Cops for gun control - article

[GOPerfect]

Those departments shouldn't have a choice.

If you weren't allowed to carry on your badge, that would put a stop to that crap real quick.

And if they had to have the same requirements for cops to carry as everyone else, that would put a stop to the NYC shenanigans too.

You are arguing about the way things are. I am not disputing that that's how things are.

I am saying that isn't how it should be.

I agree to a point. I am against the entire pistol permit process as well as background checks and fingerprinting.

All of Penal Law 265 needs to go.

 

[Truebeliever]

No, they don't care about officers at all.

But they do care about the departments and the unions that donate heavily to them.

Bottom line, they created this shit sandwich, they should have to take a bite like everyone else.

No they don’t. Police unions have little power in Albany. Don’t believe me, just look at the pension tiers.Police endorsements don’t have the political power they had before the anti cop movement.
The police chiefs aren’t effected by any of this. They tend to be the licensing authority or are connected to the licensing authority.
And police departments do not donate to any political campaigns.

Again, you don’t know what you are talking about.

 

[Truebeliever]

Those departments shouldn't have a choice.

If you weren't allowed to carry on your badge, that would put a stop to that crap real quick.

And if they had to have the same requirements for cops to carry as everyone else, that would put a stop to the NYC shenanigans too.

You are arguing about the way things are. I am not disputing that that's how things are.

I am saying that isn't how it should be.

Police officers have to go through more than the general public for the ability to carry in NYS.
Want an example where police officers have to apply for a permit. Go check out NJ. Did it change a darn thing for carry in NJ by the general public — nope.

 

[spat]

No they don’t. Police unions have little power in Albany. Don’t believe me, just look at the pension tiers.Police endorsements don’t have the political power they had before the anti cop movement.
The police chiefs aren’t effected by any of this. They tend to be the licensing authority or are connected to the licensing authority.
And police departments do not donate to any political campaigns.

Again, you don’t know what you are talking about.

Read what I wrote again. Police departments don't donate, because they are government agencies.

Police unions donate. That's where their power comes from.

Also, the pension tiers suck because the police unions DGAF about the officers either. You should demand more from them. Since the government has declared that you guys must have a monopoly, you also have a monopoly on any services you provide for them too.

I DGAF if it's illegal for you to strike. Without you they can't enforce that law. Who is going to arrest the striking cops LOL.

 

[Truebeliever]

Read what I wrote again. Police departments don't donate, because they are government agencies.

Police unions donate. That's where their power comes from.

Also, the pension tiers suck because the police unions DGAF about the officers either. You should demand more from them. Since the government has declared that you guys must have a monopoly, you also have a monopoly on any services you provide for them too.

I DGAF if it's illegal for you to strike. Without you they can't enforce that law. Who is going to arrest the striking cops LOL.

Wrong again. The anti-cop factions have more power than the unions.
The unions definitely are against the new pension tiers. They spent millions fighting them to no avail. You have absolutely no idea what you are talking about.
The power of the police unions came from their “ pro law and order “ endorsements, not the money. Other groups outspent police unions even when the police unions had a voice in Albany.
Your comment is like saying the NRA has a lot political power in Albany. They might have spent money there but the real money is from the anti gun groups . It’s the same for police unions. Very little power up there now.
Even look at the safe act exception for retirees— it applies to the union heads too. Do you know what wrangling that took. A requal requirement.and the fact that some of those politicians were retired cops.

 

[spat]

Wrong again. The anti-cop factions have more power than the unions.
The unions definitely are against the new pension tiers. They spent millions fighting them to no avail. You have absolutely no idea what you are talking about.
The power of the police unions came from their “ pro law and order “ endorsements, not the money. Other groups outspent police unions even when the police unions had a voice in Albany.
Your comment is like saying the NRA has a lot political power in Albany. They might have spent money there but the real money is from the anti gun groups . It’s the same for police unions. Very little power up there now.
Even look at the safe act exception for retirees— it applies to the union heads too. Do you know what wrangling that took. A requal requirement.and the fact that some of those politicians were retired cops.

I didn't say they were more powerful than the anti-gun lobbies. Clearly they are not.

I said they were powerful, and they are. The fact that they get safe act exceptions when they aren't on duty is evidence of that.

They can get stuff done as long as it doesn't conflict with the desires of more powerful interests.

They also represent their own interests, not the interests of their members. Just like the NRA DGAF about gun owners, they are all about what's best for the NRA, not what's best for gun owners.

If the police union wanted to play hard ball they could get whatever they want. But that's not in their interest.

 

[Truebeliever]

I didn't say they were more powerful than the anti-gun lobbies. Clearly they are not.

I said they were powerful, and they are. The fact that they get safe act exceptions when they aren't on duty is evidence of that.

They can get stuff done as long as it doesn't conflict with the desires of more powerful interests.

They also represent their own interests, not the interests of their members. Just like the NRA DGAF about gun owners, they are all about what's best for the NRA, not what's best for gun owners.

If the police union wanted to play hard ball they could get whatever they want. But that's not in their interest.

Really, explain the body cameras, explain the pension tiers , explain bail reform.
By the way , unions don’t represent retirees.
And in NY, police officers are technically never off duty. That’s how they can punish cops for “off duty” conduct. And why “ off duty “ cops can carry in schools without violating the federal school gun free zones.

 

[spat]

Really, explain the body cameras, explain the pension tiers , explain bail reform.
By the way , unions don’t represent retirees.
And in NY, police officers are technically never off duty. That’s how they can punish cops for “off duty” conduct. And why “ off duty “ cops can carry in schools without violating the federal school gun free zones.

Many cops *want* body cams. Seems like they protect you a lot more often than they cause problems.

Tons of examples of body cams making the accuser look like a clown. The only examples I've seen where they worked against the cop, the guy deserved everything he got.

The unions don't represent retirees, true, but they represent a lot of cops who plan to one day be a retiree, so certainly they work for them in some regard.

"Technically never off duty" is bullshit. You guys can't ever have a beer ? Or are you allowed to drink on duty ?

The gun free school zone exemption isn't just for cops, it's for anyone authorized by the state.

That could include anyone with a CCW if you live in a state that isn't a totalitarian shit hole.

AZ Senate panel approves bills allowing guns in more places

One bill would allow loaded guns to remain in vehicles on school campuses, and another would allow those with concealed carry permits into some government buildings. Both have already passed the House of Representatives.

fronterasdesk.org

 

[Truebeliever]

Many cops *want* body cams. Seems like they protect you a lot more often than they cause problems.

Tons of examples of body cams making the accuser look like a clown. The only examples I've seen where they worked against the cop, the guy deserved everything he got.

The unions don't represent retirees, true, but they represent a lot of cops who plan to one day be a retiree, so certainly they work for them in some regard.

"Technically never off duty" is bullshit. You guys can't ever have a beer ? Or are you allowed to drink on duty ?

The gun free school zone exemption isn't just for cops, it's for anyone authorized by the state.

That could include anyone with a CCW if you live in a state that isn't a totalitarian shit hole.

AZ Senate panel approves bills allowing guns in more places

One bill would allow loaded guns to remain in vehicles on school campuses, and another would allow those with concealed carry permits into some government buildings. Both have already passed the House of Representatives.

fronterasdesk.org

Originally they didn’t especially when the camera was always on or remotely turned on.
As far as the school gun free zone, go read the LE exception.
“ by a law enforcement officer acting in his or her official capacity; “

As far as beer, when I first became a cop I could drink in uniform , you just couldn’t be unfit for duty. Each department makes its own rules as to what conduct its “ off-duty” officers can do. If a cop goes on vacation to Amsterdam, smokes one joint of weed, and returns two months later- he can and will be fired. Court tested even in marijuana legal usage states.

How many jobs can require you to have certain equipment on you at all times ? Or decide where you are allowed to live ( government jobs can and do).
The powers of police officers in NYS do not diminish when “ off duty “ but do if they are outsIce their geographical area of employment. But have statewide powers as well.

You tell me what job can tell you what you can’t do on your own time if it’s legal and isn’t in your bloodstream when you come to work? Not many. How many government jobs can fire you for exercising your freedom of speech on your own time., not related to their jobs? Not many but they do fire police officers for speech not related to their jobs. Other government employees get to keep their jobs.
And yes, unions do work for guys who will. be retired one day but ask some school teachers how the UFT represented them for retiree health benefits. My mother in law will give anyone an earful. Almost as loud as someone who was forced onto Obamacare or Tricare.