BDinPutnam
.475 A&M Magnum
I suggest you read Heller.
No law prevented this guy from registering the gun. He didn't.
No law prevented this guy from registering the gun. He didn't.
Homeowner Arrested After Shooting Burglars With Illegal Gun
- Thread starter AnthonyC
- Start date
byron
.308 Win
wonder if hehad a permit they keep saying ( which he never registered to himself, )
Doc8404
.450/400 Nitro Ex
Thanks for the post.
I guess all the “wait for your attorney and ask for a ride to the hospital” beat into our heads over the years is bad advice.
More specifically the quote of him answering the question “did you see anything in their hands?”
nortatoga
.338 Win Mag
*Because Heller conceded at oral argument that the D. C. licensing law is permissible if it is not enforced arbitrarily and capriciously, the Court assumes that a license will satisfy his prayer for relief and does not address the licensing requirement. Assuming he is not disqualified from exercising Second Amendment rights, the District must permit Heller to register his handgun and must issue him a license to carry it in the home. Pp. 56-64.*
MikeyCNY
6.5 Creedmoor
Not everyone is issued a pistol permit - and that takes money. Doesn't look like this guy had $200+ to spare to pay the state's ransom for a RIGHT.
Articles are saying it was a .38 cal revolver...
If he had used an AR15-variant he'd still be in trouble.
His attorney will move for "dismal in the interest of justice."
Most of the time that is the correct answer, but look how it worked out for him by talking.
spat
.950 JDJ
You miss the point. The NY law is unconstitutional, that's what makes it SCOTUS territory.
We all realize what the law says, and that this guy should have expected to be charged. What we are saying is that the law is wrong and needs to be changed.
It used to be against the law to harbor escaped slaves too, and people caught doing so should have expected serious punishment for that as well. Doesn't mean the law was right.
livingston
20×102mm Vulcan
No money... They will charge him with something big .. He will take a plea deal .. .. It will never get out of the county... Takes a lot of money to run the court system...
byron
.308 Win
looks like there may be some money comming his way
Click here to support Legal Fund for Ronald Stolarczyk- 2nd amendment organized by Aaron Dorn
Click here to support Legal Fund for Ronald Stolarczyk- 2nd amendment organized by Aaron Dorn
ECU Pirates
.308 Win
I hope that’s sarcasm. It’s never a good idea to talk without a lawyer. Keep your mouth shut. Talking without a lawyer can only hurt you long term.
ECU Pirates
.308 Win
In jail with a felony charge isn’t exactly working out well. How does waiting for a lawyer hurt you?
Doc8404
.450/400 Nitro Ex
ECU Pirates
.308 Win
And it very well still might. I see charges on the way.
subsonic
.44 mag
After he's arraigned on the felony it'll be sent to Utica and stay there unless it's moved to another county or dropped. Town courts have no jurisdiction for felonies beyond arraignment.
I don't see SCOTUS as ripe to help him out here, and he's been through enough. One would hope that the DA would work out a dismissal in the interest of justice, take the pistol, stay out of trouble and be done with it.
In the alternative, one would hope that there would be some jury nullification going on here. They can't introduce the gun without it coming in that he used it to defend his life against two burglars. And maybe he can argue that the gun was part of his deceased dad's estate and he wasn't responsible for it, just resorted to it out of necessity. That doesn't seem likely to wash (there are legal requirements for an executor timely disposing of an estate pistol, don't know if this guy was executor/administrator), but might provide some additional cover for nullification.
S 140.20 Burglary in the third degree.
A person is guilty of burglary in the third degree when he knowingly
enters or remains unlawfully in a building with intent to commit a crime
therein.
Burglary in the third degree is a class D felony.
S 140.25 Burglary in the second degree.
A person is guilty of burglary in the second degree when he knowingly
enters or remains unlawfully in a building with intent to commit a crime
therein, and when:
2. The building is a dwelling.
Burglary in the second degree is a class C felony.
S 35.20 Justification; use of physical force in defense of premises and
in defense of a person in the course of burglary.
3. A person in possession or control of, or licensed or privileged to
be in, a dwelling or an occupied building, who reasonably believes that
another person is committing or attempting to commit a burglary of such
dwelling or building, may use deadly physical force upon such other
person when he or she reasonably believes such to be necessary to
prevent or terminate the commission or attempted commission of such
burglary.
A person is guilty of burglary in the third degree when he knowingly
enters or remains unlawfully in a building with intent to commit a crime
therein.
Burglary in the third degree is a class D felony.
S 140.25 Burglary in the second degree.
A person is guilty of burglary in the second degree when he knowingly
enters or remains unlawfully in a building with intent to commit a crime
therein, and when:
2. The building is a dwelling.
Burglary in the second degree is a class C felony.
S 35.20 Justification; use of physical force in defense of premises and
in defense of a person in the course of burglary.
3. A person in possession or control of, or licensed or privileged to
be in, a dwelling or an occupied building, who reasonably believes that
another person is committing or attempting to commit a burglary of such
dwelling or building, may use deadly physical force upon such other
person when he or she reasonably believes such to be necessary to
prevent or terminate the commission or attempted commission of such
burglary.
BDinPutnam
.475 A&M Magnum
Read @nortatoga's quote from the Heller decision it is squarely on point here.
There was a mechanism for this guy to make the firearm legal. He didnt.
I dont like Sullivan but that is a different ball of wax than this.
Marine Cpl
.577 Tyrannosaur.
Only in today’s America do we have people that defend a bad decision that says that it’s constitutional to have a right violated as long as you are given permission to exercise that right via a license.
@thewheels
.308 Win
And I love me some poll taxes.
The felony charge he has - the only charge he’s facing after killing two people - was unavoidable in NY the second the troopers checked the gun’s registration. And he has a lawyer, did I miss that he spoke without one?
subsonic
.44 mag
It might have been on point but it wasn't at issue so it's not part of Heller's holding. If you read it carefully that's clear. It seems likely that some level of firearm licensing is likely to be approved by the current supreme court but that case hasn't quite happened, yet.
Heller itself doesn't give the right to own a pistol in the home or otherwise without a license when it's required by a law that provides an avenue to obtain one and as of now it's not clear what the supreme court would decide is undue burden on the 2nd amendment as far as permitting and registration. I guess the City of New York case might shed a bit of light on that; remains to be seen.
ECU Pirates
.308 Win
I thought you were saying speaking right away without legal representation was a good thing. Also he will be getting more charges.
BDinPutnam
.475 A&M Magnum
For the record I sure as shit ain't defending it.
wizrd
6.5 Creedmoor
An article in today's local paper says 'shooter will probably not be charged, - shooting was justified under the law' -- may be a problem with unregistered, no permit, - handgun was his father's - inherited it - never got his own permit. Law enforcement looking into the 'illegal aspects - no permit, etc.' -- Aunt & nephew perps places found with lots of stolen property. May have robbed same man previously. No connections between shooter & perps.
Notice how the responsibility falls onto other than the state.
If the guy didn't have a pistol license he wouldn't know the new law!
Why didn't the state send a letter to the address of the dead person, or a cop to see if anyone lived there; or would the gun sit there until the tax department came after the house? Death cross referencing to guns, what is the licensing for because it sure isn't stopping real crime.
What if, I have read so many times, that gun started to kill people who would be responsible?
If the guy didn't have a pistol license he wouldn't know the new law!
Why didn't the state send a letter to the address of the dead person, or a cop to see if anyone lived there; or would the gun sit there until the tax department came after the house? Death cross referencing to guns, what is the licensing for because it sure isn't stopping real crime.
What if, I have read so many times, that gun started to kill people who would be responsible?
I highly doubt he will see more charges. On the contrary, they will drop the whole thing or offer a misdemeanor plea.
Marine Cpl
.577 Tyrannosaur.
That’s seems more likely and probably more likely that he’ll take the plea. They’ll make it attractive. No jail time, time served, and probation if I had to guess.
Blimey
.450/400 Nitro Ex
Yeah, it's just--to me--not a glaringly abusive breach of the 2nd such that SCOTUS would ever consider it. Scotus is okay with some level of licensing or "due process" or whatever (and I do believe it's way over the top in NY state).
spat
.950 JDJ
I can't see SCOTUS disallowing shall issue, after all they allow requiring registration for voting, but I could see then outlawing any fee or arbitrary requirement as akin to a poll tax.
Personally I see requiring any paperwork at all as an unconstitutional infringement, I just don't see SCOTUS overturning a no fee shall issue scheme. But anything requiring a fee, or with any conditions should absolutely be overturned by any court being remotely honest.
I would like to see some anti abortion states pass some legislation modeled after the Sullivan act. Imagine the conniption fit the left would have if you had to petition the court for an abortion and demonstrate a need beyond the average member of the public to get your abortion permit.... I won't even get into needing to find 4 references who will attest to your moral character, etc....