Weak hand shooting

[Justincase]

At the range yesterday I tried shooting with my weak hand for the first time. Holy jeeze, what an awkward endeavor. I'd swear my left hand is smaller than my right as I couldn't seem to get the purchase on the grip like I can with my right. Shooting normally, my two hands work in conjunction with one another, weak handed it feels like one hand is holding the gun, and the other is just there along for the ride. I'm practicing this cuz I hope to participate in my club's PPC league, and this is one element of the competition. Does anyone have any pointers or experience with this?

 

[kev74]

Practice practice practice. Lots of dry firing. The more you do it the more comfortable you'll become with it.

 

[diggs223]

If you don't have one get an air pistol. Cheaper, you can shoot at home, no noise or recoil to distract or misinterpret. Shoot till you get comfortable then switch over to your pistol.

 

[Justincase]

If you don't have one get an air pistol. Cheaper, you can shoot at home, no noise or recoil to distract or misinterpret. Shoot till you get comfortable then switch over to your pistol.

That's good advice. I started with my PPQ 22. Would've been ugly with any of the 9mm's

 

[wirehairfan]

Practice makes perfect... and careful with your thumbs, don't want to get slide bite.

 

[Podmonkey]

I used to hate weak side practice. Then one of @dsdmmat's matches required weak hand stance and I ended up enjoying the endeavor, even if I didn't win that category I did better than I expected.
I think finding ways to make training fun and interesting is crucial.

 

[togmaster]

It sucks but with training it becomes manageable. I like training that takes you out of your comfort zone. Even if you never have to use that skill it's good to know you have the ability.

 

[Eddie Gunks]

I find my wrong hand to be more accurate. It is probably because i am concentrating more on the fundamentals. It is not as fast though.

I hurt my right elbow one year. I bought a wrong hand holster just so i could shoot the season. Most awkward thing for me was reloading.

It was so much fun when people wanted to shoot “weak hand” on a stage.

Just practice. That is all you can do.

 

[MilesTeg]

I've found off hand shooting with 2 hand very difficult. What I've found is easier is to shoot one handed off hand. Also with that I seem to naturally want to and the gun more than I would expect. There's no need to force the gun plumb, hold it naturally in your hand and you will see better accuracy.

 

[tapper3]

I'd swear my left hand is smaller than my right as I couldn't seem to get the purchase on the grip like I can with my right. Shooting normally, my two hands work in conjunction with one another, weak handed it feels like one hand is holding the gun, and the other is just there along for the ride. I'm practicing this cuz I hope to participate in my club's PPC league, and this is one element of the competition. Does anyone have any pointers or experience with this?

From what you say here it sounds as though you were using a two hand grip but holding the gun in your left hand rather than your right hand as you would normally do. If so, let me run a few thoughts by you.............

If someone told you that you would be expected to shoot with your weak hand in the PPC league I suspect what they meant was weak hand ONLY. I shot PPC years ago and, honestly, don't recall any weak hand shooting at all but that may just be an old man's memory. But I have never seen shooting with the weak hand supported by the strong hand in any pistol shooting discipline - USPSA, IDPA, PPC. So you might want to check to see if what was meant was weak hand only shooting.

If that turns out to be the case then there are some things you can do to make weak hand only shooting more tolerable. What I have found works for me is to "mirror" the grip and stance I use when shooting strong hand only. I quarter away from the target with the foot on the gun side (whichever side) more forward (closer to the target) and I bend that forward knee a bit more than normal, make my stance a little more aggessive. I make a fist with my non-shooting hand and bring it to my chest and really clench that whole arm into my chest. This tightens up the entire upper body and helps with bringing the gun back on target after recoil.

The only thing I do differently when shooting weak hand only is I cant the gun inward a bit -- maybe 30-45 degrees. Not full on gangsta style, maybe half gangsta. What this does for me is it utilizes the bigger muscles on the outside of my forearm to hold the gun steady. I have, however, seen guys shoot weak handed holding the gun completely vertical as they do with their strong hand. Try both.

You will, of course, continue to sight the gun with your dominant eye no matter which hand you hold it in. And one thing to keep in mind is to keep your finger well OFF the trigger until you are settled on that first target. I can't tell you how may premature ejaculations I have seen over the years as guys draw the gun with the strong hand, transfer to the weak hand, and get on that trigger too early. You can get away with prepping the trigger as you come on to a target when shooting with your strong hand. But your weak hand trigger finger is not as experienced as the one on your strong hand. Be patient with that first shot.

Try these techniques and with a little practice it will become quite easy for you. I hope this helps.

 

[stokes]

When I had to shoot "weak hand" on our annual re-qual it was "unsupported" or one handed.The practice was in case your strong hand was injured.As tapper said,strong hand was across the chest,protecting the vitals.I would clench my fist and put it under my shooting armpit,gives a lot of support to your weak hand when shooting.

 

[Criticalt]

As @MilesTeg said, I find 2 hand weak side strange to say the least. However, 1 hand weak is as easy as strong side one hand.
After alot of 1 hand weak side practice I incorporated my other hand, lightly at first, then proper after more practice.
Now im equally accurate and comfortable either way.

 

[Eddie Gunks]

tapper said,strong hand was across the chest,protecting the vitals.

Ha ha ha. Protecting vitals from what? X-rays? Bullets? Maybe knives? Strong words?

 

[nortatoga]

You think weak-side handgun is awkward try it with a rifle! We do a tactical practice match at my Club and the match director usually throws in a weak-side position, could be standing, kneeling or prone! But we have Fun just the same!!

 

[Justincase]

I've found off hand shooting with 2 hand very difficult. What I've found is easier is to shoot one handed off hand. Also with that I seem to naturally want to and the gun more than I would expect. There's no need to force the gun plumb, hold it naturally in your hand and you will see better accuracy.

I felt the same thing only using one hand. It wasn't too bad, but once I tried a two handed grip, it was very unwieldy. It was like my right hand wasn't doing anything at all.

 

[kev74]

Ha ha ha. Protecting vitals from what? X-rays? Bullets? Maybe knives? Strong words?

Hand across the groin protecting the vitals?

 

[Carlos Hathcock]

At the range yesterday I tried shooting with my weak hand for the first time. Holy jeeze, what an awkward endeavor. I'd swear my left hand is smaller than my right as I couldn't seem to get the purchase on the grip like I can with my right. Shooting normally, my two hands work in conjunction with one another, weak handed it feels like one hand is holding the gun, and the other is just there along for the ride. I'm practicing this cuz I hope to participate in my club's PPC league, and this is one element of the competition. Does anyone have any pointers or experience with this?

Maybe the larger hand handles "other duties" as well, hence the disparity.

 

[Justincase]

Maybe the larger hand handles "other duties" as well, hence the disparity.

Hmm, if only it was proportional, lol.

 

[stokes]

Ha ha ha. Protecting vitals from what? X-rays? Bullets? Maybe knives? Strong words?

The arm is across the chest giving your heart some measure of protection from a bullet,duh.

 

[kev74]

The best explanation I've heard for keeping the weak hand across the chest when drawing is 1) to keep the weak hand out of the way until its needed, and 2) to keep it from being grabbed by an adversary during a scuffle while your drawing.

 

[Justincase]

From what you say here it sounds as though you were using a two hand grip but holding the gun in your left hand rather than your right hand as you would normally do. If so, let me run a few thoughts by you.............

If someone told you that you would be expected to shoot with your weak hand in the PPC league I suspect what they meant was weak hand ONLY. I shot PPC years ago and, honestly, don't recall any weak hand shooting at all but that may just be an old man's memory. But I have never seen shooting with the weak hand supported by the strong hand in any pistol shooting discipline - USPSA, IDPA, PPC. So you might want to check to see if what was meant was weak hand only shooting.

If that turns out to be the case then there are some things you can do to make weak hand only shooting more tolerable. What I have found works for me is to "mirror" the grip and stance I use when shooting strong hand only. I quarter away from the target with the foot on the gun side (whichever side) more forward (closer to the target) and I bend that forward knee a bit more than normal, make my stance a little more aggessive. I make a fist with my non-shooting hand and bring it to my chest and really clench that whole arm into my chest. This tightens up the entire upper body and helps with bringing the gun back on target after recoil.

The only thing I do differently when shooting weak hand only is I cant the gun inward a bit -- maybe 30-45 degrees. Not full on gangsta style, maybe half gangsta. What this does for me is it utilizes the bigger muscles on the outside of my forearm to hold the gun steady. I have, however, seen guys shoot weak handed holding the gun completely vertical as they do with their strong hand. Try both.

You will, of course, continue to sight the gun with your dominant eye no matter which hand you hold it in. And one thing to keep in mind is to keep your finger well OFF the trigger until you are settled on that first target. I can't tell you how may premature ejaculations I have seen over the years as guys draw the gun with the strong hand, transfer to the weak hand, and get on that trigger too early. You can get away with prepping the trigger as you come on to a target when shooting with your strong hand. But your weak hand trigger finger is not as experienced as the one on your strong hand. Be patient with that first shot.

Try these techniques and with a little practice it will become quite easy for you. I hope this helps.

I think you're right about the single off hand shooting. I misunderstood. That shouldn't be too bad to get used to. I shoot very similarly to you. Like a modified weaver stance.

I totally get the finger away from the trigger tip. I must have looked like a fool trying to figure out how to hold the thing similarly to how I would strong handed. Took a couple tries and I could see how one could misjudge that left trigger finger

 

[tapper3]

I think you're right about the single off hand shooting. I misunderstood. That shouldn't be too bad to get used to. I shoot very similarly to you. Like a modified weaver stance.

I totally get the finger away from the trigger tip. I must have looked like a fool trying to figure out how to hold the thing similarly to how I would strong handed. Took a couple tries and I could see how one could misjudge that left trigger finger

Yeah, that is pretty much it but let me elaborate a bit to be clear. And keep in mind that this is just what has worked for me and you will have to experiment to see what works for you.

In my normal two handed shooting my feet are about shoulder width apart and my right foot (I'm right handed) is back only slightly - toes about even with the arch of the left foot. My weight is more toward the toes than flat footed (and certainly not toward the heels). My posture is leaning into the gun - and this will vary depending upon which gun I am shooting and how much I feel I have to try to manage the recoil.

My knees are flexed slightly. And I keep my upper body pretty square to whatever target is being engaged by swiveling at the knees. I turn from target to target like the turret of a tank with the pivot point being the knees. I guess this is my version of the isosceles stance.

Now when shooting one handed (this is in competition where the starting position usually will require you to be facing squarely downrange) I start set up just as if I was shooting two handed. But as I draw the gun I step forward with the "gun" side foot. (This is where it starts to look like Weaver, you are right.)

How much do I step forward? For me it is just putting that foot fully ahead of the other - heel forward of toe. Then that knee is flexed even more than normal so that I am leaning into the gun more than normal. And all of this changing of position - stepping forward, flexing the knee more, bringing the "useless" arm into the chest - is accomplished as the gun is brought from holster to target.

And my shooting arm is more "locked" out than normal also. But arms are a whole other discussion. lol

There is no "right" way to do it, man. All this is just what I settled on after a lot of trial and error. Experiment and see what works for you.

 

[togmaster]

Hand across the groin protecting the vitals?

Gangsta style.

 

[misunderestimated]

I goto say EVERY ONE has to get into competitions !

So years and years ago it was suggested to shoot a magazine week handed, then shoot a magazine two handed week hand on every range visit. I started doing this every range visit. Once I got into competitions I really appreciated that advice. Now its no thought to shooting one handed or two handed week hand. I have had my kids doing it since they started shooting at the age of 14.

All that being said. With an unloaded fire arm pointing in a safe direction practice going from your normal 2 handed hold to a week 2 handed hold. and just switchback and forth it help you memorize a proper grip. As for one handed week hand I find that easter to do as your hand naturally finds the correct spot on the fire arm. Not easier to master just easier to do.

When shooting one handed I also cross my other arm across my chest and grip my shirt to keep that arm from moving the body. wait till you have to shoot 2 handed week hand from a barrier thats when it gets real tough, I actually have to confirm I am on my target not the person next to me. Good luck and I cant say enough about getting into some kinda of a competion as it really challenges your brain and your skills and you learn why ther gear you have may not won't work in a stress situation

Also it teaches you how to automatically overcome gun malfunctions. Punching holes in paper is good for trigger time. Getting on a line waiting for a buzzer to ring is spectacular for trigger time. GO GET REGISTERED FOR SOME MATCHES !

 

[Justincase]

Yeah, that is pretty much it but let me elaborate a bit to be clear. And keep in mind that this is just what has worked for me and you will have to experiment to see what works for you.

In my normal two handed shooting my feet are about shoulder width apart and my right foot (I'm right handed) is back only slightly - toes about even with the arch of the left foot. My weight is more toward the toes than flat footed (and certainly not toward the heels). My posture is leaning into the gun - and this will vary depending upon which gun I am shooting and how much I feel I have to try to manage the recoil.

My knees are flexed slightly. And I keep my upper body pretty square to whatever target is being engaged by swiveling at the knees. I turn from target to target like the turret of a tank with the pivot point being the knees. I guess this is my version of the isosceles stance.

Now when shooting one handed (this is in competition where the starting position usually will require you to be facing squarely downrange) I start set up just as if I was shooting two handed. But as I draw the gun I step forward with the "gun" side foot. (This is where it starts to look like Weaver, you are right.)

How much do I step forward? For me it is just putting that foot fully ahead of the other - heel forward of toe. Then that knee is flexed even more than normal so that I am leaning into the gun more than normal. And all of this changing of position - stepping forward, flexing the knee more, bringing the "useless" arm into the chest - is accomplished as the gun is brought from holster to target.

And my shooting arm is more "locked" out than normal also. But arms are a whole other discussion. lol

There is no "right" way to do it, man. All this is just what I settled on after a lot of trial and error. Experiment and see what works for you.

Thanks for the details. They're very helpful. My shooting stance is also a hybrid stance derived from years and years of karate. It's essentially my fighting stance without my knees bent as much but with a gun in hand.

 

[tapper3]

Thanks for the details. They're very helpful. My shooting stance is also a hybrid stance derived from years and years of karate. It's essentially my fighting stance without my knees bent as much but with a gun in hand.

Oh hell, just work off of what you have trained your body to do all those years. That stance will work well for you. Under pressure you will revert to your most ingrained training anyhow so just work with it.

High speed shooting is just a matter of efficiency, economy of motion. Figuring out what is the most efficient way to bring the gun to bear on the target. Because hitting the highest scoring zone on the target is not enough, there is always an element of time in every pistol shooting sport whether it is lowest elapsed time or shooting within a fixed time limit. This demands efficiency. Once you have figured out the most efficient way to do something it becomes a matter of body mechanics and muscle memory, grooving those motions in.

When I really got into competitive shooting I spent a good deal of time studying sports psychology. And I learned a couple of important lessons. First, weekdays are for training and weekends are for performing. During the week, either at the range or just dry firing, you can think about what you are doing and make adjustments, experiment. But on weekends, at the match, you can't think. You just do. You put into practice what you learned during the week. Turn the mind off and just shoot. Shoot in the present tense. The shot you made .5 seconds ago is history. The most important shot you will ever make is your next shot. Focus on that next shot. After the match, on the drive home, you can review and analyze and identify the weak areas that you will work on the following week. But not during the match.

Secondly, everyone who learns a new skill set goes through the same 4 stages of competence.............
* Unconscious Incompetence --- you are making mistakes and don't realize what mistakes you are making.
* Conscious Incompetence --- you are still making mistakes but you now recognize them when you make them.
* Conscious Competence --- as long as you think about what you are doing you make few or no mistakes.
* Unconscious Competence --- Thinking slows you down so no thought, no mistakes, just do it. (That time when it's all over and you go "Whoa, did I just do that????? Wow!!!!!!!"

There's a lot to be said about confidence and fear of failure, too. Put a 4x4 on the ground and ask someone to walk across it and they will do so with no hesitation or trouble. Now put that same 4x4 20' in the air..........

And the way to gain that confidence is through...................... right, repetition and training. Brian Enos wrote, "You will learn something new every time you pull the trigger......... if you pay attention." This one thing, weak hand shooting, is new to you. And you are seeking to master it. So you will pay attention to what you are doing and learn the best way to do it. Now apply that level of attention to all the other actions your PPC matches will demand of you.

Question everything. Here's one --- what's the best way to draw a pistol when starting from a surrender (hands above shoulders) position? Is it to drop your gun hand straight down to the gun and snatch the gun out of the holster? Or is it to drop your gun hand down past the gun and then hook it out of the holster on the way back up? Or is it something altogether different?

 

[Justincase]

^ Again, thanks for sharing your expertise. You're exactly right about doing what will come naturally without thought. There was no question that my shooting stance was going to be a derivative of my fighting stance. It's so ingrained into my muscle memory that it would be totally counterproductive to do anything else. I've practiced moving, striking, blocking, parrying, advancing, retreating, and grabbing so many thousands of times in that stance that it's what I naturally go to in stress situations and using it with a gun in hand is really no different.

I like the four stages of competence. I'm definitely in stage one in all aspects of pistol shooting, but I'm working to become more proficient reach time I hit the range. Adding competition to the mix should hasten things a bit which is good. I'm sure just putting shots down range with no pressure could foster complacency.