Cops shoot at suspect 87 times and he’s still alive

kev74 · Dec 20, 2024

There are lots of cops who can't shoot.

Robin · Dec 20, 2024

When you lug that much ammo around, any excuse to lighten things up is good to go.
Robin

Bustedknees · Dec 20, 2024

Tinted windows and plate violations.

Parzival · Dec 20, 2024

Zerex · Dec 20, 2024

In Vietnam, it took 50,000 bullets to kill one VC, according to stats on enemy killed and ammo expended.

This is real life, not IDPA or a sniper shot.
Red mist, adrenalin, covering fire....one shot one kill, is rare.

GOPerfect · Dec 20, 2024

Zerex said:
In Vietnam, it took 50,000 bullets to kill one VC, according to stats on enemy killed and ammo expended.

This is real life, not IDPA or a sniper shot.
Red mist, adrenalin, covering fire....one shot one kill, is rare.

Yes, those that have never had to do this..... Armchair QB's at best.

spat · Dec 20, 2024

Saltwater60 said:
To back up your point I’ll bet many of those rounds were fired from machine guns into bushes not even seeing an enemy.

99.9% were suppressing fire that wasn't even intended to hit a particular target.

But, suppressing fire works for cops too, they just need to be a *lot* more careful with it because collateral damage is a lot less acceptable for policing than it is in a warzone.

GOYABEAN · Dec 21, 2024

RedBreast21 · Dec 21, 2024

This video is another example that you will not conquer your body alarm response to when confronted with your possible death. No combat stance, 360 degree grip, from the chest out presentation or picking up the front sight post let alone searching for your red dot isn't going to happen. All that flat range stuff is out the window. GONE! lol Like this officer, you will not be able to remove your eyes from the threat.

That one officer was shooting one handed while his body is screaming run. He ultimately was heading in the direction of the suspect line of fire as cutting left or right didn't give his body the distant it was seeking in that moment and he couldn't override that response to not close any distance. lol Fair enough.

The other two officers hiding behind the car? Then the officer under fire doesn't move to allow any of the other two to provide suppressing fire? That would have allowed the officer in immediate danger to get clear, while the 3rd moves into position to take the kill shot. Shoot move and communicate.

It's too easy to Monday morning quarterback this stuff but they say in training, that when confronted with your death, you will fall back to the bare minimum of that training. So constant repetition and tactical reinforcement in training helps elevate that base level. But you need to practice instinctive shooting. Under 0.5 seconds from the draw, 7 yards while doing what your body will have you do. Retreat. :beer:

GOPerfect · Dec 21, 2024

Saltwater60 said:
To back up your point I’ll bet many of those rounds were fired from machine guns into bushes not even seeing an enemy.

I am not talking just about war shooting. Those that pick at these types of shootings, have never shot their handguns in self defense

Rocpo · Dec 24, 2024

Saltwater60 said:
I just like to analyze them so I can play through them in my head. I like to play scenarios in my head as prep. This one I’ll admit I don’t understand and it’s amazing 87 rounds were fired into a vehicle and the guy lived. Stress makes you so odd things.

Windshield glass, aluminum, steel and (surprisingly) seat foam make bullets do odd things as well.

Cooolone · Dec 25, 2024

Good reason why 9mm sucks!

Lol

Go ahead and flame on!

spat · Dec 28, 2024

Cooolone said:
Good reason why 9mm sucks!

Lol

Go ahead and flame on!

That's why my EDC is a Ma Deuce.

The wife objects to carrying the extra belt of ammo, and my draw times suck, but the rounds sure as hell aren't getting deflected by seat foam.

Plus I get to dunk on the .45 guys about "stopping power" and "2 world wars" because compared to the M2, the .45 is a lightweight and the M2's century+ of service includes both of those world wars and a lot more.

I'm sure my back issues are unrelated....

Criticalt · Dec 28, 2024

kev74 said:
There are lots of cops who can't shoot.

Being able to use a handgun well under pressure is not an easy thing, as we know.
I know a couple cops....a deputy and a local Jamestown PD.
One(deputy) Shoots a LOT, loves guns and had dozens of firearms. He is an absolute stud when it comes to shooting.
The local guy.....not so much.

The stud trains from different positions, in different weather, in the dark, dead eye at 50 yards and fires 1000+ rounds a week.
The local guy, literally fires his ONE gun when he needs to. Monthly drills and like quarterly qualifying. When he's at our house, he never wants to shoot. The deputy....thats the reason he comes to our house, is to shoot.
The local cop dreads qualifying and has zero interest in guns outside of work.
Luckily, he is a natural and easily has qualified every time for 10 years.
The deputy on the other hand is currently going through the paperwork to carry his Staccato P while on duty.

gun_slinger_boy · Dec 28, 2024

Criticalt said:
Being able to use a handgun well under pressure is not an easy thing, as we know.
I know a couple cops....a deputy and a local Jamestown PD.
One(deputy) Shoots a LOT, loves guns and had dozens of firearms. He is an absolute stud when it comes to shooting.
The local guy.....not so much.
The stud trains from different positions, in different weather, in the dark, dead eye at 50 yards and fires 1000+ rounds a week.
The local guy, literally fires his ONE gun when he needs to. Monthly drills and like quarterly qualifying. When he's at our house, he never wants to shoot. The deputy....thats the reason he comes to our house, is to shoot.
The local cop dreads qualifying and has zero interest in guns outside of work.
Luckily, he is a natural and easily has qualified every time for 10 years.
The deputy on the other hand is currently going through the paperwork to carry his Staccato P while on duty.

I think this is just one of those things. If you got it you got it. Some can train endless hours and still be trash. Others are just naturally gifted.

On a side note. 9mm vs 45. Cars just do weird things. A distant family member of mine was shot in the back by a .45. It traveled through the car's trunk, backseat and driver's seat. She survived but this is just to say that 45 can get the job done and 9mm doesn't guarantee anything when it comes to penetration.

Cooolone · Dec 28, 2024

Is why I love my .357sig!

If 9mm, they're hot loads... But I don't carry my 9 any more. Just me, my choice.

Also, always alternate both Ball & HP in the mags, especially like the Flat nose... Anyways, one is gonna be getting through! Lol

.357sig primarily Underwood loads, 1500fps, 600ftlbs (+/-)... And it (penetration) matters! Lol

Criticalt · Dec 29, 2024

Cooolone said:
Is why I love my .357sig!

If 9mm, they're hot loads... But I don't carry my 9 any more. Just me, my choice.

Also, always alternate both Ball & HP in the mags, especially like the Flat nose... Anyways, one is gonna be getting through! Lol

.357sig primarily Underwood loads, 1500fps, 600ftlbs (+/-)... And it (penetration) matters! Lol

Yep, I gave up on 9mm once I did a bunch of ammo testing. I carry either 10mm or 357 magnum on occasion.
The right 10mm ammo from my g20 is tough to beat.
I would consider 357 Sig myself, but 10mm is much more controllable for me, with equal or better ballistics......with the correct ammo.
The Underwood 180 grain XTP 10mm or the Underwood 165 grain 10mm Gold Dot are my carry rounds...not sure which I like better.
The XTP are super penetrating and my choice currently.

Cops shoot at suspect 87 times and he’s still alive

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