NY and CT compliant "Other Firearm" Delta Level Defense.
- Thread starter OnSight Firearms Training
- Start date
Kirk_STNY
.45 acp
Marine Cpl
.577 Tyrannosaur.
It comes with a signed letter saying that it’s neither a rifle, shotgun, or a pistol and it’s classified as a just a plain firearm for federal purposes. That’s it. It doesn’t say that it’s Safe Act legal or Connecticut legal or any state legal and the ATF doesn’t have the authority to determine if it’s legal in a particular state. Just whether it’s legal federally and whether you need a background check for it or not or a tax stamp for it or not.
NY and the ATF have two different definitions on what is a firearm. The ATF’s definition only pertains to federal law in regards to you needing a federal background check for it or a federal tax stamp for it.
Now NY’s definition is a separate matter. It defines a firearm as a pistol or revolver or a rifle or shotgun that has a short barrel separate from the ATF’s definition . The Shockwave doesn’t fit NY’s definition so it’s in limbo according to NY law. That’s why it’s sold in stores. That’s the only reason. It isn’t because the ATF said that it was legal in NY.
To put what I just wrote into perspective, the ATF can include a letter saying that something that appears to be a rifle to an average person is actually a pistol. That doesn’t mean that you can own the pistol. You have to still follow your state laws on pistol ownership. The only thing that that particular letter would mean is that it’s a pistol and not a rifle.
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mikelowrey
.38 Special
Since the receivers are being categorized as "other" and not as pistol, rifle or shotgun, as per the definition of the law, wouldn't the law be irrelevant?
Marine Cpl
.577 Tyrannosaur.
No. An “Other” is just for background check purposes. It’s neither a rifle, pistol, or shotgun so it’s marked as an other. It’s not a rifle. Hmmm. It’s not a shotgun. Hmmm. It’s not a pistol. Hmmm. Mark it as an other.
An other can be built into a rifle, pistol, or shotgun however . It doesn’t stay an other forever unless you never build it into a pistol, rifle, or shotgun or you build it into something like the shockwave and then it becomes just a firearm.
You are confusing the federal term of firearm with an other. They are not the same thing.
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SuffolkArms
.40 S&W
What I don't understand is why any average guy off the street can't buy stripped Glock frames at FFLs without a pistol permit. It makes no sense, for all the state and FFL know you could be building that sucker up into a single shot Glock Carbine with a 16 inch non-functioning IGB barrel that is defective and can't cycle (they can sell you non-functional ones via email if you ask them).
Who's the state to say that the buyer doesn't intend to build this functional single shot rifle?
What I don't understand is why any average guy off the street can't buy stripped Glock frames at FFLs without a pistol permit. It makes no sense, for all the state and FFL know you could be building that sucker up into a single shot Glock Carbine with a 16 inch non-functioning IGB barrel that is defective and can't cycle (they can sell you non-functional ones via email if you ask them).
Who's the state to say that the buyer doesn't intend to build this functional single shot rifle?
Because a glock frame is the registered part with the ATF and per the ATF they are a pistol.
(A pistol can be built into a rifle, a rifle cannot be built into a pistol)
***edit*** those stripped glock frames you see for sale are not coming from glock as a stripped frame. They are purchased as a whole gun by the dealer who then parts them out
SuffolkArms
.40 S&W
That’s a good point, but even if that’s the case I find it hard to believe an FFL would transfer something that has never been built into a pistol like a Timberwolf Frame:
Lone Wolf Distributors
BDinPutnam
.475 A&M Magnum
Side note- thanks to @Willjr75 for the whole "other on a 4473 vs 'firearm per ATF'" thing, I was getting tired of typing it.
I believe that goes back to ATF making the call, if a manufacturer is going to make something that is serialized, they have to submit it to the ATF for approval before sales (Franklin Armory was doing this with the providence just recently)
fnfalguy
.308 Win
Ok, so to just slightly derail things. Picture the stock thingy below with the opening filled in solid, find a reliable 16" barrel if such a beast exists and then make your own frame with a Poly80 kit. Never been a pistol so no permit issues there. Thoughts, if for nothing more than the giant middle finger.
fnfalguy
.308 Win
Since I’m feeling like a dick tonight, i’ll refer you to the second sentence. As for readily removable, that can be addressed with a screw and rifle stocks are held in place with screws, so don’t go there. Not a federal issue as the virgin material is being built into a rifle receiver ala an 80% AR lower.
BDinPutnam
.475 A&M Magnum
Pretty sure High Point already makes that, @fnfalguy. 
DrBleachCocktail
.44 mag
I know this is an old thread but going back to topic, law enforcement are allowed to have these “others” correct?
Vapor
.308 Win
Last I knee several makers were selling then to anyone who can pass the bgc.
Stag for one, specifically has them on their website at a NY option.
Stag for one, specifically has them on their website at a NY option.
DrBleachCocktail
.44 mag
Yeah there’s a gun shop near me who sells a bunch of them, the controversy surrounding this firearm is too much to deal with though I will be getting one myself soon. I just wanted to know would a LEO be free to possess it and don’t have to worry about other Leo’s giving me a headache? Like @Marine Cpl said being caught with this would be a shit show that would involve lawyers, court proceedings and possible time incarcerated, so I’m just finding a way to avoid the shit show but still enjoy it freely.
Bob
6.5 Creedmoor
Read 265.20 and make your determination from there. You're the one who has to assume any risk. "I ready it on an internet forum" is not a valid defense if you get caught up in something.