Make any rifle SAFE Compliant - remove the magazine catch

[Saltwater60]

Here is the problem with only using 5 round magazine they would still need to be fixed in place. If not you can remove them and put something else in place. I just checked the safe act web site and did the interactive tool and it says yes you need to register it if you have assult weapon features. I’ll stick with the fixed mag version.

 

[Phauxtoe]

I use those for my compliant mini gun. I just put pillows over the barrels instead of silencers. Pillows have their own threads, so the barrel doesn't have to.

Edit: just realized I got a bit thread-crappy. Sorry.

what is the Thread count of your pillow cases?

 

[Phauxtoe]

The advantage of what I suggest is that it doesn't appear like you are skirting the law. You will probably get NYS Model Citizen award for owning a single shot rifle. When you move or travel out of state you can install a normal mag. catch and have a normal rifle. You also end up owning a sled which is a practical device for serious AR shooters.

i prefer the 20 round size sled!

 

[fnfalguy]

Before the safe act, I used 600 thread count. Then with the princess’ new decree, we dropped down to the scratchy burlap and emery cloth with a 7 thread count. Then the courts stepped in and we are back to a 10 thread count. Wait a minute, can i only use a 10 thread count in the western area of NY....

what is the Thread count of your pillow cases?

 

[Phauxtoe]

Before the safe act, I used 600 thread count. Then with the princess’ new decree, we dropped down to the scratchy burlap and emery cloth with a 7 thread count. Then the courts stepped in and we are back to a 10 thread count. Wait a minute, can i only use a 10 thread count in the western area of NY....

yes maybe no - kind of EXACTLY!

 

[meketrefe]

ZZZZZzzzzz!

 

[UpStateEdwin]

I have an AR-15 that my son built (with a lower that I bought (from a dealer in Albany) post NY SAFE ACT) that I "THINK" is NY Safe Compliant despite the pistol grip, telescoping stock and threaded barrel - he put in a mag lock - and it is 'permanent' - no weld, but the retaining screw head (SHCS) is filled with a metal epoxy (JB Weld). With so many opinions mentioned in this post, is that enough? Seems to me that it is - and I'm no lawyer. Seems you have to be one to understand the act. But it seems the 'assault rifle' requirement is to have a removable magazine, which this gun no longer has, making it NOT an assault rifle.

 

[Saltwater60]

I have an AR-15 that my son built (with a lower that I bought (from a dealer in Albany) post NY SAFE ACT) that I "THINK" is NY Safe Compliant despite the pistol grip, telescoping stock and threaded barrel - he put in a mag lock - and it is 'permanent' - no weld, but the retaining screw head (SHCS) is filled with a metal epoxy (JB Weld). With so many opinions mentioned in this post, is that enough? Seems to me that it is - and I'm no lawyer. Seems you have to be one to understand the act. But it seems the 'assault rifle' requirement is to have a removable magazine, which this gun no longer has, making it NOT an assault rifle.

All I can tell you is at the gun show at the Erie county fair grounds DD’s ranch sells many AR-15’s built out like this at every gun show. Many cops and troopers walk right by and I have never heard of an issue with this style of mag lock filled with epoxy.

 

[Doc8404]

Rather have something I can change the mag out.

 

[96coal449]

Rather have something I can change the mag out.

I feel the same for the AR game and others like it. For the M1A .... it can be fed from the top with stripper clips which was intriguing to me at the time I got my scout, even though it didn't work out like that.

 

[Jem45472]

I have an AR-15 that my son built (with a lower that I bought (from a dealer in Albany) post NY SAFE ACT) that I "THINK" is NY Safe Compliant despite the pistol grip, telescoping stock and threaded barrel - he put in a mag lock - and it is 'permanent' - no weld, but the retaining screw head (SHCS) is filled with a metal epoxy (JB Weld). With so many opinions mentioned in this post, is that enough? Seems to me that it is - and I'm no lawyer. Seems you have to be one to understand the act. But it seems the 'assault rifle' requirement is to have a removable magazine, which this gun no longer has, making it NOT an assault rifle.

Safe act says "the ability to accept a detachable magazine."

I leave my mag lock in without epoxy. In case of a jam, I can remove it. When the mag lock is in place it can not accept a detachable magazine.

 

[Toecutter]

How bout we keep the mag catch and remove the governer.

 

[UpStateEdwin]

While at the range in Queensbury yesterday, I asked about the mag lock's legality - they said NO! If it can be easily removed with hand tools, then it's not permanent. I epoxied the screw head and pinned the thread on the lock side (with a blind hole, so it can't be removed without machining), but I still feel that the lock can be easily cut with a grinder. I feel like the only solution would be to epoxy/weld the mag to the lower. One of the range dudes said that epoxy is not permanent because it won't survive 1250 degrees (I assume F) - don't know where he came up with that number, and not sure that it makes sense (many mags are plastic which will not survive 500 degrees and ammo cooks off at 356 F(is that right?)), but my mag lock is aluminum, and the lower is steel, so no welding to be done there. I used JB Weld epoxy, which is listed at 500F continuous, 600F intermittent.
But, they may have been discouraging me from doing it myself and pushing for me to purchase an NY10 (which they don't have in stock) - which is the NY SAFE Compliant Lower that retains the 10 round mag - allows the mag to drop 1/2" or so to allow for cycling the bolt (you all probably knew that). Either way, there is still a TON of misunderstanding going on - too much personal opinion involved in 'factual' conclusions due to the intended vagueness of the written law. If a law enforcement agent wanted to give you a hard time, he could easily write you up regardless of what you have, and then it would be you against the court. I do NOT want my picture in the paper for that.

 

[Marine Cpl]

The law says "ability to accept a detachable magazine."

When you buy the magazine in the store, it is a detachable magazine. And with tools or heat, the rifle has the ability to accept a detachable magazine because you can always remove it and put in another one.

 

[Uzi]

Nothing in the law says anything about permanency with fixed magazines. If it's secured in a state where the magazine cannot come out with the press of a button or without further modifications to the rifle, the majority of gun owners and FFL's find these sort of mag locking mechanisms to meet the definition within the law. This is why they're sold by the thousands in NYS and have been in use for years and years now in public environments. Try going somewhere else where they don't make up stupid shit and give you hard time in the future.

 

[Mosinitis]

This whole debate is idiotic. If the rifle is used for non-criminal purpose you are given the benefit of the doubt. If the rifle is used for a criminal purpose who cares, let them burn you.

 

[togmaster]

FUAC

 

[96coal449]

Here we are again .... debating the definition of an unconstitutional act.

 

[Jem45472]

While at the range in Queensbury yesterday, I asked about the mag lock's legality - they said NO! If it can be easily removed with hand tools, then it's not permanent. I epoxied the screw head and pinned the thread on the lock side (with a blind hole, so it can't be removed without machining), but I still feel that the lock can be easily cut with a grinder. I feel like the only solution would be to epoxy/weld the mag to the lower. One of the range dudes said that epoxy is not permanent because it won't survive 1250 degrees (I assume F) - don't know where he came up with that number, and not sure that it makes sense (many mags are plastic which will not survive 500 degrees and ammo cooks off at 356 F(is that right?)), but my mag lock is aluminum, and the lower is steel, so no welding to be done there. I used JB Weld epoxy, which is listed at 500F continuous, 600F intermittent.
But, they may have been discouraging me from doing it myself and pushing for me to purchase an NY10 (which they don't have in stock) - which is the NY SAFE Compliant Lower that retains the 10 round mag - allows the mag to drop 1/2" or so to allow for cycling the bolt (you all probably knew that). Either way, there is still a TON of misunderstanding going on - too much personal opinion involved in 'factual' conclusions due to the intended vagueness of the written law. If a law enforcement agent wanted to give you a hard time, he could easily write you up regardless of what you have, and then it would be you against the court. I do NOT want my picture in the paper for that.

Ask them to show you where in the laws it says anything about a mag lock being permanent. An sks mag works just like a mag lock and it is not considered an "assault rifle"

Ar mag locks are sold all over NY. Dds ranch sells their rifles with mag locks filled with epoxy because it keeps the state police happy, not because that's what the law says.

 

[Marine Cpl]

Ask them to show you where in the laws it says anything about a mag lock being permanent. An sks mag works just like a mag lock and it is not considered an "assault rifle"

Ar mag locks are sold all over NY. Dds ranch sells their rifles with mag locks filled with epoxy because it keeps the state police happy, not because that's what the law says.

If one can understand and get over the fact that the law is not written correctly, one can understand that as it is written, the SKS is indeed illegal because it can accept a detachable magazine if it has features.

It doesn't get prosecuted against because it doesn't but it could if they wanted to as per the exact letter of the law.

There was a time that standard bullet button equipped rifles were sold in stores too until someone decided that they didn't want them sold anymore. Same goes with rifles with the Tier 5 bolt Interrupter installed. Just because a store sells something, it doesn't mean it's legal. I almost bought regular magazines that the FFL was selling as preban until I let him know that they weren't preban and showed him the dates stamped on the magazine years ago. The same FFL's refuse to sell legal items too and say that they are illegal. I went through that when buying the Keltec KSG. 2 stores told me it was illegal. Hell. Bullet Guy used to sell 14.5 inch barrels that had muzzle devices glued on to make themt legal lengths instead of using the 2 approved ATF methods. There are many people that bought complete rifles from his store that think they have legal guns but instead have illegal SBR's. There is one guy I know of on this forum that has an illegal SBR purchased from Bullet Guy.

Gun stores and FFL's are human. They make mistakes, and aren't lawyers. You can't go by what a store sells. You can only go by what the law actually says to the letter without assumptions if you want to follow it.

 

[Jem45472]

@Willjr75
"Gun stores and FFL's are human. They make mistakes, and aren't lawyers. You can't go by what a store sells. You can only go by what the law actually says to the letter without assumptions if you want to follow it."

Which is why I don't epoxy mag locks. Thousands are being sold with with epoxied locks with the state police approval, although nowhere in law does it say anything about being permanent. The difference is California has bullet button written into law, NY has no such wording.

One of these days, some ballsey prosecuter is going to try to prosecute the wrong person and courts will settle this, but until then they know it's best not to charge on a safe act violation alone.

 

[Marine Cpl]

@Willjr75
"Gun stores and FFL's are human. They make mistakes, and aren't lawyers. You can't go by what a store sells. You can only go by what the law actually says to the letter without assumptions if you want to follow it."

Which is why I don't epoxy mag locks. Thousands are being sold with with epoxied locks with the state police approval, although nowhere in law does it say anything about being permanent. The difference is California has bullet button written into law, NY has no such wording.

One of these days, some ballsey prosecuter is going to try to prosecute the wrong person and courts will settle this, but until then they know it's best not to charge on a safe act violation alone.

From all the cases I've followed on these forums, they all pleaded out to lesser charges. My friends neighbor in CT, was offered a dismissal of the Assault Weapons charge but the weapon was confiscated.

I posted about it on the other forum.

 

[Jem45472]

From all the cases I've followed on these forums, they all pleaded out to lesser charges. My friends neighbor in CT, was offered a dismissal of the Assault Weapons charge but the weapon was confiscated.

I posted about it on the other forum.

Yes, that's happened in my town also although there was also a reckless endangerment charge also thrown in to make sure they took a plea.

Some day someone will fight it without a plea, and I don't see them losing. (Of course asides from the time and money it'll cost. But it will happen eventually.)

 

[meketrefe]

mag lock is idiotic but it is compliant as it leaves the AR pretty much useless.
NYSP during the education sessions they said it was compliant to make a magazine pinned or secured so it cannto be removed.

Everything else is just opinions and some dead horse beating too.



I guess that is why many people took the time to go to these BS sessions from NYSP.

 

[meketrefe]

Semiautomatic with afixed magazine. Can reload very fast from the top.
The 40's civilian "ass-haul" rifle.

 

[Acer-m14]

The law says "ability to accept a detachable magazine."

When you buy the magazine in the store, it is a detachable magazine. And with tools or heat, the rifle has the ability to accept a detachable magazine because you can always remove it and put in another one.

when i buy a Magazine .. on the package its says Magazine .. not Detachable Magazine ..

but what if the AR wont attach the Magazine .. pop it in and it just falls back out (no mag lock at all) LOL ..

 

[meketrefe]

when i buy a Magazine .. on the package its says Magazine .. not Detachable Magazine ..

but what if the AR wont attach the Magazine .. pop it in and it just falls back out (no mag lock at all) LOL ..

When you take a 30 round magazine and you put it upside down then it has 0 rounds because you substract 30-30 = 0 for being upside down.

 

[Jem45472]

mag lock is idiotic but it is compliant as it leaves the AR pretty much useless.
NYSP during the education sessions they said it was compliant to make a magazine pinned or secured so it cannto be removed.

Everything else is just opinions and some dead horse beating too.



I guess that is why many people took the time to go to these BS sessions from NYSP.

I wouldn't say useless. I use them on 2 ar pistols that without a doubt have more knock down power than my other pistols at home. Not too mention I can carry them loaded with me while traveling.

Now I would agree with you if you only have one rifle it shouldn't be a fixed mag.

 

[Jem45472]

when i buy a Magazine .. on the package its says Magazine .. not Detachable Magazine ..

but what if the AR wont attach the Magazine .. pop it in and it just falls back out (no mag lock at all) LOL ..

It still has an ability to accept a magazine. It does not with a lock installed.

 

[Marine Cpl]

when i buy a Magazine .. on the package its says Magazine .. not Detachable Magazine ..

but what if the AR wont attach the Magazine .. pop it in and it just falls back out (no mag lock at all) LOL ..

It still accepted it. Locking isn't a prerequisite for accepting.