How so? In that case just build it yourself completely.
non nfa sbr ar15 loophole?
- Thread starter Edwardteach72
- Start date
How so? In that case just build it yourself completely.
freddy
.308 Win
I don't follow what you're saying. AR pistol must be registered in NYS even if homemade. A complete Franklin Armory non-nfa "sbr" must be on the books also. Only way to keep off books is homemade (80% lower), and the "unrifled" barrel would allow length under 16" apparently.
Marine Cpl
.577 Tyrannosaur.
You know how they make rifled chokes for shotguns. Can one be made for this and if screwed on as a muzzle device, would it change the classification?
Prudii
.357 mag
This is just a several thousand dollar way to give the finger to the ATF. With the bottom of the AR15 market dropped so far it is entirely possible to build a 11.5" barrel pistol with a echo trigger and pay the $200 stamp and still remain around half what this thing costs.
gun_slinger_boy
.338 Win Mag
Pretty disappointing. I thought it would be something like a bullpup type of technology that brought the round from the mag back and up into the barrel. Kind of like the bond arms bullpup pistol. Oh well. Commence "pistol" builds.
Dinkus the Stinkus
.44 mag
Another video regarding how this works.
knuts
.45 acp
god damn that guy sucks at answering questions
Uzi
.308 Win
I'm not going to knock the idea of it. I can't say a pistol is really wildly different than an SBR rig, especially when you can shoulder them legally anyways.
This is obviously not new technology, but If they're offering the compatible barrels for sale, so you can do your own thing, that'll make a decent home defense SBR or close quarters PDW style weapon. I don't particularly like the idea of regular ammo keyholing at 50 yards with 5" groups, that's pretty awful, but realistically, it would probably be sufficient enough for a defensive alternative for many CQ scenarios.
This is obviously not new technology, but If they're offering the compatible barrels for sale, so you can do your own thing, that'll make a decent home defense SBR or close quarters PDW style weapon. I don't particularly like the idea of regular ammo keyholing at 50 yards with 5" groups, that's pretty awful, but realistically, it would probably be sufficient enough for a defensive alternative for many CQ scenarios.
Marine Cpl
.577 Tyrannosaur.
Although not pretty, I think if you want a legal, accurate CQB option this is a better option that isn't going to keyhole and limit penetration and accuracy.
ArmedCorgi
.475 A&M Magnum
I made it 2:44 in and couldn't watch anymore. I thought that guy was going to blast puke he was so nervous. I might consider this loophole when they sell just the barrel. I'll build my own for way less.
Guys.... you are all missing the point....
This thing is not a Rifle, Not a Pistol, And Not a Shotgun, If you were to buy THIS or buy the barrel and build one from an 80%, You could legally put together a Not So Friendly But Still NY Legal Not Rifle, with All the Evil features you want. Because they are not on a Semi Automatic Rifle, Shotgun Or pistol. Laws are Restrictive Not Permissive, and this thing does not meet the requirements of the law to be illegal.
As of January 15, 2013, the term “Assault Weapon” has been redefined as:
2 • A semiautomatic rifle that has an ability to accept a detachable magazine and has at least one of the following military characteristics:
a. Folding or Telescoping Stock
b. Protruding Pistol Grip
c. Thumbhole Stock
d. Second Handgrip or Protruding Grip that can be held by non-shooting hand
e. Bayonet Mount
f. Flash Suppressor
g. Muzzle Brake
h. Muzzle Compensator
i. A threaded barrel designed to accommodate the above
j. Grenade Launcher
• A semiautomatic shotgun having at least one of the following characteristics:
a. Folding or Telescoping Stock
b. Thumbhole Stock
c. Second Handgrip or Protruding Grip that can be held by non-trigger hand
d. Fixed magazine capacity in excess of seven rounds
e. An ability to accept a detachable magazine
• A semiautomatic pistol, able to accept a detachable magazine and has at least one of the following characteristics:
a. Folding or Telescoping Stock
b. Thumbhole Stock
c. Second Handgrip or Protruding Grip that can be held by non-trigger hand
d. Capacity to accept an ammunition magazine that attaches to the pistol outside the pistol grip
e. A threaded barrel capable of accepting a barrel extender, flash suppressor, forward hand grip or silencer
f. A shroud that is attached to, or partially or completely encircles, the barrel and that permits the shooter to hold the firearm with the non-trigger hand without being...
This thing is not a Rifle, Not a Pistol, And Not a Shotgun, If you were to buy THIS or buy the barrel and build one from an 80%, You could legally put together a Not So Friendly But Still NY Legal Not Rifle, with All the Evil features you want. Because they are not on a Semi Automatic Rifle, Shotgun Or pistol. Laws are Restrictive Not Permissive, and this thing does not meet the requirements of the law to be illegal.
As of January 15, 2013, the term “Assault Weapon” has been redefined as:
2 • A semiautomatic rifle that has an ability to accept a detachable magazine and has at least one of the following military characteristics:
a. Folding or Telescoping Stock
b. Protruding Pistol Grip
c. Thumbhole Stock
d. Second Handgrip or Protruding Grip that can be held by non-shooting hand
e. Bayonet Mount
f. Flash Suppressor
g. Muzzle Brake
h. Muzzle Compensator
i. A threaded barrel designed to accommodate the above
j. Grenade Launcher
• A semiautomatic shotgun having at least one of the following characteristics:
a. Folding or Telescoping Stock
b. Thumbhole Stock
c. Second Handgrip or Protruding Grip that can be held by non-trigger hand
d. Fixed magazine capacity in excess of seven rounds
e. An ability to accept a detachable magazine
• A semiautomatic pistol, able to accept a detachable magazine and has at least one of the following characteristics:
a. Folding or Telescoping Stock
b. Thumbhole Stock
c. Second Handgrip or Protruding Grip that can be held by non-trigger hand
d. Capacity to accept an ammunition magazine that attaches to the pistol outside the pistol grip
e. A threaded barrel capable of accepting a barrel extender, flash suppressor, forward hand grip or silencer
f. A shroud that is attached to, or partially or completely encircles, the barrel and that permits the shooter to hold the firearm with the non-trigger hand without being...
freddy
.308 Win
I like it a lot!
freddy
.308 Win
Please, if you don't mind, list the appropriate definition of rifle, shotgun, and pistol.
ArmedCorgi
.475 A&M Magnum
You are so right. However, so much of that is lost on a beat cop.
yeah, you are very right, But that doesnt mean when they sell the barrels i wont finish a receiver and slap on of these 4 moa (8moa) barrels ontop!
It's an easy battle to win, The problem is you;ve gotta go to court... But the right lawyer would probably do it No problem. Also... I dont normally get into situations where cops are checking out my guns....
Are you asking me Because it is so hard to find the ATF definition of the mentioned above? I dont really want to waste my time doing so, you need to cross reference write a bit to name all of them, and im not willing to do that even knowing you think you 'made your point' (whats the definition of a rifle?) But the guys over at Franklin Armory did their research and got classification and clarification from the atf basically saying its none of them. I mean Rifling is integral to a Rifle, it doesnt have it, nor is it a smooth bore. If you'd like to find more info about the non rifle / non shot gun from franklin armory, Watch the videos posted below.
Now on the other hand if you werent asking to prove a point... Well.... i sure sound like an @@@, My bad....
ArmedCorgi
.475 A&M Magnum
You and I know the deal. I'm just saying some beat cop who happens to catch you, for whatever reason at whichever time, may not be as knowledgeable as you and I and subsequently cause you much headache in sorting the legalities out.
freddy
.308 Win
No not looking to prove point. Just want to see what definitions you would present. Especially NYS definitions.
Nys penal code article 265, 11:
"Rifle" means a weapon designed or redesigned, made or remade, and
intended to be fired from the shoulder and designed or redesigned and
made or remade to use the energy of the explosive in a fixed metallic
cartridge to fire only a single projectile through a rifled bore for
each single pull of the trigger.
12:
"Shotgun" means a weapon designed or redesigned, made or remade,
and intended to be fired from the shoulder and designed or redesigned
and made or remade to use the energy of the explosive in a fixed shotgun
shell to fire through a smooth bore either a number of ball shot or a
single projectile for each single pull of the trigger.
And
Firearm" means (a) any pistol or revolver; or (b) a shotgun having
one or more barrels less than eighteen inches in length; or (c) a rifle
having one or more barrels less than sixteen inches in length; or (d)
any weapon made from a shotgun or rifle whether by alteration,
modification, or otherwise if such weapon as altered, modified, or
otherwise has an overall length of less than twenty-six inches;
"Rifle" means a weapon designed or redesigned, made or remade, and
intended to be fired from the shoulder and designed or redesigned and
made or remade to use the energy of the explosive in a fixed metallic
cartridge to fire only a single projectile through a rifled bore for
each single pull of the trigger.
12:
"Shotgun" means a weapon designed or redesigned, made or remade,
and intended to be fired from the shoulder and designed or redesigned
and made or remade to use the energy of the explosive in a fixed shotgun
shell to fire through a smooth bore either a number of ball shot or a
single projectile for each single pull of the trigger.
And
Firearm" means (a) any pistol or revolver; or (b) a shotgun having
one or more barrels less than eighteen inches in length; or (c) a rifle
having one or more barrels less than sixteen inches in length; or (d)
any weapon made from a shotgun or rifle whether by alteration,
modification, or otherwise if such weapon as altered, modified, or
otherwise has an overall length of less than twenty-six inches;
Although not pretty, I think if you want a legal, accurate CQB option this is a better option that isn't going to keyhole and limit penetration and accuracy.
What the fuck is this? Looks like a stock but also a hand from a mannequin connected to the stock connected to the gun??? How the hell isn' this a "sbr"
Side not same concept but Suarez international sells glock pdw kits. It's essentially a stabilizing brace keeping the Glock a handgun but also gives you something to make it useful like a cqb pdw
Marine Cpl
.577 Tyrannosaur.
Damn sight blockers -_- I'll have to look at this later. Confused me cause it still looks like a stock so I will look at it later
Thank you Google and no thank you this.... love the idea hate the execution, seems good for like hunting maybe or idk....
$99.99 id much rather have this PERSONAL DEFENSE WEAPON KIT FOR GLOCKS
Marine Cpl
.577 Tyrannosaur.
I didn't know they made that. Thanks. Hmmm.
Yes sir
livingston
20×102mm Vulcan
livingston
20×102mm Vulcan
Now that we finally know how Franklin Armory got the ATF to approve their we have even more questions.
They found a loophole which allowed them to build the barrel with straight rifling which avoids the classification as a pistol or rifle. This allows the gun to shoot a claimed 4 MOA with standard ammunition. What’s really intriguing are the new NERF football shaped projectiles which they are launching with the gun. These projectiles can be loaded in standard 5.56/.223 cases, and according the Franklin they bring the accuracy to 1 MOA at 100 yards.
BREAKING NEWS: The Franklin Armory Reformation Has Straight Rifling and Shoots Footballs | OutdoorHub
They found a loophole which allowed them to build the barrel with straight rifling which avoids the classification as a pistol or rifle. This allows the gun to shoot a claimed 4 MOA with standard ammunition. What’s really intriguing are the new NERF football shaped projectiles which they are launching with the gun. These projectiles can be loaded in standard 5.56/.223 cases, and according the Franklin they bring the accuracy to 1 MOA at 100 yards.
BREAKING NEWS: The Franklin Armory Reformation Has Straight Rifling and Shoots Footballs | OutdoorHub
Weird probably expensive, and still not offer anything over an ar pistol
gun_slinger_boy
.338 Win Mag
I wonder what the overall length of those nerf bullets are. It looks like they would be long and heavy for caliber. Subsonics maybe? If they are long it will reduce case capacity. Not to mention the problems that would arise from having powder engulfing the fins. If they could produce a projectile which allowed it to spin using the straight rifling this would be a winner.