NY stopping issuing permits for around 7+ months??

[US RIFLE M1A]

As far as I can tell so far, it will be a DCJS approved course, with DCJS approved instructors. No other courses/instructors will count towards the requirements. I hope I am wrong, but the people I talk to are in regular contact with DCJS.

DCJS: NY Div. Criminal Justice Svcs.

 

[whatupbo]

So this goes into effect in September , and if your permit was issued 3 or more years prior you have 1 year to renew with the training or it gets revoked? , but they won’t have guidelines on the course for 6-7 months? leaving about 4 months available for the 90K plus permit holders in Erie county alone? To try and find a trainer not to mention the tens of thousands of others in all the other counties….. is that the gist of it? I hope I’m understanding this wrong

 

[Saltwater60]

So this goes into effect in September , and if your permit was issued 3 or more years prior you have 1 year to renew with the training or it gets revoked? , but they won’t have guidelines on the course for 6-7 months? leaving about 4 months available for the 90K plus permit holders in Erie county alone? To try and find a trainer not to mention the tens of thousands of others in all the other counties….. is that the gist of it? I hope I’m understanding this wrong

It will be a mess for sure, that’s a given.

 

[Jmac00]

Some of us have taken many courses with certified trainers. I've repeatedly taken "Defensive Pistol" and "Pistol Accuracy and Accountability" with OFT. Great courses (which I'll be taking again in a few weeks). There is a group of frequent students who take at least 40-60 hours of pistol courses per year (not including rifle and shotgun courses).

What the heck is the state going to mandate that we learn in their "classroom" time and a mere 2 hours of live fire? Instruction on Article 35? It's not a long statute. Summarized simply: Only defend people if you must. Never defend "stuff."

I am positive that anyone who has done even moderately well in OFT's courses would breeze through any basic pistol competency test that our state could concoct.

It can still be argued that any training requirement on a right is unconstitutional. I'm inclined to agree. However, it remains prudent for anyone planning to carry a firearm to be voluntarily properly trained.

try getting into a IPSC competition, you'll learn how to shoot and move real fast. Genesee Conservation League use to have a shoot every Wednesday night. IDK if they still do. but the public was welcome. Just bring eye and hearing protection

 

[Acer-m14]

As far as I can tell so far, it will be a DCJS approved course, with DCJS approved instructors. No other courses/instructors will count towards the requirements. I hope I am wrong, but the people I talk to are in regular contact with DCJS.

DCJS: NY Div. Criminal Justice Svcs.

did a quick google .. only thing i found is they do training if you want to be a security guard





PS .. do the instructors have a phd or masters degree in teaching .. you know like the teachers at your local schools ??

 

[JackNeat]

I was wondering about keeping my permit with the arbitrary “sportsman/residence” restriction but at our gun club BBQ the pistol clerk surprised those that showed up with newly laminated urestricted permits…

Some people in NY government still believe in liberty and the Constitution.

And just like that it was taken back. I posted about this on Twitter under one of @gunpoliticsny posts and FPC reached out for more info.

A letter from the county attorney was sent out to anyone that received their unrestricted license from the clerk. It demands the unrestricted permit be returned or the matter would be referred to the Rockland Sheriff.

In Rockland, it’s the judges that are the ultimate authority on who gets their unrestricted license. So I guess they don’t care much what SCOTUS says because their excuse is they (judges) are waiting for guidance from Albany.

It is just a big fucked up ball of bullshit. I am hoping FPC will see merit in filing a lawsuit against the county. I would be 1000 percent in.

 

[MothMan]

Eff um!! Let the sherrif play pick up boy!

 

[Saltwater60]

And just like that it was taken back. I posted about this on Twitter under one of @gunpoliticsny posts and FPC reached out for more info.

A letter from the county attorney was sent out to anyone that received their unrestricted license from the clerk. It demands the unrestricted permit be returned or the matter would be referred to the Rockland Sheriff.

In Rockland, it’s the judges that are the ultimate authority on who gets their unrestricted license. So I guess they don’t care much what SCOTUS says because their excuse is they (judges) are waiting for guidance from Albany.

It is just a big fucked up ball of bullshit. I am hoping FPC will see merit in filing a lawsuit against the county. I would be 1000 percent in.

Wow. What a mess. I’d say the sheriff can come pick it up. Also how are you supposed to get it to them? That’s fucked up.

 

[US RIFLE M1A]

did a quick google .. only thing i found is they do training if you want to be a security guard

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PS .. do the instructors have a phd or masters degree in teaching .. you know like the teachers at your local schools ??

I did not see that you replied to my post or I would have gotten back earlier.

Understand that I am picking up snippets of information here and there. DCJS oversees the security guard licensing program in NY and certifies the instructors. Their requirements to become an instructor are way overboard, especially for the death-by-powerpoint, same-crap-every-year 8 hour unarmed annual refresher.

For example, instructors not only have to be certified by DCJS, they have to pay renewal fees every few years to keep their teaching creds up to date. Forget about the live-fire instructors, that is like beginning a whole new career to become certified as an armed instructor.

Whether it is the intention or not, from what I know of the system (I used to be an unarmed 8-hour annual class instructor) the system can barely handle 100 to 150 security guards in the NY county in which I work, and fewer than half of those are armed. Five-, ten-, twenty thousand license holders per county in the next three years is an absolute impossibility.

Add to that, the individual classroom must be personally inspected by DCJS for suitability. No way you are going to have your local NRA instructor in the basement of the local range knock out classes for large numbers of people. No way.

Forget about not carrying at WalMart. That will be overturned. The training is how they are going to kill CCW in New York if it stands, and if is enforced. I know three years sounds somewhat reasonable, hell, I could become an airline pilot in three years if I had better eyes.

However, imagine a landscape in which there is one privately-run DCJS-certified school for every three, four or five counties, and they are entirely booked for the next year or two. It's already like that for security, and you are talking a decimal of one percent of the number of class attendees.

It is an impossible situation.

 

[nortatoga]

And just like that it was taken back. I posted about this on Twitter under one of @gunpoliticsny posts and FPC reached out for more info.

A letter from the county attorney was sent out to anyone that received their unrestricted license from the clerk. It demands the unrestricted permit be returned or the matter would be referred to the Rockland Sheriff.

In Rockland, it’s the judges that are the ultimate authority on who gets their unrestricted license. So I guess they don’t care much what SCOTUS says because their excuse is they (judges) are waiting for guidance from Albany.

It is just a big fucked up ball of bullshit. I am hoping FPC will see merit in filing a lawsuit against the county. I would be 1000 percent in.

And Albany has not yet heard from the District Court as this case may need to be reheard by that Court.

 

[VietnamEraVet]

It will be a mess for sure, that’s a given.

I can't imagine what this would be like. Massive clusterfuck comes to mind, but seems an understatement. Also, not sure how I will handle training being down here in South Carolina. Schedule some vacation time and pay to fly to NY to sit in a classroom for a couple of days, - IF I could even get into an available course? As it is, I just had to take an 8 hour course (including 2 hours of live fire) down here for my SC CWP. And THAT was painful enough as it was! OMFG! Our SC Certified Instructor was a non-stop talker and she used an SC approved course that consisted of over 500 Power Point slides. The course ended up taking 10.5 hours...

The only good thing about it so far is that last year SC eliminated all costs for applying for a SC permit! Even fingerprinting was no cost. Go figure.

 

[US RIFLE M1A]

And Albany has not yet heard from the District Court as this case may need to be reheard by that Court.

That is also going to make the training requirement even worse than it already is.... No school is going to dedicate resources to something which is currently winding its way through the courts, especially when they are already booked doing armed and unarmed security, non-resident (Utah, Florida) permit classes, etc.

 

[JackNeat]

Wow. What a mess. I’d say the sheriff can come pick it up. Also how are you supposed to get it to them? That’s fucked up.

I brought it back to them on Friday. The clerks really are excellent here and I wanted to ask them what was going on personally. They said it was the judges that got involved after hearing the clerks were honoring requests to remove restrictions. They also said no amendments for removing restrictions can be processed until the judges decide so.

the messed up part (one OF THE MANY) is the judges don’t need direction from Albany as every county has been granted authority to run the CCW program as they see fit by the licensing officers (in Rockland’s case that is the county judges)… I am not wrong on that am I? So the judges real bosses are SCOTUS and they appear to be directly violating SCOTUS and using some BS about needing guidance from Albany.

 

[nortatoga]

That is also going to make the training requirement even worse than it already is.... No school is going to dedicate resources to something which is currently winding its way through the courts, especially when they are already booked doing armed and unarmed security, non-resident (Utah, Florida) permit classes, etc.

You are correct!

 

[masterswimmer]

And just like that it was taken back. I posted about this on Twitter under one of @gunpoliticsny posts and FPC reached out for more info.

A letter from the county attorney was sent out to anyone that received their unrestricted license from the clerk. It demands the unrestricted permit be returned or the matter would be referred to the Rockland Sheriff.

In Rockland, it’s the judges that are the ultimate authority on who gets their unrestricted license. So I guess they don’t care much what SCOTUS says because their excuse is they (judges) are waiting for guidance from Albany.

It is just a big fucked up ball of bullshit. I am hoping FPC will see merit in filing a lawsuit against the county. I would be 1000 percent in.

You broke rule number 1.

First Rule of CCP Holders Club: Don't talk about CCP Holders Club.

 

[Grimscale]

I know three years sounds somewhat reasonable,

Not to me it doesn't.
Unless NY is picking up the tab for this, and telling businesses they have to provide a paid day off so people can take this "class", it sounds like an unConstitutional poll-tax to me.
Name ONE other Right where people are required to have this kind of training before they can exercise it. Worse, that training is supposedly being set by the very people who were told "YOU CAN'T TOUCH THIS RIGHT" in language as plain as day.

 

[Saltwater60]

If NYS can’t hold up their end they can’t take out permits away. I know I don’t trust them either, but I don’t even think they will go that far. They will delay or modify the requirement that if you’re enrolled or something your fine.
Also remember the 12 month rule for current holders and then it goes to three years. This will be a mess. County clerks have already spoken out saying this is impossible to do and enforce. They don’t have enough people to meet one on one and look through social media accounts.

 

[Grimscale]

So maybe we all need to just let our pistol permits lapse. And, when NY tries to tell us we need to turn in our guns, point to the Supreme Court decision that states we have the Right to purchase pistols for defense in our homes.
It's not ideal that we cannot carry to defend ourselves, but once Sept. hits we won't anyway.
But not participating in NY's unConstitutional pistol permitting scheme and giving them a big "eff-you" and keeping our guns is at least a decend 2nd place award.
At least until the lawsuits get the rest of this crap thrown out.

 

[Deplorable Me]

Ignorance of the law is no excuse, but there are a lot of ignorant assholes making these half baked draconian laws.

 

[Saltwater60]

Ignorance of the law is no excuse, but there are a lot of ignorant assholes making these half baked draconian laws.

Works for the politicians though?? Hilary Clinton specifically comes to mind.