SmallGameAddict
.308 Win
Actually after awhile she volunteered MAYBE...when we have $5.5k hanging around not spoken for
Opinions wanted re: Colt M4
- Thread starter SmallGameAddict
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ArmedCorgi
.475 A&M Magnum
Well....one is made from Martha Stewart's vagina and the other isn't.
SmallGameAddict
.308 Win
I'm not holding my breath. The new tractor isn't paid for yet.
dwa12479
.338 Win Mag
Ah, but its all perspective now. Suddenly $2,500 plus optics etc seems VERY reasonable to the wife.... lol.
SmallGameAddict
.308 Win
Truth!
dwa12479
.338 Win Mag
Look honey, I'm so FRUGAL!!! HAHA!
$1,000 of the price is from the barrel which is this weird hybrid sleeved with resin filling thing. Its also a proprietary receiver set since it is the AR equivalent of a long action. Also the handguard is out of 7075 aluminum as opposed to 6061 alloy almost every other manufacturer uses. Its also a low production run item. It's like getting an Accuracy International or a Sako TRG, it's about the highest of the highest end of AR rifles. I think they should do a .338 Lapua model though, of you are gonna go stupid bucks on a rifle like that you may as well go for broke I says.
SmallGameAddict
.308 Win
Agreed. No regrets.
I've fancied a .300 Win Mag for use as a long range rifle for some time actually, although it would likely be a bolt-action.
The prices of ammo and components have brought my long range ambitions to a screeching halt.
ArmedCorgi
.475 A&M Magnum
So...... you're getting a Colt, right?
SmallGameAddict
.308 Win
I'm leaning towards the Centurion Arms Lightweight M4. At any rate I've got plenty of time to think it over.
SmallGameAddict
.308 Win
My thoughts are this D, you're into it for $1k, why not spend $500 more?
ArmedCorgi
.475 A&M Magnum
Only two reasons...
1: As with every AR I've built or bought, I always end up spending more to upgrade it from it's original configuration (even if it had everything I wanted at the time). I've bought AR's and ended up upgrading everything on them to the point that the only thing left of the original was the barrel. So that extra $500, would set you up nice for your own personal upgrades as you see fit over time. AR's are all the same at their core.
2: It's a Colt.
SmallGameAddict
.308 Win
Ok
The only upgrades I foresee are...
1) the trigger. A piss poor trigger drives me nuts.
2) A suppressor
ArmedCorgi
.475 A&M Magnum
We all say that.
Seriously though, unless you are the type who likes to leave it alone, you will get the bug to modify the gun.
I'm not advocating for Colt necessarily. I know that there are better options. I've just always been skeptical of spending 2k on an AR. I'll spend 2k on an AR, that I put together, but not one from a manufacturer. AR's are just too easy to build to be spending that kind of money on an off the shelf deal.
SmallGameAddict
.308 Win
As far as modifying an AR, of that I am uncertain. I confess to modifying my bolt-actions. I look at them, get a vision and see more potential with various doodads.
The AR, I honestly can't say. A reliable weapon, well made and adequately accurate with a good trigger will suit me. It will be hanging above the front door. In case of emergency break glass.
ArmedCorgi
.475 A&M Magnum
And you don't need to spend 2k off the bat for that level of quality in an AR.
If you are modifying bolt actions, modifying AR's will be like taking candy from a baby.
SmallGameAddict
.308 Win
Duly noted. All input and opinions from trusted knowledgeable individuals highly valued.
Food for thought. The primary objective of the thread.
I think a person should have at least 1 AR15 from a reputable manufacturer in their collection, very particularly if that rilfe is to be used for defense. The mix master Franken AR can come next and if one should find they completely fucked up the spec on their rifle one has a solid backup.
The CM4 ain't 2k, it's $1,450 MSRP, pre panic Street price was $1,200. When the company first started offering full rifles for sale a few years ago they went for a mere $900. Centurion Arms builds their stuff right, to the proper specs in all key areas.
This is my HD carbine:
Looks pretty similar don't it? That is my NYGF build, I have about $1,200 into it and it's not even quite on par with a CM4, doesn't have that nice FN CHF barrel. It has a Ballistic Advantage barrel which is very nice but not as good. It's done well for me but it has had a glitch here and there to iron out and I had my DD backing it up while this one was out of service. The DD sits in reserve as my Recce "partizan's" rifle.
I really disagree with the notion that ever AR has to be a home build. You should have a mix and it nice to have a warranty and a great customer service department backing you up. And again with a reputable manufacturer (like Centurion Arms and Daniel Defense) you can be assured that all the tolerances, all the fasteners and everything else is properly assembled, installed and torqued to the proper specs. It's the little details, like the gas keys being properly torqued and and staked that can often be overlooked but can make a big difference in function.
The CM4 ain't 2k, it's $1,450 MSRP, pre panic Street price was $1,200. When the company first started offering full rifles for sale a few years ago they went for a mere $900. Centurion Arms builds their stuff right, to the proper specs in all key areas.
This is my HD carbine:
Looks pretty similar don't it? That is my NYGF build, I have about $1,200 into it and it's not even quite on par with a CM4, doesn't have that nice FN CHF barrel. It has a Ballistic Advantage barrel which is very nice but not as good. It's done well for me but it has had a glitch here and there to iron out and I had my DD backing it up while this one was out of service. The DD sits in reserve as my Recce "partizan's" rifle.
I really disagree with the notion that ever AR has to be a home build. You should have a mix and it nice to have a warranty and a great customer service department backing you up. And again with a reputable manufacturer (like Centurion Arms and Daniel Defense) you can be assured that all the tolerances, all the fasteners and everything else is properly assembled, installed and torqued to the proper specs. It's the little details, like the gas keys being properly torqued and and staked that can often be overlooked but can make a big difference in function.
ArmedCorgi
.475 A&M Magnum
All based on Colt's TDP. Do either of those companies have or ever have had a military contract to build the m4?
ArmedCorgi
.475 A&M Magnum
And I say that, with the understanding that Colt isn't the end all be all. That other companies have pulled past Colt's level. I just find it funny that at one point Colt was the standard and now it's considered on the level of Delton. Granted, as a company, they have made very dumb decisions and yes, have most likely rested on their laurels way too much. Fact remains they bought the design from Armalite and developed the TDP on the platform that all other companies have based their product off of. That has to count for something.
The owner of Centurion Arms Monty LeClair was the one that defined the original specs for the Mk12 SPR during his time as a SEAL. His company also manufactured tge first runs of the Mk 12 but had to contract them out to PRI as he didn't have tge production capacity at the time.
Daniel Defense had military contract for the RIS II M203 compatible quad rail for SOCOM and has had subsequent contacts for their handguards with other branches. The have had contracts for full rifles with national militaries and police organizations.
Lewis Machine and Tool suppllies the L129A1 DMR to tge Bitish Army and the MARS-L infantry carbine to New Zealand were it is the standard issue infantry arm.
None of this is really relevant though since Colt deviated from their own TDP spec during tge AWB years with their large hole pin setup and frankly Colt's AR build quality has not been been tge top standard for some decades now. Simply put you can do better, for less money, with more features than Colt from a variety of manufacturers.
Which is all moot anyways since Colt stopped selling new manufacture AR15s anyway.
I firmly standby my recommendation of tge Centurion Arms CM4 as an excellent choice for a standard configuration AR15 fighting carbine. For target or competition use their are certainly better choices out there.
ArmedCorgi
.475 A&M Magnum
So tell me, who's rifle did I really buy when I bought my Colt?
The problem with Colt is they just didn't keep up with the demands of the civilIan market which has always been that company's MO all along which is why they are now owned by CZ. The real shame is that Colt had a few AR models that would have down very well in the civilIan market had they just made them available. It's too late now.
When did you buy it? The wholesale subcontracting didn't start until relatively recently.
For the record as soon as the AWB sunsetted tge first thing I did was buy a "For LE Only" marked Colt 6920 (large hole) and I found it to be a most excellent rifle. That was when it was all Colt, inhouse.
ArmedCorgi
.475 A&M Magnum
I totally agree. Colt has made very bad business decisions. They likely got arrogant.
That said, holding the Colt that I bought in my hands, I can tell it's a quality rifle. It's not a piece if shit in the slightest.
I can also remember a time when Bushmaster was considerd the Cadillac to Colt's Chevy. Which just goes to show that people's perceptions are often inconsistent and not particularly reliable.
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ArmedCorgi
.475 A&M Magnum
June of this year. I believe the rifle was made in October of last year. All the research I've done leads to more questions than answers. If there is one thing I have found to be consistent about Colt's manufacturing in recent years, it's that they are inconsisent in markings. Cage numbers here, a "c" there, dates on the barrel or no dates. People are hung up on this shit like it's life or death. Very few companies make everything in house. Colt is no different now that they no longer make rifles for the US military.
ArmedCorgi
.475 A&M Magnum
My point exactly!
I tell you what though, Centurion Arms and Daniel Defense do make an excellent product and both have outstanding customer service. I can personally attest to that on both counts.