcement.


Also, throughout this entire argument you've confused one main principle of how the law works. The law states what is prohibited; anything that is not specifically prohibited is allowed, or at least up for debate. Law 265 prohibits, by default, pistol ownership/possession and 400 provides some exceptions.

The law says nothing about tying your shoes, driving 5mph under the speed limit, or farting in public....and guess what? You don't need legal permission for any of those activities. OC is not specifically prohibited in any form or fashion, either by 265 or 400. Code 400 states "have and carry concealed" but we all acknowledge that there are plenty of real-world examples of how that language is not interpreted religiously.

Ultimately, if a prosecutor wanted to charge you with a crime for OC, he/she would have to point to a legal statute that you overtly contradicted or violated....there is none regarding OC. The worst that could happen is that you could be charged with disturbing the peace or some related charge, but there is NO WAY you could be charged with a crime of OC unless there was a law which specifically prohibited that activity. Also, a judge could take away your permit, but then again they really don't need much, if any, legal justification to do that.

 

[Upstate43]

Well I like it. I took it with me camping and it is comfortable and the gun fits well and was out of the way while chopping wood and other campside activities.

Keep in mind I have no one around me and I am not using it while going around to the different attractions during the day. Using my little baby rock .380 with an IWB holster I just got for it as I need to concel under a t-shirt.

Great holster for what it is designed for and that inst NYS daily carry.

I know some people will carry pistols in OWB or thigh holsters while going into wilderness. Now that I have a good chest holster, I can't ever imagine going with any other carry option.

The location of the weight, the ease of access, the ability to keep your firearm protected if you're going through rough brush...it's just the optimal place to carry a pistol, especially a big/heavy one while stomping around in the woods. I carry my M&P R8 in one; 36oz, though light for an 8 shot .357 magnum revolver, is still a bit of weight, but its hardly an issue while its being carried on my chest. Well worth the money IMHO...I tried carrying that thing around in a waist holster for a season....not fun.