Marine Cpl
.577 Tyrannosaur.
How so?
Presidential seal... this is pretty funny
- Thread starter Curmudgeon
- Start date
BDinPutnam
.475 A&M Magnum
American steel prices rise because their competition is priced out of the market. Great for American steel companies. Because now they have no competition so they can charge whatever they want.
At some point the premium on non-US steel AND the premium on artificially protected US steel is too steep and auto manufacturers need to either eat the premium, lower their overhead, or pass the premium on to customers.
Any of it is artificial and hurts workers and consumers not in the protected industry. So yeah those steelworkers can go to Kissimee and spend their money- until their company runs out of customers because those manufacturers cant afford (or cant charge) the difference. Then what?
Marine Cpl
.577 Tyrannosaur.
So the price of imported steel will be the same as homegrown steel. The price of the car goes up. By how much. Hundreds of thousands? No. Just a little. So Instead of financing your car at $24999 you now finance it at $26999. No big difference. American will easily pay the difference. Hell. I just bought a Jeep 2 years ago because it was cool and I didn’t like my Subaru. We have the money. New cars are out there everywhere I see.
Remember back in the day when TV’s from Zenith and Panasonic cost about a grand? We still bought them.
Wow, you certainly seem to know how people should be spending their money better than said people. And belive the government should be helping it along.
How is this NOT socialism again?
BDinPutnam
.475 A&M Magnum
@Willjr75 you really are painting yourself into a statist if not necessarily socialist corner.
I still want to know what the "it" you referred to earlier vis a vis legislation should be.
Btw your example of televisions is interesting because both brands you mention are/were... Japanese.
I still want to know what the "it" you referred to earlier vis a vis legislation should be.
Btw your example of televisions is interesting because both brands you mention are/were... Japanese.
Marine Cpl
.577 Tyrannosaur.
Well whatever American tv then that we used to buy back in the day. And import tariffs isn’t socialism. I don’t know where you get that from.
BDinPutnam
.475 A&M Magnum
Like I said. Statism, maybe not socialism.
Can you even name any of those American branded televisions you bought?
Marine Cpl
.577 Tyrannosaur.
Just looked up the definition. Nowhere close. But if wanting to charge countries that import goods here that charge us for the same and wanting Americans to make car seats here rather than Mexicans making them in Mexico makes me a statist, than I will wear that label proudly.
America First. God bless the American worker.
BDinPutnam
.475 A&M Magnum
Let's see . You are stealing money via tariffs to spread the wealth to other Americans, because you know better where I should spend my money.
Socialism (n) :a political and economic theory of social organization which advocates that the means of production, distribution, and exchange should be owned or regulated by the community as a whole.
"America First. God bless the American worker."
It literally sounds textbook.
I'm an American worker. Where do I opt out of paying higher prices for my goods? I come first right?
Marine Cpl
.577 Tyrannosaur.
You have the choice to not buy foreign or American goods if you don’t want to. Nobody is forcing you to buy anything.Let's see . You are stealing money via tariffs to spread the wealth to other Americans, because you know better where I should spend my money.
Socialism (n) :a political and economic theory of social organization which advocates that the means of production, distribution, and exchange should be owned or regulated by the community as a whole.
"America First. God bless the American worker."
It literally sounds textbook.
I'm an American worker. Where do I opt out of paying higher prices for my goods? I come first right?
Marine Cpl
.577 Tyrannosaur.
Any American worker. Pick one. God bless the American factory worker or God bless the American Hardware Store owner.
I try to go to my local hardware store instead of Home Depot or Lowe’s. My choice. Nobody forces me to pay an extra dollar for wrench I buy there but I do it to support them. He in turn will take my dollar and use it to buy his kid an ice cream cone at the local creamery. And so on.
Except they are. Government is steering my hand to buy a certain product via tariffs.
Because they know what is good for me. As do you apparently.
Now what about me as the worker? The one that wants the cheapest wrench possible because that's what I want to spend on one? The one that no longer exists because the government said "thou shalt not send wrenches here without paying the piper, thereby increasing the cost for the American worker."
Marine Cpl
.577 Tyrannosaur.
Same as the Chinese guy that can’t Buy our wrenches.
What?
Marine Cpl
.577 Tyrannosaur.
The Chinese guy in China won’t buy an American wrench because we have to pay tariffs to import our wrenches there and it’ll be to expensive . So the American wrench maker is assed out. Meanwhile according to your plan, the Chinese wrench maker can import his wrench here to the USA without cost and put the American wrench maker out of business because it’s cheaper.
Great plan. Go China!
...so imposing a tariff that will make the Chinese guy not buy American wrenches helps the American worker. Got it.
Honest question: Have you ever taken a basic economics course? It's no big deal if you haven't , I mean you can be a senator in Vermont without doing that, but you are sounding like one.
Marine Cpl
.577 Tyrannosaur.
No. It helps the American worker because you will buy the American wrench.
The Chinese guy in China never buys American wrenches because we have to pay to import them to China.
What is this bizarro world? It’s a simple concept to understand. No economics course needed.
Why don't you tell me a little more about what I will and should do with my money, to help the party?
I'm learning so much.
Marine Cpl
.577 Tyrannosaur.
What is it you were saying Darth? That you’d rather American businesses go out of business?Why don't you tell me a little more about what I will and should do with my money, to help the party?
I'm learning so much.
Any business that can't stand on its own without government help should go out of business.
That's how the economy works.
Marine Cpl
.577 Tyrannosaur.
It’s not government help. It’s charging another country what they charge us. Why should we fuel another country’s economy?
"We" should not be doing anything.
I should buy what I want, unhindered, and you should buy what you want , unhindered. You can spend as much money as you want on "the American worker." Hell, pay double the cost. Your choice.
Having to pay a tariff on a good I want , because the consumer pays them, not the company, is taking away that ability.
It's the government choosing winners and losers and, yet again, the American people lose.
And it's obviously government help.
"My wrench costs $5."
"Mine costs $3."
"That's unfair."
*government waves magic tariff wand*
"My wrench costs $5."
"My wrench costs $5 now."
"Hey guys, I've got my $3 to buy a wrench, and $2 for an ice cream for my boy afterwards.
""Sucks to be you."
Marine Cpl
.577 Tyrannosaur.
Sorry.
I would agree with you if China didn’t charge us anything. But they don’t. They charge us for everything we export over there.
Talking about economics. What is better for the economy of this country? You saving 2 bucks on a wrench or the American worker not working or the American business not being able to operate?
After the American economy tanks, you won’t be able to even buy a wrench. But hey... You saved 2 bucks yesterday and tomorrow you are unemployed.
Big picture. You always fail to see it.
"We" should not be doing anything.
I should buy what I want, unhindered, and you should buy what you want , unhindered. You can spend as much money as you want on "the American worker." Hell, pay double the cost. Your choice.
Having to pay a tariff on a good I want , because the consumer pays them, not the company, is taking away that ability.
It's the government choosing winners and losers and, yet again, the American people lose.
And it's obviously government help.
"My wrench costs $5."
"Mine costs $3."
"That's unfair."
*government waves magic tariff wand*
"My wrench costs $5."
"My wrench costs $5 now."
"Hey guys, I've got my $3 to buy a wrench, and $2 for an ice cream for my boy afterwards.
"Sucks to be you."
I would agree with you if China didn’t charge us anything. But they don’t. They charge us for everything we export over there.
Talking about economics. What is better for the economy of this country? You saving 2 bucks on a wrench or the American worker not working or the American business not being able to operate?
After the American economy tanks, you won’t be able to even buy a wrench. But hey... You saved 2 bucks yesterday and tomorrow you are unemployed.
Big picture. You always fail to see it.
spat
.700 Nitro Express
How does it help the American plumber who need to spend more on his wrench?
I am not wholly anti tariff, but the government never produces a net benefit, whatever they give one worker they take from another.
Tariffs are economic warfare. They should be used like a military to wage war for the national interest. They do not help American workers or consumers in general, and should not be used for that purpose any more than warfare should be used to prop up defense contractors.
They may help a specific worker, but like all tax money, they do it at the expense of another.
Marine Cpl
.577 Tyrannosaur.
It doesn’t help him specifically since he’ll pay $8.95 for his American wrench instead of $5.95 for his Chinese wrench but it isn’t going to kill him.
It does help however the American worker who makes and sells American wrenches. Now when more people buy his wrenches, he can expand his business, buy better machinery to make wrenches easier and faster and possibly lower the price since more are sold. In turn, he’ll higher extra support staff to handle the extra orders.
All this is happening now but not to us. It’s instead happening to the Chinese. They just got 100 more orders to Home Depot because Home Depot sold them out. Unfortunately, the American guy just got told by Home Depot that they will not be ordering anymore because they cannot sell them. Now the American closed up shop and laid off 5 employees who will in turn collect unemployment. Our taxes just went up because of that. 2 of those 5 employees just applied for welfare.
The Chinese just opened up another wrench plant to fulfill all those extra orders. Chinese investors just loaned him x amount of dollars to open that plant. They’ll be getting a handsome return on their investment and will now do the same to the guy who sells screws because business is booming. Those Americans are making us rich.
Yet again, you know what is best for the budget of others.
Pay a little more. It isn't going to kill you. It will benifit your fellow man. Spread the wealth.
spat
.700 Nitro Express
Why should home depot stock the American wrenches when Americans want the Chinese ones more ?
You will claim that Americans are dumb to buy the cheap Chinese crap rather than the better quality American stuff. I'll even agree with you on that most of the time, but that doesn't mean the government should interfere.
The idea that "the average American is too dumb to do this right, so the government needs to force them to do the right thing" is the core of leftist ideology, and is very very dangerous.
Why not eliminate the regulations that are making the American wrench maker so uncompetitive that the Chinese guy can ship them halfway around the world and still out compete ?
Sure, the Chinese tariff on corn hurts the American farmer who wants to sell his corn in China, but it is no barrier at all to the American making wrenches who wants to sell them to Americans. There is no Chinese tariff in any form that can do that long term.
Marine Cpl
.577 Tyrannosaur.
No. It has nothing to do with the government thinking the American is dumb or forcing them to do the right thing. It’s the government fucking China back since they fuck us. Fair is fair.
You want to gouge us? No more. You will lose your biggest customer.