spat
.950 JDJ
Well then, I guess if NATO gets involved in Ukraine, it will be on the grounds of national security too.
Does Putin really want that to happen ? Maybe he should quit threatening other peoples national security.
Things are heating up in the Donbass
- Thread starter holdover
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Does Putin really want that to happen ? Maybe he should quit threatening other peoples national security.
holdover
.475 A&M Magnum
Your not all wrong there, Nato doesnt want russia there either,
breaking Ukraine in half like Germany was is the best deal for NATO and Russia
spat
.950 JDJ
I think Trump will tell Zelensky to accept that Russia owns some of Ukraine now and deal with it.
And I think he will tell Russia that if they try anything else it will be the last thing they try for a century.
And I think Ukraine will end up in NATO.
I think either Ukraine ends up in NATO, or they will withdraw from the no proliferation treaty and become a nuclear power again.
Either way, Russia will absolutely be shut down.
Whether Ukraine gets to keep the bits of Russia they have seized is an open question.
I think Zelensky has to take that deal, or he's cut off and Russia will overrun him.
And I think Putin has to take that deal or his military will be effectively eliminated.
The extremely small knowledge I have, is I think what Russia is saying that is unique about this new variant, is that it has some sort of customizable and modular variations on multiple independent reentry vehicles. It can carry a combination of inert vehicles, decoys, multiple nuclear warheads etc.... that's seems to be the most interesting development with this weapon otherwise it's basically the same as every other tried and true ICBM or IRBM
spat
.950 JDJ
Pretty shitty deal for Ukraine though.
I'm not sure why you guys think Russia should get a say though.
Does Ukraine get a buffer between *them* and Russia ? Seems like they've got the best case for being someone who needs it.
NATO doesn't need a buffer because they would curb stomp Russia in any conflict.
A buffer doesn't help Russia either, because they would get curb stomped in any conflict either way.
spat
.950 JDJ
That was brand new, 40 years ago.
It is not anything special anymore.
The next big thing is going to be Musk's starship dropping the price to orbit so low that things like Rods from God become economical.
I can see the US military having real sci-fi shit like orbital drop paratroopers complete with heavy weapons like tanks.
Imagine delivering a complete tank battalion from Vandenberg to anywhere on earth in 45 mins. Good luck defending against that.
One thing I think the world has learned in this testing ground is you cannot allow an offensive to bog down and become static where defensive positions can be created to build trenches and infrastructure for drone operations. In any future war speed and continued sustainment will be key to prevent an enemy from doing what has happened here where there are thousands of casualties for kilometers of gains. It's very WW1 all over again. There's going to be some sort of new age blitzkrieg doctrine created to counter. Everything old is new again.
We're right back at 1920-30s army doctrine study and experiments
I bet this is more real than people realize
Lockheed Martin SR-72 - Wikipedia
Boeing YAL-1 - Wikipedia
There's probably mature technology that we are not aware of.
spat
.950 JDJ
I think it's a lesson we learned in WWII, nothing new.
It's just that nobody has failed the blitzkrieg quite so spectacularly as Russia did when they tried it.
I think the real lesson is "when the blitzkrieg fails, you need to abandon the territory and regroup, not start digging trenches".
Most scuds that were launched never went above 4. Designed to go 5, but rarely made it. Shooting that down, compared to one traveling 10 is much different.
The losing nation always gets the shaft.
Some losers get a little bit of lube to make it less miserable, others not so much
spat
.950 JDJ
They were also getting shot down by PAC-2 Patriots who's ABM capability could best be described as "in Beta testing". They were officially just SAMs that had some brand new software hacks added to enable their use as ABM.
2025 NATO airbases would be defended by THAAD that is specifically designed to shoot down exactly the type of missile that the Oreshniks are.
They won't be infallible, but they will be fairly effective. I doubt Russia can afford enough Oreshniks to make a significant difference to NATO operations.
They would also be immediately targeted by NATO, and would be very quickly eliminated along with any Russian air defenses.
holdover
.475 A&M Magnum
There are various reasons for that, One is that the accuracy , range and effectiveness, of newer antitank weapons on both sides capable of hitting tanks out to 5 miles , The use of GPS guided weapons, and of course drones and real time satellites.
And I believe the Russian army and especially the leadership, was not ready to go to war .
on the other hand the Russians defeated everything NATO threw at it , and Ukraine wasnt much better on the offense than the Russians .
Its like the American civil war where the weapons out paced the tactics
spat
.950 JDJ
I think the biggest factor is thwarting the initial Russian attack was their failure to bring enough fuel...
holdover
.475 A&M Magnum
Sure thats it.
holdover
.475 A&M Magnum
Warmongers argue we must protect Ukraine because it’s a “democracy”
Warmongers argue that we must protect Ukraine because it is a “democracy.” But they’re lying. Ukraine isn't actually a democracy. To hold onto power, Ukraine...
www.youtube.com
holdover
.475 A&M Magnum
Good history lesson on the situation in Ukraine
The front lines are collapsing Russians are breaking through
TEOTWAWKI inc.
.338 Win Mag
Statement from National Security Advisor Jake Sullivan | The White House
In September, the President announced a surge in security assistance for Ukraine to put Ukrainian forces in the strongest possible position before he
View attachment nope.MP4
Speaker Mike Johnson says there will be no new funding for Ukraine under Biden:
"It is not the place of Joe Biden to make that decision now. We have a newly elected president, and we're going to wait and take the new Commander-in-Chief's direction on that. I don't expect any Ukraine funding to come up."
Good.
Speaker Mike Johnson says there will be no new funding for Ukraine under Biden:
"It is not the place of Joe Biden to make that decision now. We have a newly elected president, and we're going to wait and take the new Commander-in-Chief's direction on that. I don't expect any Ukraine funding to come up."
Good.
He doesn't really say it and they routinely go back on their word.
Been quite a few days... Still no nukes..... Bummer.
I wonder how many people can put together what is happening in this region today and the year 1990??
Well of course there won't: Congress couldn't pass an emergency government funding Bill in the weeks left of Biden in Office...must be double-speak is a RINO prerequisite too.
One of the impact craters from Oreshnik missile.
www.youtube.com
Воронка от ОРЕШНИКА в бетоне! ЮжМаш. г.Днепр
Вот такая воронка в бетоне получилась от одной болванки гиперзвуковой ракеты ОРЕШНИК в городе Днепропетровск (Днепр) на заводе ЮЖМАШ.
www.youtube.com
Robin
.577 Tyrannosaur.
What price glory?
nationalinterest.org
Robin
2,000 Daily Casualties: Russia's Military Is Paying an Awful Price in Ukraine War
The Russian invasion of Ukraine has reached its 1,000-day mark, with Moscow’s forces suffering over 700,000 casualties and significant losses in modern military equipment. While Russia has made territorial gains in places like Avdiivka and Vuhledar, these advances come at an extraordinarily high...
nationalinterest.org
What price glory?
Robin2,000 Daily Casualties: Russia's Military Is Paying an Awful Price in Ukraine War
The Russian invasion of Ukraine has reached its 1,000-day mark, with Moscow’s forces suffering over 700,000 casualties and significant losses in modern military equipment. While Russia has made territorial gains in places like Avdiivka and Vuhledar, these advances come at an extraordinarily high...
Bullshit stats. NATO is losing this proxi-war. They can't hide it, so they inflate Russian loses to save face. Every time the media reports on Ukrainian retreat they tell about Russian loses, which they have no way of knowing.
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Both sides are downplaying their own losses and inflating the losses of their enemy.
The conflict is an absolute modern hellscape and there are a shit ton of people on both sides getting killed and wounded. 1 month of this war probably has more casualties than the US in a decade of GWOT.
Entire battle groups are getting decimated and becoming combat ineffective. That hasn't happened on a scale like this in a long time.
But yes, Russia is winning (at a high cost) and Ukraine is losing (at a high cost).