New Military rifle?

[Robin]

https://taskandpurpose.com/army-next...-squad-weapon/

Interesting article, and it sounds like everything is set but the ribbon cutting.
Robin

 

[ProgSpear]

sure. and about 8 years of budget battles, litigation, and cancellations.

 

[togmaster]

Good. then the AR won't be considered a weapon of war anymore.

 

[Podmonkey]

Sounds and looks like fake news to me.

 

[Robin]

Yeah, it does sound kind'a fake, but It wouldn't surprise me if they had been doing a lot of testing away from public view for a number of reasons. I just hope they come up with a decent rifle that will be better than what we have and not a recycling of outdated tech, and caliber.
Robin

 

[SmallGameAddict]

Yeah, it does sound kind'a fake, but It wouldn't surprise me if they had been doing a lot of testing away from public view for a number of reasons. I just hope they come up with a decent rifle that will be better than what we have and not a recycling of outdated tech, and caliber.
Robin

Curious. What would you suggest, for rifle and cartridge.

 

[SmallGameAddict]

A lot of drama and sensationalism in that article. Hinting at very high chamber pressures. The M4, and the 5.56 aka .223 Rem are basically rehashed 1964 technologies, and they were on the drawing board years before that. The military has been trying to turn the .223 into a .243 Win for some time. Curious to see what they finally adopt. Certainly it will be some type of modular, easy takedown and accessory swap model. Most interested to see what cartridge they adopt, the caliber and velocity, bullet type.

 

[Robin]

Well now SmallGameAddict, that will certainly open a fire storm!!!! I am not all that knowledgable in the higher tech end of these things but have a pretty good working knowledge of what does work. With modern powders I think a cartridge like the 250-3000 could be made to work just fine, and that would be my minimum cartridge diameter. I think the 6.8 (.270) with a touch longer cartridge pushing a 125-130gr. ball near 3000 fps would be ideal. Its tough because I believe it has been proven, at least to the military, that lighter is better, and long range stopping power is a necessity, so I may not have the ideal cartridge but I not only think I'm in the ball park, but on base. The rifle,hmmm have to think on that but If at all possible, M4 size and six hundred yard performance, so maybe add an inch or two to the barrel. But the mechanics of that gun have been pretty well honed out and I don't see anything better,...........yet.
Robin

 

[SmallGameAddict]

Just for laughs, right or wrong, I'm going to look in my crystal ball here, and go out on a limb with a cartridge prediction. Assuming polymer cased ammo, which would achieve light weight with a larger case, I'm thinking a miniaturized version of the .284 Win case, with a large diameter body and rebated rim, to hold more powder and thus allow higher velocities in a compact case. Caliber between 6.5-7mm, due to ballistic efficiency vs. recoil, and their 600m capability parameter. Maybe a sort of mini 6.5-.284 Norma.

Edit: and think if you could depress a recessed button, and the upper slid right off...

 

[SmallGameAddict]

Well now SmallGameAddict, that will certainly open a fire storm!!!! I am not all that knowledgable in the higher tech end of these things but have a pretty good working knowledge of what does work. With modern powders I think a cartridge like the 250-300 could be made to work just fine, and that would be my minimum cartridge diameter. I think the 6.8 (.270) with a touch longer cartridge pushing a 125-130gr. ball near 3000 fps would be ideal. Its tough because I believe it has been proven, at least to the military, that lighter is better, and long range stopping power is a necessity, so I may not have the ideal cartridge but I not only think I'm in the ball park, but on base. The rifle,hmmm have to think on that but If at all possible, M4 size and six hundred yard performance, so maybe add an inch or two to the barrel. But the mechanics of that gun have been pretty well honed out and I don't see anything better,...........yet.
Robin

Thanks for the reply. It's all just conjecture, ideas and opinions. Everybody's got'em.

 

[oc shooter]

just as long as it's not based on the M16/M4 platform. time for something better

 

[ArmedCorgi]

Good. then the AR won't be considered a weapon of war anymore.

Good try, but I wouldn't count on it.

 

[ECU Pirates]

They had a picture of a Kel Tec shoutgun. Haha

 

[Podmonkey]

Folks, we need to consider that there has not been any advancement at all in firearms design on the mechanical side since the 40s. Thisbis because firearms are on a technical plateau right now. The recent advancements have been in materials, namely polymers, and in optics. We are not going to see anything dramatically different until we see a major technologic shift. Muzzle loading to breech loading, the move to cartridge based ammunition, black powder to smokless powder, these sorts of things.
Polymer cased ammo is not such a shift though it may be a enough of a refinement to induce the Army to replace the M16 series. A historical parallel would be the change from the heavy, round nosed bullets of the 30-03 to the lighter, spitzer pointed bullets of the 30-06 which was just enough of an improvement to induce the Army to rework the Springfield rifles, this despite the fact the Sprinflgfield Armory was already busting their ass to get the new rifles out the door and into issuance.

 

[SmallGameAddict]

Folks, we need to consider that there has not been any advancement at all in firearms design on the mechanical side since the 40s. Thisbis because firearms are on a technical plateau right now. The recent advancements have been in materials, namely polymers, and in optics. We are not going to see anything dramatically different until we see a major technologic shift. Muzzle loading to breech loading, the move to cartridge based ammunition, black powder to smokless powder, these sorts of things.
Polymer cased ammo is not such a shift though it may be a enough of a refinement to induce the Army to replace the M16 series. A historical parallel would be the change from the heavy, round nosed bullets of the 30-03 to the lighter, spitzer pointed bullets of the 30-06 which was just enough of an improvement to induce the Army to rework the Springfield rifles, this despite the fact the Sprinflgfield Armory was already busting their ass to get the new rifles out the door and into issuance.

All that's understood. I stand by my cartridge design, and I can design a modular replacement for the M16 platform rifles, using modern materials and technologies, in my head.

 

[Robin]

Heckler & Koch HK G11 Caseless Assault Rifle - Germany
Backin the 70's I read an article about the German development of a gun that fires careless ammo. I don't remember if the gun cited is the one but I do remember that it was a fully functional gun that passed several harsh condition tests.
Robin

 

[SmallGameAddict]

Heckler & Koch HK G11 Caseless Assault Rifle - Germany
Backin the 70's I read an article about the German development of a gun that fires careless ammo. I don't remember if the gun cited is the one but I do remember that it was a fully functional gun that passed several harsh condition tests.
Robin

I remember the US military testing that back then. For some reason, got shelved.

 

[Robin]

4.73x33mm Caseless - Mazeworld

 

[SmallGameAddict]

4.73x33mm Caseless - Mazeworld

I have a 1981 Gun Digest that has a piece in it about the technology as well.

 

[SmallGameAddict]

Who knows what Uncle Sam has developed in a lab in the middle of the desert in Nevada. I can only go with what I know.

 

[Robin]

 

[Robin]

They're out there trying, and like has been stated, who knows what is being developed out in the desert by the government that we won't know about. Probably a lot of private sector developing going on as well and they are even more secretive than our uncle, lot of money to be made coming up with the basic NATO weapon of the future.

 

[SmallGameAddict]

They're out there trying, and like has been stated, who knows what is being developed out in the desert by the government that we won't know about. Probably a lot of private sector developing going on as well and they are even more secretive than our uncle, lot of money to be made coming up with the basic NATO weapon of the future.

You got that right. Uncle Sam awarding your contract for a new military standard rifle would be HUGE $$$$

 

[Marine Cpl]

They should just issue. 45 ACP pistols and carbines. Aren't they man stoppers after all?

 

[Catskillkid]

They should just issue. 45 ACP pistols and carbines. Aren't they man stoppers after all?

Could get rid of the kevlar and just hand out standard issue GI frying pans if they did that.

 

[That_FNG]

guys relax, we all know its going to be the famous and super deadly .9mm I keep hearing about in the news.