Sharps 25-45 AR ?? interesting
- Thread starter Jmac00
- Start date
Robin
.577 Tyrannosaur.
25-45, sounds good to me.
Robin
Robin
kev74
20×102mm Vulcan
American Rifleman had a nice write-up on it a while back. It looks interesting. Now lets see if it catches on.
I'll post this purely as a counter point to generate further discusion.
Why The .25-45 Sharps Is The Worst New AR Round - The Firearm Blog
What say you @meketrefe? Aside form your profound love of the 7mm.
Why The .25-45 Sharps Is The Worst New AR Round - The Firearm Blog
What say you @meketrefe? Aside form your profound love of the 7mm.
meketrefe
.450/400 Nitro Ex
IMO the writer might not be aware of the supersonic whisper/blackout anemic loads.
This is like anything.... do you reload? What kind of animal or objective you need to tackle?
I think the 6x45 and 6TCU do better and they are super simple for someone who reloads but
there might be a reason for the 25 if one has already bullets from other casings / calibers.
In terms of simplicity out of the box the 6.8 is hard to beat with all that extra power and
reliability.
...many of these writers are a joke because they talk w/o context nor purpose.
I guess anyone can become a writer. The whole thing is so boring...
Nothing to learn there.
It feels like the gold rush of the AR calibers but nobody knows where they are going nor why.
This is like anything.... do you reload? What kind of animal or objective you need to tackle?
I think the 6x45 and 6TCU do better and they are super simple for someone who reloads but
there might be a reason for the 25 if one has already bullets from other casings / calibers.
In terms of simplicity out of the box the 6.8 is hard to beat with all that extra power and
reliability.
...many of these writers are a joke because they talk w/o context nor purpose.
I guess anyone can become a writer. The whole thing is so boring...
Nothing to learn there.
It feels like the gold rush of the AR calibers but nobody knows where they are going nor why.
Okay, but considering the high terminal performance and now wide availability of 75-77gr 5.56 does the 22/45 sharps offer enough over the .223/5.56 to justify itself.
I guess for a deer hunter, yes it would.
Personally though I hunt paper, steel and the occasional milk jug. Even when considering SD I think the 5.56 is wholly adequate.
I do find the 22/45 Sharps interesting since I find the 6mm a facinating caliber, though perhaps better served at heavier, slipperier bullet weights.
I guess for a deer hunter, yes it would.
Personally though I hunt paper, steel and the occasional milk jug. Even when considering SD I think the 5.56 is wholly adequate.
I do find the 22/45 Sharps interesting since I find the 6mm a facinating caliber, though perhaps better served at heavier, slipperier bullet weights.
meketrefe
.450/400 Nitro Ex
In places one cannot legaly hunt with a 22 caliber the 25 is a great alternative using 223 brass w/o trimming.
The 6x45 and 6TCU even better and with the bullet assortment for hunting it does actually make a difference
in the 85 to 95 grain in short distances.
It all depends on the legalities and animals one needs to harvest as well as the distances.
In many cases probably many people will do just fine with the 223 but a 6 TCU is very easy too and the
assortment of bullets for hunting starts where the 223 ends.
Having an extra upper in one of these calibers is also economic and brass is plentiful and free.
the thing with the 25 caliber vs. the 6mm and 6.8 is the restricted assortment and extra cost but there
are some good ones.
The 6x45 and 6TCU even better and with the bullet assortment for hunting it does actually make a difference
in the 85 to 95 grain in short distances.
It all depends on the legalities and animals one needs to harvest as well as the distances.
In many cases probably many people will do just fine with the 223 but a 6 TCU is very easy too and the
assortment of bullets for hunting starts where the 223 ends.
Having an extra upper in one of these calibers is also economic and brass is plentiful and free.
the thing with the 25 caliber vs. the 6mm and 6.8 is the restricted assortment and extra cost but there
are some good ones.
What are the 6x45 and 6TCU? I thought the 22/45 Sharps was just a 223/5.56 necked up to 6mm? How are the other ones different?
Also I've been thinking about the 6.5x47 Lapua, while it seems to be losing out in popularity vs the 6.5 creedmore, perhaps it would serve as an ideal host for heavy 6MMs? Maybe it might even be my ideal 5.56/7.62 replacement cartridge, which the 22/45 could not be.
Also I've been thinking about the 6.5x47 Lapua, while it seems to be losing out in popularity vs the 6.5 creedmore, perhaps it would serve as an ideal host for heavy 6MMs? Maybe it might even be my ideal 5.56/7.62 replacement cartridge, which the 22/45 could not be.
meketrefe
.450/400 Nitro Ex
25x45 is a 223 case in .25 caliber.
6x45 & 6mm tcu are a 223 case in 6mm caliber.
Not much different but the better 6mm balistics and huge assortment put it on top for many uses.
The 6.5x45, 260, creed are all the same.
Too much powder for 6mm.
The 6mm BR lapua is plenty and it is ine of the most effixient and accurate 6mm rounds ever made.
For an autoloader the smaller shoulder angle of the 260 is much better vs creedmore or 6.5x47 30 degrees that is too much.
Ok for the civilian use but for a rigouros use.
6mm -6.8 is a very nice wildcat too for those who reload.
Like the 6x45 and tcu run bautifly in the ar15.
6x45 & 6mm tcu are a 223 case in 6mm caliber.
Not much different but the better 6mm balistics and huge assortment put it on top for many uses.
The 6.5x45, 260, creed are all the same.
Too much powder for 6mm.
The 6mm BR lapua is plenty and it is ine of the most effixient and accurate 6mm rounds ever made.
For an autoloader the smaller shoulder angle of the 260 is much better vs creedmore or 6.5x47 30 degrees that is too much.
Ok for the civilian use but for a rigouros use.
6mm -6.8 is a very nice wildcat too for those who reload.
Like the 6x45 and tcu run bautifly in the ar15.
6mm-6.8 sounds intriguing. I imagine there would be OAL issues in an AR15 sized action with heavy 6mm bullets?
meketrefe
.450/400 Nitro Ex
Are 100 to 105gr heavy enough?
I would think so, plenty in fact. The only goal I'd have in mind is balancing long range performance with full auto controllability in light carbines. I think heavy, high BC bullets launched at moderate velocites lend themselves to this goal. But if said requirment can be met at lighter weights then fine.
Eddie Gunks
.338 Win Mag
meketrefe
.450/400 Nitro Ex
The benefits of the 6x45, 6tcu, 25x45 as many others similar are:
- You take a 223 / 5.56 case, run it through the die and presto! (Free brass)
- Make the caliber legal for hunting in those places the 22 is not.
- Up to 6mm and 25 they stack perfectly in standard 223 magazines all the way to 30 rounders.
- About 25-30% performance gain with many loads and within the 300 yards depending on bullets.
- Here is where the 6mm wins due to the huge selection of bullets for varmint, hunting and long range.
- 6mm long range bullets are amazing but they need a longer COAL. the advantage here is that they
can feed from a centerstack magazine retrofit up to 2.45-2.5" that take 6 to 10 rounds depending on
model plenty for long range.
- Supersonic performance close to the 6.8 with potentially less expense (Potential free brass and cheaper
bullets) but again better the 6mm due to the assortment.
- In the shorter range the 6.8 is hard to beat with extra speed but then the 6mm has more sectional
density for same weight. (depends on game animal or other objective I guess)
- It seems to me the .25 would make sense for those who already have a 25 caliber in other casing
who want to share bullets or want a couple of commercial loads option. If one reloads there is
no context. A 6mm will do a lot more things and better.
-Either one is a good and easy way to get extra performance vs. the anemic whisper/blackout and
even the 7.62x39.
-If one gets an upper in 6x45 or tcu there is a good argument to get also a light bolt action
becasue they show bench rest accuracy and they are dirt cheap to feed with amazing bullets
including long range.
With a 1:8 twist a 105gr hornady loaded at 2.45 coal with Hodgdon CFE gives an amazing
precision shooter supersonic up to 1100 yards and on a fraction of a budget. It leaves the Grendel
in the dust for that kind of shooting. Loaded milder it gives an alternative "trainer" to a
tactical rifle with larger and heavier 6.5 and 308 loads. Do more with less.
With my limited shooting,,,hunting only and some target shooting. The fact that I have 1000 cases for 6.8, half loaded, half empty. Shooting ranges of up to 400yds or less......I guess I cant find the need for a 25-45. Plus from what I gather the 6.8 does a better job out of a shorter barrel. Soooooo looks like I cant come up with a reason to build another gun. At least not yet.
Bought the 1000 cases for 6.8 back when LWRC was doing load testing,,,,got them pretty cheap, dont remember price
Bought the 1000 cases for 6.8 back when LWRC was doing load testing,,,,got them pretty cheap, dont remember price
meketrefe
.450/400 Nitro Ex
if you have 6.8 brass, stick with it. I also have a few thousand cases and will never get rid of this powerhouse.
I might even use the brass to make a 6mm-6.8 or 6mm wasp.
I might even use the brass to make a 6mm-6.8 or 6mm wasp.
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meketrefe
.450/400 Nitro Ex
6.8, ... stick with it. (sorry ..always fighting sausage-like fingers and auto-correct while fast typing.
Lemme alone! Its near as damnit to .243 innit? Who knows with the goofy naming conventions of cartridges anyway? What bullets do you load for this cartridge then? Light .257 Roberts bullets?Hey monkey boy! It is a 25 cal! 25/45
If you work up some 6mm-6.8 wildcats you will have my rapt attention. What is the 6mm Wasp?
ManrisFrack
6.5 Creedmoor
Speaking of 6.8 brass, word has it that Starline started making it and it will hit the market in a month or two.
Black Hole (I guess they're Columbia River Arms now) does a bunch of 6.8 based cartridges including a 6x6.8. Barrel starts at $345 and I think it just takes a 6.8 bushing die with a couple different sizes to neck down the 6.8.
meketrefe
.450/400 Nitro Ex
Great. I heard something. Most brass i have is hornady and ssa from ammo I biught bulk.
The problem with black hole is that they are a hit and miss. They sell some good barrels but sold me two with horrible mistakes. Good people on the phine but it took months to fix the situation that was never fully fixed.
Even dor cats there are better consistent makers and cost is still reasinable. Pacnor has a good list. I have been very lucky with Lothar Walter custom shop. Others i do them myself.
With rhe 6mm wasp reamers and diea there is no need for more exotic cats.
meketrefe
.450/400 Nitro Ex
6mm wasp is a reamed cat that is perfect for the 6.8 case. One could also shortchamber a 6mm hagar and then have the dies cut but the wasp is eaaier, straight up.
Reamers ad dies are readily available wo having to reinvent the wheel.
Perfect for the AR15 and 6mm lovers.
And it would be suited for launching up to 105gr pills from an AR15?6mm wasp is a reamed cat that is perfect for the 6.8 case. One could also shortchamber a 6mm hagar and then have the dies cut but the wasp is eaaier, straight up.
Reamers ad dies are readily available wo having to reinvent the wheel.
Perfect for the AR15 and 6mm lovers.
Robin
.577 Tyrannosaur.
Sharps 45-70.
Robin
Robin
meketrefe
.450/400 Nitro Ex
Yes. It will be a tad behind the mighty 6mmBR.
You also have the 6mm grendel. The thing with the 6.8 and its derivates we remove the bolt strength concerns of tbe grendel and 7.62x39. This is also the huge benefit of the 223 and its offspring aside from inexpensive or even free brass.
What about necking up the larger 22s to 6mm, say the 22-250?
Marine Cpl
.577 Tyrannosaur.
Wildcats suck balls. They are totally useless for useful applications. There is nothing they can do that . .223 or .308 cannot do.
meketrefe
.450/400 Nitro Ex
We were talking before about fitting this in the ar15 right?
The 6mm-250 does not fit.
Another problem is that it needs a large bolt face but if you find the bolts and eztensions then the 6mmbr or a 6mm dasher will work great. Socom bolts cannot be used due to the higher pressures required for these rounds.
If you chamber with a socom bolt and load lets say 6br at lower pressures it dedeats the purpose.
A br case like any other wide case will stack up to 6 rounda in a 7.62x39 10 round mag.
The dimension restrictions require some type od trade off all the time, right?