Loaded "Weapon" in Vehicle?

[Chevusa]

Calling all NYGF lawyers, I need your help and opinions. This question specifically pertains to the Mossberg Shockwave. It is my understanding that it is illegal to carry a loaded long gun in a vehicle (although I cannot find that in the Penal Law, at least not in section 265). Where does the Shockwave fit into this? It is not a shotgun or rifle and it is not an assault weapon. NYS definitions can be found here.

What's the deal? Can anyone find the penal law that mentions loaded long guns in a vehicle? What is your ruling on carrying the Shockwave loaded in the vehicle?

 

[nortatoga]

It's a DEC law.

 

[Chevusa]

It's a DEC law.

Ok thank you. I see that.

"A person may not transport or possess a shotgun, rifle or crossbow in or on a motor vehicle unless the firearm is unloaded in both chamber and magazine or the crossbow is unloaded or taken down"

So where does the Shockwave come into play? It is none of those things.

 

[nortatoga]

It's still a Shotgun no?

 

[BuffNiag]

As of 06/01/2020 11:32AM, the Laws database is current through 2020 Chapters 1-56, 58-89

Environmental Conservation

§ 11-0931. Prohibitions on the use and possession of firearms.
1. No person except a law enforcement officer in the performance of
his official duties shall use in hunting or possess in the fields or
forests or on the waters of the state for any purpose:
a. the apparatus known as a silencer;
b. any automatic firearm, or any firearm which has been converted to
an automatic type, or any firearm which has a built-in mechanical
adjustment which will permit it to function as an automatic arm; or
c. any auto-loading firearm of a construction to contain more than six
shells in the magazine and chamber combined, except
(1) such a firearm using twenty-two caliber rim-fire ammunition, or
(2) such a firearm which has been altered so as to reduce its capacity
to not more than six shells at one time in the magazine and chamber
combined, or
(3) an auto-loading pistol having a barrel less than eight inches in
length.
d. An automatic firearm is defined as one which will continue to fire
as long as the trigger is held back. An auto-loading firearm is defined
as one which reloads itself after each shot and requires that the
trigger be pulled back for each shot.
2. No crossbow or firearm except a pistol or revolver shall be carried
or possessed in or on a motor vehicle unless it is uncocked, for a
crossbow or unloaded, for a firearm in both the chamber and the
magazine, except that a loaded firearm which may be legally used for
taking migratory game birds may be carried or possessed in a motorboat
while being legally used in hunting migratory game birds, and no person
except a law enforcement officer in the performance of his official
duties shall, while in or on a motor vehicle, use a jacklight, spotlight
or other artificial light upon lands inhabited by deer if he or she is
in possession or is accompanied by a person who is in possession, at the
time of such use, of a longbow, crossbow or a firearm of any kind except
a pistol or revolver, unless such longbow or crossbow is unstrung or
such firearm or crossbow is taken down or securely fastened in a case or
locked in the trunk of the vehicle. For purposes of this subdivision,
motor vehicle shall mean every vehicle or other device operated by any
power other than muscle power, and which shall include but not be
limited to automobiles, trucks, motorcycles, tractors, trailers and
motorboats, snowmobiles and snowtravelers, whether operated on or off
public highways. Notwithstanding the provisions of this subdivision, the
department may issue a permit to any person who is non-ambulatory,
except with the use of a mechanized aid, to possess a loaded firearm in
or on a motor vehicle as defined in this section, subject to such
restrictions as the department may deem necessary in the interest of
public safety. Nothing in this section permits the possession of a
pistol or a revolver contrary to the penal law.

 

[BuffNiag]

Ok thank you. I see that.

"A person may not transport or possess a shotgun, rifle or crossbow in or on a motor vehicle unless the firearm is unloaded in both chamber and magazine or the crossbow is unloaded or taken down"

So where does the Shockwave come into play? It is none of those things.

It is not a pistol or revolver so no go.

 

[Chevusa]

It is not a pistol or revolver so no go.

Can you direct me to where that is specified?

 

[BuffNiag]

Can you direct me to where that is specified?

Look at what I posted above. If you want to see the whole thing, go here and search for "11-0931"

Legislative Information - LBDC

:

 

[Chevusa]

Look at what I posted above. If you want to see the whole thing, go here and search for "11-0931"

Legislative Information - LBDC

:

Nothing comes up.
11-0931 Invalid Bill Number
Bill number invalid - no information found

How does this apply to this situation?

It is illegal to possess a loaded firearm in any motor vehicle without a valid New York Permit/License to Carry. It is illegal to possess any pistol in New York without a New York Pistol License.

Does a pistol permit give you any leeway to carry a Shockwave in your vehicle in any way?

 

[Chevusa]

I'm not finding anything. Even the DEC thing is sketchy. Where it says shotguns and rifles need to be unloaded, the heading is Hunting Regulations. I'm not a hunter and not in the act of hunting. Not sure how that "regulation" would apply to me.

 

[Blimey]

I'm not finding anything. Even the DEC thing is sketchy. Where it says shotguns and rifles need to be unloaded, the heading is Hunting Regulations. I'm not a hunter and not in the act of hunting. Not sure how that "regulation" would apply to me.

Because, glorious day, the DEC has come up with guidelines (laws?) which you must be compelled to. For example, if your local town has no ordinance about shooting distance you fall under DEC guidelines (500 feet from house). Has nothing to do with hunting or environmental conservation.

Based on the buffnieg links above looks clear to me you don't want that shockwave loaded. The good news is that with a little practice such a weapon can be loaded very quickly.

 

[@thewheels]

Another bonus for rifles (SKS) that can be quickly loaded with a stripper clip.

 

[Chevusa]

Because, glorious day, the DEC has come up with guidelines (laws?) which you must be compelled to. For example, if your local town has no ordinance about shooting distance you fall under DEC guidelines (500 feet from house). Has nothing to do with hunting or environmental conservation.

Based on the buffnieg links above looks clear to me you don't want that shockwave loaded. The good news is that with a little practice such a weapon can be loaded very quickly.

what is the penalty for violating the dec hunting regulation? Will I lose my hunting license that doesn't exist?

 

[nortatoga]

what is the penalty for violating the dec hunting regulation? Will I lose my hunting license that doesn't exist?

It would be a firearms violation, you would probably lose your hand gun license and all the rest of your long guns under the Safe Act!

 

[enigma]

The following acts are misdemeanors, punishable as herein provided, when they are done in violation of the section or subdivision thereof specified, or if no section is specified, in violation of any section of the Fish and Wildlife Law:

---- Snip paragraphs 1&2 for clarity ---

3. Possession, use or discharge of a firearm in violation of subdivision 1, 2, 4, 5, or 6 of section 11-0931 of this chapter. Each such misdemeanor shall be punishable by imprisonment for not more than three months or by a fine of not less than two hundred dollars nor more than one thousand dollars, or by both such imprisonment and fine.

See Section 71-0921 Misdemeanors

 

[Robin]

No hunting license?, Why heck, you should be good to go then!
Robin

 

[Chevusa]

I like how the definition of "firearm" changes depending on what law you're looking at. Man NYS is fucked up.

 

[Darth]

...

Did you literally stop reading mid sentence?

No crossbow or firearm except a pistol or revolver shall be carried or possessed in or on a motor vehicle unless it is uncocked, for a crossbow or unloaded, for a firearm in both the chamber and the magazine

 

[Chevusa]

Did you literally stop reading mid sentence?

No crossbow or firearm except a pistol or revolver shall be carried or possessed in or on a motor vehicle unless it is uncocked, for a crossbow or unloaded, for a firearm in both the chamber and the magazine

Yes lol

 

[Chevusa]

The angle I wanted to explore here was the term "firearm" in penal law is a pistol or revolver and that says it can be loaded in your car. The shockwave is not a shotgun or rifle so I thought there might be an opening there to carry in vehicle loaded. I can see now that the DEC law uses "firearm" to mean any and all guns so it looks like it's a no go. I just needed help making that all make sense to me.

 

[nortatoga]

And motor vehicle would include 4 wheeler, golf cart, tractor and ride on mower and such! Leaning a loaded firearm on a vehicle because you forgot to take your lunch out is ON!

 

[BDinPutnam]

And motor vehicle would include 4 wheeler, golf cart, tractor and ride on mower and such! Leaning a loaded firearm on a vehicle because you forgot to take your lunch out is ON!

Oops.

 

[JaguarJaguarGolf]

I heard a story from my hunting club that a hunter was cited for loaded gun in vehicle for resting rifle against car while opening trunk to get rifle case and put gun away at end of day.

Leaning a loaded gun against vehicle is not a safe thing to do.

I have no idea how true the story is.

I usually wait until I am past the 500ft marker the club has emplaced I load up my rifle or shotgun. My handgun on my belt is always loaded. Just my own rules. Most often I walk over to the hunting club, especially during big game season. If I'm desperate I sometimes toss a handful of road gravel into one or two spots I know they like to hide to get them moving.

 

[SuffolkArms]

So, does this mean that any police officer that rides with a loaded shotgun or rifle in their patrol vehicle is breaking the hunting regulation, and therefore has committed a "serious offense", rendering them no longer capable of possessing a pistol, rifle, or shotgun? I don't see any exceptions for LEO from the DEC regulation after all...

 

[Chevusa]

So, does this mean that any police officer that rides with a loaded shotgun or rifle in their patrol vehicle is breaking the hunting regulation, and therefore has committed a "serious offense", rendering them no longer capable of possessing a pistol, rifle, or shotgun? I don't see any exceptions for LEO from the DEC regulation after all...

Funny, but it makes me think even more now that it only applies to people who are hunting.

 

[Jsmegs77]

I would like to think that the DEC regulations mentioned only pertain to hunters, but this is NY, DEC ECO's have state police powers, and chances are you don't get a pass even if there's incontrovertible evidence that you were in fact not hunting at all.

Or so I've been told. I've got no soft spot for DEC growing up on LI, that's for sure.

 

[SuffolkArms]

Funny, but it makes me think even more now that it only applies to people who are hunting.

The Hunting regulation was applied as penal law outside of "Hunting" situations in People V. Russo last time it came up. Still seems like BS to me.

 

[Chevusa]

I would like to think that the DEC regulations mentioned only pertain to hunters, but this is NY, DEC ECO's have state police powers, and chances are you don't get a pass even if there's incontrovertible evidence that you were in fact not hunting at all.

Or so I've been told. I've got no soft spot for DEC growing up on LI, that's for sure.

I understand they are police officers and can enforce any law, but that doesn't mean the hunting regulations would apply to people who are clearly not hunting. I read through the "scope" or purpose of the agency and didn't see anything other than hunting, wildlife type objectives of the agency.

 

[SuffolkArms]

I would like to think that the DEC regulations mentioned only pertain to hunters, but this is NY, DEC ECO's have state police powers, and chances are you don't get a pass even if there's incontrovertible evidence that you were in fact not hunting at all.

Or so I've been told. I've got no soft spot for DEC growing up on LI, that's for sure.

The same DEC that claims that ANYBODY in the woodlands of Long Island with a rifle or shotgun is "illegally hunting"... right...

 

[Chevusa]

The Hunting regulation was applied as penal law outside of "Hunting" situations in People V. Russo last time it came up. Still seems like BS to me.

That's crazy. Thanks for the link. This means police are in violation of this law as well.

 

[repete]

If you decide that it is legal and you get busted, I'd really like to be in the courtroom when you try to explain that a Shockwave isn't a shotgun even though it's loaded with 12gage shot shells! If you're successful I'd well I don't know what I'd do! GOOD LUCK