NYSRPA v. Bruen, NY 2A Case Supreme Court case and decision

[livingston]

Was she not an "elite" of the time?

The niece of President Theodore Roosevelt (1858-1919), Eleanor was born into a wealthy New York family. She married Franklin Roosevelt, her fifth cousin once removed, in 1905. By the 1920s, Roosevelt, who raised five children, was involved in Democratic Party politics and numerous social reform organizations. In the White House, she was one of the most active first ladies in history and worked for political, racial and social justice. After President Roosevelt’s death, Eleanor was a delegate to the United Nations and continued to serve as an advocate for a wide range of human rights issues. She remained active in Democratic causes and was a prolific writer until her death at age 78.

Eleanor Roosevelt

Eleanor Roosevelt’s Early Years Anna Eleanor Roosevelt was born on October 11, 1884, in New York City. Her father, Elliott Roosevelt (1860-1894) was the younger brother of Theodore Roosevelt, and her mother, Anna Hall (1863-1892), was from a wealthy New...

www.history.com

 

[JaguarJaguarGolf]

Was she not an "elite" of the time?

I have no doubt that she was. She had a NY State Trooper Sargent assigned as her protective detail full-time.

 

[Cooolone]

I'd love to see someone apply and just say "To express my support for the 2nd ammendment in any place it's legal to do so".

Not hunting, or target shooting, or self defense, but for political expression. Deny this permit and you violate at least 3 amendments.

Anyone whom ever asked me, I instructed:

"For all legal purposes"

That's it! No explanation needed, no "NEED" exhibited other than whatever is legal. Who can question this basis? Nobody, unless they're making a choice to institute Arbitrary and Capricious application to the determination!

 

[FP1201]

The bolded part is what is illegal. A blanket ban on people exercising their right to self defense.
That they try to justify it by requiring people to jump through their hoops for PERMISSION to exercise that Right, ie: "see judge, we allow it a little", flies in the face of the 2nd Amendment.

Permitting schemes, especially those of tyrannical States like NY and CA, are completely unConstitutional in multiple ways. Not just for their infringement of the 2nd, but the "poll tax" that is applied to a Right, and "requirements" to exercise a Right.
What other Right REQUIRES that you get training before you can exercise it?

"I'm sorry, Mr Smith, but to plead the 5th you are required to undergo at least one year of mandatory law training."

It's all horseshit.

NY Judges have known for decades the whole Handgun Licensing Law was being violated by placing "Administrative Restrictions" and then self-affirming its validity (aka Legislating from the Bench) and this was likely done to keep a Civil Rights case from manifesting from which it ultimately did. If you won't issue a Licenses to someone otherwise qualified (sans the "good reason" clause) they you're arbitrarily denying the Right to own a Handgun. That "Target Shooting and Hunting only" clause has no basis in Law, does not appear in PL400. or in 265. and the State Police we ordered to not take any action against someone allegedly violating those restrictions as there is no Law or penalty for carrying outside those conditions except the threat of the Judge revoking it. Remember, there are only two types of Licenses: Premis or Carry, and now you cannot be discriminated simply wanting the ability to protect yourself and those in your charge.

 

[gun_slinger_boy]

2 good ones.

 

[Edwardteach72]

View attachment received_820196072285625.mp4

 

[JackNeat]

I’ve listened to a few weekly radio programs so far and almost all the experts on the programs all agree the implications of this ruling are going to help smash down some laws passed and give “wishlist” laws (AWB) a status of D.O.A.

It will take money & lawsuits but gun control laws are set to fall.

 

[Gunright]

So...
While I own quite a few firearms (rifles, shotguns) I've never applied for a NY pistol permit. I never did so because of my feelings on NY "may issue" vs. my relatives in PA who were able to get a concealed carry (LTC) in 20 minutes by visiting the local sheriff.

Given the case outcome, I'm thinking of putting an application in but:
a) specifying "All lawful purposes" for the "reason".
b) leaving the character witness section blank

Now, I certainly could provide character witnesses, including current CC friends from my gun club. But, with the ruling, I should NOT have to do so FUKH.

(I am not worried about finger printing or background checks as I've had them done numerous times over my life. )

Thoughts?

I plan on leaving this cess pool of a state, perhaps as early as spring/summer 2023.

 

[DoOver]

 

[4WHLDRFTN]

I plan on leaving this cess pool of a state, perhaps as early as spring/summer 2023.

itll prob take that long

 

[Phazer]

So...
While I own quite a few firearms (rifles, shotguns) I've never applied for a NY pistol permit. I never did so because of my feelings on NY "may issue" vs. my relatives in PA who were able to get a concealed carry (LTC) in 20 minutes by visiting the local sheriff.

Given the case outcome, I'm thinking of putting an application in but:
a) specifying "All lawful purposes" for the "reason".
b) leaving the character witness section blank

Now, I certainly could provide character witnesses, including current CC friends from my gun club. But, with the ruling, I should NOT have to do so FUKH.

(I am not worried about finger printing or background checks as I've had them done numerous times over my life. )

Thoughts?

I plan on leaving this cess pool of a state, perhaps as early as spring/summer 2023.

The state still has the right to vet permit applicants. As long as people meet the state's criteria, they can no longer deny a full carry permit. That said, if you do not meet the state's criteria for a permit, they do not have to issue one. Ergo, if you do not provide character attestations, they will deny your application.

 

[spat]

The state still has the right to vet permit applicants. As long as people meet the state's criteria, they can no longer deny a full carry permit. That said, if you do not meet the state's criteria for a permit, they do not have to issue one. Ergo, if you do not provide character attestations, they will deny your application.

But character attestation themselves are an arbitrary form of the "good character" requirement.

Unless they come down to a simple yes or no question to each reference.

At that point they are just "can you find 4 people who say you should have a gun". A bar any gang banger in good standing could easily pass.

 

[Dr. Evil]

View attachment 164070

Gun safety, not gun control. It is so easy to fool the sheep.

 

[ManualF150]

What drives me crazy is that they call a gun a "weapon". Technically to me and many others its akin to a "tool". But the word "weapon" sounds scary to the general public.

I still call and refer to guns as tools, just as a knife is a tool to me.

 

[NYCGuy]

But character attestation themselves are an arbitrary form of the "good character" requirement.

Unless they come down to a simple yes or no question to each reference.

At that point they are just "can you find 4 people who say you should have a gun". A bar any gang banger in good standing could easily pass.

Funny, I went back and forth with them on this today. I actually got them to admit in writing that they plan to continue their subjective “it’s up to your licensing officer” process when it comes to the “good moral character” garbage.

 

[maverick52]

View attachment 164070

Your damn right we are happy and your damn right we will use the ruling to attack your bullshit legislation!

 

[Gunright]

Funny, I went back and forth with them on this today. I actually got them to admit in writing that they plan to continue their subjective “it’s up to your licensing officer” process when it comes to the “good moral character” garbage.

That's why I thought something like this would be a good and necessary test case. Someone who just moved here wouldn't have four local references, so that in itself should violate shall issue reasonableness constraints. (It might be different if they allowed the references to be from any location.)

Who is the "them" that you went back and forth with, and are there more details you can share?

 

[NYCGuy]

That's why I thought something like this would be a good and necessary test case. Someone who just moved here wouldn't have four local references, so that in itself should violate shall issue reasonableness constraints. (It might be different if they allowed the references to be from any location.)

Who is the "them" that you went back and forth with, and are there more details you can share?

Troopers’ pistol permit office.

 

[cedmer]

Thats never been a thing. Carrying outside of any restrictions had no criminal penalty. The worst that could happen is the issuing judge gets wind of it and takes away your license.

Response from Rockland County clerk is they have no decisions yet on existing CCW w/restrictions. They said within a week or possibly 2 they are expecting to have clarification.

I guess they are waiting on the Tyrants special session to happen.

I'm on my way for an amendment tomorrow, does this means they are not processing any pistol permit related thinghy?

 

[FP1201]

The niece of President Theodore Roosevelt (1858-1919), Eleanor was born into a wealthy New York family. She married Franklin Roosevelt, her fifth cousin once removed, in 1905. By the 1920s, Roosevelt, who raised five children, was involved in Democratic Party politics and numerous social reform organizations. In the White House, she was one of the most active first ladies in history and worked for political, racial and social justice. After President Roosevelt’s death, Eleanor was a delegate to the United Nations and continued to serve as an advocate for a wide range of human rights issues. She remained active in Democratic causes and was a prolific writer until her death at age 78.

Eleanor Roosevelt

Eleanor Roosevelt’s Early Years Anna Eleanor Roosevelt was born on October 11, 1884, in New York City. Her father, Elliott Roosevelt (1860-1894) was the younger brother of Theodore Roosevelt, and her mother, Anna Hall (1863-1892), was from a wealthy New...

www.history.com

Thank you for the synopsis of her life, but the question was rhetorical; she was very much an "Elite" and deserving the title.

 

[nortatoga]

So...
While I own quite a few firearms (rifles, shotguns) I've never applied for a NY pistol permit. I never did so because of my feelings on NY "may issue" vs. my relatives in PA who were able to get a concealed carry (LTC) in 20 minutes by visiting the local sheriff.

Given the case outcome, I'm thinking of putting an application in but:
a) specifying "All lawful purposes" for the "reason".
b) leaving the character witness section blank

Now, I certainly could provide character witnesses, including current CC friends from my gun club. But, with the ruling, I should NOT have to do so FUKH.

(I am not worried about finger printing or background checks as I've had them done numerous times over my life. )

Thoughts?

I plan on leaving this cess pool of a state, perhaps as early as spring/summer 2023.

You do realize that the character reference's are part of the background check?

 

[FP1201]

That's why I thought something like this would be a good and necessary test case. Someone who just moved here wouldn't have four local references, so that in itself should violate shall issue reasonableness constraints. (It might be different if they allowed the references to be from any location.)

Who is the "them" that you went back and forth with, and are there more details you can share?

I get what you're saying and may well be right, but until the dust settles I'll just bet your application would be rejected... put it in and see.

 

[spat]

Funny, I went back and forth with them on this today. I actually got them to admit in writing that they plan to continue their subjective “it’s up to your licensing officer” process when it comes to the “good moral character” garbage.

Lawyers bills don't come out of their pocket (or even budget) so they DGAF.

As long as government officials are allowed to exempt themselves from the torture system they have no incentive not to abuse their power.

 

[JackNeat]

I'm on my way for an amendment tomorrow, does this means they are not processing any pistol permit related thinghy?

I don’t know… I think they will take your amendment application now as they haven’t stopped processing. I think they will hold it until the decision is made what to do. They could either say everyone now has un unrestricted if you already have a CCW or they (more likely) will say you need to do this “x” and then we will give you the amendment. I don’t know… nobody seems to know right now. NYS is going down kicking and screaming.

 

[Egret-II]

NYS is going down kicking and screaming.

I know right? Other states quickly fell. But the state that lost the lawsuit still fighting.

 

[dwa12479]

So...
While I own quite a few firearms (rifles, shotguns) I've never applied for a NY pistol permit. I never did so because of my feelings on NY "may issue" vs. my relatives in PA who were able to get a concealed carry (LTC) in 20 minutes by visiting the local sheriff.

Given the case outcome, I'm thinking of putting an application in but:
a) specifying "All lawful purposes" for the "reason".
b) leaving the character witness section blank

Now, I certainly could provide character witnesses, including current CC friends from my gun club. But, with the ruling, I should NOT have to do so FUKH.

(I am not worried about finger printing or background checks as I've had them done numerous times over my life. )

Thoughts?

I plan on leaving this cess pool of a state, perhaps as early as spring/summer 2023.

IF this is true why bother to put yourself through the cost and aggravation of applying? You might not even have an approval by then.

 

[Acer-m14]

You do realize that the character reference's are part of the background check?

we should have that on Voting then ...

there so called backgound check should be noting more of .. can you pass a NICS checks to buy a firearm .. yes / no .. until we get rid of nics ..

 

[Acer-m14]

IF this is true why bother to put yourself through the cost and aggravation of applying? You might not even have an approval by then.

a new law suite to be filed if denied ..

 

[Dr. Evil]

Column: Is California ready for more Black people to legally carry guns in public?

The Supreme Court says the 2nd Amendment covers the right to carry guns in public. But for Black people, the calculation has always been more complicated.

www.latimes.com

Remind me who the racists are again.

 

[Gunright]

You do realize that the character reference's are part of the background check?

Since the character references require references from NYS, that discriminates against new residents to the state. Under May Issue, they can say tough tittles. But under Shall Issue, one would think that a NICS check should suffice (or allowing for out of state references).

All I am pondering here is the fact that unless challenged, nothing is changed.

ETA: If the NRA or NYSRPA were on the ball (not saying that they are), they should be trying to line up a set of these kinds of situations to go after the state.