Guys you all know and have seen me ask many times to keep anything that should be in the bar, in the bar. That's all I ask!!
How to Engage the Police While Open Carrying a Firearm .. my RANT
- Thread starter Acer-m14
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Nope, not true, I began this social experiment long before I got the job. Makes it easier to do it now, but like I said, been OCing for years. There are quite of few in the Suburbs of Buffalo that do. I see it quite often. When I was working Part time at Gander, I saw it nearly every day. Not as rare as some think.
Seen him do it at a very liberal establishment. 
Oh and menacing absolutely cannot be charged on someone simply open carrying. At worst it's a permit violation.
Marine Cpl
.577 Tyrannosaur.
But you look like a cop anyway and that's what most assume. Get yourself a really big belly, long hair in a man bun, and age yourself another 30 years and see if the results of your experiment are the same.
Marine Cpl
.577 Tyrannosaur.
I can probably get away with it too because I've been asked numerous times by different people if I was a cop throughout conversation but my bearded overweight friend wouldn't.
nortatoga
.338 Win Mag
If he also had a box of Donuts he'd be good to go!
la la la la land !
1. A NYS carry permit is for concealed. Open is unmentioned.
2. To be charged with menacing all that has to happen is for some libtard to call the cops and CLAIM you menaced them. Do you really think two of them could not collude to get you charged ?
3. You might get off, AFTER your permit is revoked and all your guns confiscated.
I urge you to go ahead and try it. We'll all get to find out which jails have WiFi !
1. A NYS carry permit is for concealed. Open is unmentioned.
2. To be charged with menacing all that has to happen is for some libtard to call the cops and CLAIM you menaced them. Do you really think two of them could not collude to get you charged ?
3. You might get off, AFTER your permit is revoked and all your guns confiscated.
I urge you to go ahead and try it. We'll all get to find out which jails have WiFi !
spat
.700 Nitro Express
You cannot be charged for "open carrying" in NY. There just isn't a law in the books for it.
You will be charged for "disorderly conduct" or "disturbing the peace" or some other such "catch all" law if you are charged for it.
But technically, it is legal, as long as you don't panic any sheeple.
You are correct, there is no specific law banning open carry.
But you can be charged with all kinds of other stuff an ambitious DA can gin up.
AND:
From the license application: "HAVE YOU EVER BEEN ARRESTED OR INDICTED ANYWHERE FOR ANY OFFENSE, INCLUDING DWI (EXCEPT TRAFFIC INFRACTIONS)? Look at the bottom of the application, "ANY OMISSION OF FACT OR ANY FALSE STATEMENT WILL BE SUFFICIENT CAUSE TO DENY THIS APPLICATION AND CONSTITUTES A CRIME PUNISHABLE BY FINE, IMPRISONMENT, OR BOTH."
No matter how long ago, where or what the outcome was, you must report every time that you have been arrested. Failure to do so will be grounds to not issue you a license. If it was something minor that happened a long time ago, it might not be a problem, but you will have to talk to the Sheriff's Department on how to handle it. It is better to list something and be wrong than not to list what might turn out to be an arrest. Just because the charges were dropped, dismissed, or you were found not guilty, or you had some other outcome, or the charges were sealed, that does not erase the fact that you were arrested. If you were arrested for anything, in any state, the Sheriff's Department will find out. If you were arrested you might have to supply a letter of disposition from the court where you were arrested. It is the court where you were arrested that will have to give you the letter of disposition and you will have to contact them. Your issuing judge will have the final and only say in issuing the license. The Judge is ruling on your "GOOD MORAL CHARACTER," on the day the Judge issues you your license.
NOTE, you cowboys, it says ARRESTED.
When the Brady girls scream menacing you will be arrested ..... adios permit !
But you can be charged with all kinds of other stuff an ambitious DA can gin up.
AND:
From the license application: "HAVE YOU EVER BEEN ARRESTED OR INDICTED ANYWHERE FOR ANY OFFENSE, INCLUDING DWI (EXCEPT TRAFFIC INFRACTIONS)? Look at the bottom of the application, "ANY OMISSION OF FACT OR ANY FALSE STATEMENT WILL BE SUFFICIENT CAUSE TO DENY THIS APPLICATION AND CONSTITUTES A CRIME PUNISHABLE BY FINE, IMPRISONMENT, OR BOTH."
No matter how long ago, where or what the outcome was, you must report every time that you have been arrested. Failure to do so will be grounds to not issue you a license. If it was something minor that happened a long time ago, it might not be a problem, but you will have to talk to the Sheriff's Department on how to handle it. It is better to list something and be wrong than not to list what might turn out to be an arrest. Just because the charges were dropped, dismissed, or you were found not guilty, or you had some other outcome, or the charges were sealed, that does not erase the fact that you were arrested. If you were arrested for anything, in any state, the Sheriff's Department will find out. If you were arrested you might have to supply a letter of disposition from the court where you were arrested. It is the court where you were arrested that will have to give you the letter of disposition and you will have to contact them. Your issuing judge will have the final and only say in issuing the license. The Judge is ruling on your "GOOD MORAL CHARACTER," on the day the Judge issues you your license.
NOTE, you cowboys, it says ARRESTED.
When the Brady girls scream menacing you will be arrested ..... adios permit !
spat
.700 Nitro Express
Those "catch all" laws they will use are so unconstitutionally vague as to be criminal. The exact thing could happen to you for wearing a Trump shirt on a college campus (some Snowflake flakes out, calls the cops, makes up crap, and you get an unwanted ride).
Tactically, neither makes sense (A t-shirt that attracts animosity, or open carrying which basically does the same thing), but your right to make a statement both ways is just as valid. Sometimes tactically unsound practices are necessary as part of a broader strategy, expect casualties in such a situation though. Your lawyer will have an easier time with the shirt than the gun, but qualitatively they are the same thing.
Marine Cpl
.577 Tyrannosaur.
Actually, if you read the law as written literally, you can only carry a firearm via exemption. Otherwise you are subject to prosecution through Penal Law 265. In order to be exempted, you have to follow the conditions of the exemption. That condition is to carry concealed. If that isn't met, you aren't exempted.
If you read Penal Law 400, it specifically says that any deviation from the conditions set force are a violation.
spat
.700 Nitro Express
Also, you are quouting the permit *application*, anyone open carrying will already have a permit.
You are right though, depending on where you are from in the state, you are likely to lose your permit over such an arrest. But the whole "you have to tell them about your arrest" thing is completely non sequitur.
spat
.700 Nitro Express
They wouldn't know he was an LEO until well after the "on his face on the sidewalk" stage in your scenerio.
spat
.700 Nitro Express
Are you aware of anyone in the 100+ years of the law that was charged that way ?
Marine Cpl
.577 Tyrannosaur.
But most sheep assume he is due to his appearance and don't freak out and call those that'll drop his face to the sidewalk.
spat
.700 Nitro Express
So, the answer is "look like a cop, but not too much like a cop " ?
You know, fly casual....
Marine Cpl
.577 Tyrannosaur.
No. That's not the point. The law is written poorly so it's hardly ever enforced that way. That doesn't mean it's not there.
You seem to always have a problem with that particular angle that NY can write a law so poorly that it doesn't make sense and it isn't enforced because it doesn't make sense.
nortatoga
.338 Win Mag
Funny how someone can take a post Sideways from what the OP was!!
spat
.700 Nitro Express
Because a poorly written law goes to the defense (in anything other than a kangaroo court).
Marine Cpl
.577 Tyrannosaur.
I'm not sure I'm fully understanding what you are saying.
spat
.700 Nitro Express
A law that doesn't give clear notice about what it prohibits is supposed to be invalid (or in the very least, only the clear portions of it are enforceable).
Also, a law that nobody is charged under, because the prosecutors know they don't want to try to defend it in court, is effectively nullified as well.
The OP was trying to explain the in/outs of open carry. Other posters have bragged about doing it and/or claimed in was legal in NY. An uniformed reader could believe he/she would be okay doing it. The risks in doing so in NY are clear, the reasons to do so hidden in the haze of arcane Consititutional arguments and the non LEO proponents unwilling to walk the walk.
When you do it and get tossed in the slammer, lose your permit/guns and get to spend 1000s on an attorney ..... will the prize be worth the quest ?
Do you really think NYS will change its laws ? Do you really think your employer will laud your effort and promote you ? Do you really think you and your family won't end up on a dozen watch lists ? Sooooo is something this silly the hill you want to die on ?
When you do it and get tossed in the slammer, lose your permit/guns and get to spend 1000s on an attorney ..... will the prize be worth the quest ?
Do you really think NYS will change its laws ? Do you really think your employer will laud your effort and promote you ? Do you really think you and your family won't end up on a dozen watch lists ? Sooooo is something this silly the hill you want to die on ?
spat
.700 Nitro Express
Don't hold your breath. Open carry is not where I plan to make a last stand.
Unlike you however, I will not ridicule those who will, instead I would thank them for fighting for all our rights..
I can assure you @SteyrAug, no one is bragging about this.
This is not talked about to be a bragger, these conversations come up every now and then and most of the time, when correct information is posted, members can learn a lot.
This is not talked about to be a bragger, these conversations come up every now and then and most of the time, when correct information is posted, members can learn a lot.
Funny thing in NY State. There are exemptions in the Law that allow some to carry a gun without a permit.
Law Enforcement for example. Most departments do not require the officer to have a Pistol Permit, some do. The Penal Laws do not talk about these exemptions at all in regards to "Have and carry concealed". The Carry Concealed refers only to Permit Carriers. No where in the States' laws do they discuss the Open Carry of an off duty officer who chooses to Open Carry. Is it legal??????
Law Enforcement for example. Most departments do not require the officer to have a Pistol Permit, some do. The Penal Laws do not talk about these exemptions at all in regards to "Have and carry concealed". The Carry Concealed refers only to Permit Carriers. No where in the States' laws do they discuss the Open Carry of an off duty officer who chooses to Open Carry. Is it legal??????
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