14 inch barrel = legal?

[Marine Cpl]

Why is it so much like the other place? Because someone is debating a topic they believe to be true and disagreed with you?

Should he have just said, "Someone said that it's illegal so I'm not going to post anymore about the subject?"

You yourself didn't even know why it was illegal. You were basically wrongly saying it was the same as cutting the barrel of a shotgun which clearly it is not. That's like saying an AR pistol is a rifle even though it left the factory as a pistol.

The reason it may be illegal is because all firearms are illegal in this state unless exempted. You didn't know that and wouldn't have unless it was discussed and posted by @Bullet Guy.

About the only thing that can be debated is whether it is considered a firearm.

 

[cgrutt]

Dude, this IS the OTHER place, LOL...

 

[Marine Cpl]

Dude, this IS the OTHER place, LOL...

OK. In order to not be like the other place which was an internet forum which consisted of the posting of different opinions, we should close this thread.

All threads from here on out shall contain only the original post and opinion. All subsequent posting shall only contain agreements with the first opinion. Under no circumstances shall any member disagree with the first opinion.

 

[cgrutt]

LOL

 

[cgrutt]

I must say the ignore feature on this forum is outstanding!

 

[freddy]

Some are claiming they have these on their NY pistol permit.

Legal NYS carry without asking permission.....of a 14" Mossberg? - Page 2 - NYS and NYC Discussions (licensing/laws)

 

[stuck in ny]

Forget the fed. Definition of a firearm.

Ny defines it as:

S 265.00 Definitions.
As used in this article and in article four hundred, the following
terms shall mean and include:


3. "Firearm" means (a) any pistol or revolver; or (b) a shotgun having
one or more barrels less than eighteen inches in length; or (c) a rifle
having one or more barrels less than sixteen inches in length; or (d)
any weapon made from a shotgun or rifle whether by alteration,
modification, or otherwise if such weapon as altered, modified, or
otherwise has an overall length of less than twenty-six inches;


S 265.01 Criminal possession of a weapon in the fourth degree.
A person is guilty of criminal possession of a weapon in the fourth
degree when:
(1) He or she possesses any firearm, electronic dart gun, electronic
stun gun, gravity knife, switchblade knife, pilum ballistic knife, metal
knuckle knife, cane sword, billy, blackjack, bludgeon, plastic knuckles,
metal knuckles, chuka stick, sand bag, sandclub, wrist-brace type
slingshot or slungshot, shirken or "Kung Fu s

Your wrong look at your source -"made from a shotgun" then modified, altered etc. The ny def is the same as the fed. this never was a shotgun and never had a stock on it!! Otherwize it would be illegal at the fed level!! What don't people understand?!

 

[Eddie Gunks]

Your wrong look at your source -"made from a shotgun" then modified, altered etc. The ny def is the same as the fed. this never was a shotgun and never had a stock on it!! Otherwize it would be illegal at the fed level!! What don't people understand?!

Please post the NY definition. This is the problem.....NY definitions.

Again. Please post the NY definition

 

[Phauxtoe]

they dont understand the "MANUFACTURED and MODIFIED" definitions.

 

[dsdmmat]

When in doubt always consult an attorney.
NEW YORK FIREARMS AND OTHER WEAPONS CHARGES – PART III – ADDITIONAL DEFINTIONS

Article 265 Penal Law Firearms | Dangerous Weapons | NY Law

 

[RandallOfLegend]

While we're at it. Lets talk about the Rossi Ranch Hand!

 

[dsdmmat]

500 Tactical - 6 Shot | O.F. Mossberg & Sons
shotgun or not?

Mare's Leg Mare's Leg - Wikipedia

 

[freddy]

How to spin cock:

 

[freddy]

Mare's Leg Mare's Leg - Wikipedia

In the United States under the National Firearms Act, to make a short barreled rifle from a firearm originally made and sold as a rifle requires payment of $200.00 for a tax stamp, approval from the BATFE and federal registration.[18] However, a "lever action pistol" made and sold subject to BATFE regulations is treated as a pistol by federal law. While most states will allow the purchase of Mare's Leg lever action pistols, California and New York have banned this gun from being sold in their individual states.

Of course wiki provides no source for this claim.

 

[freddy]

There is a relevant (and surprisingly; a civil) discussion over at an amazing and exciting new forum I just discovered!

 

[dsdmmat]

In the United States under the National Firearms Act, to make a short barreled rifle from a firearm originally made and sold as a rifle requires payment of $200.00 for a tax stamp, approval from the BATFE and federal registration.[18] However, a "lever action pistol" made and sold subject to BATFE regulations is treated as a pistol by federal law. While most states will allow the purchase of Mare's Leg lever action pistols, California and New York have banned this gun from being sold in their individual states.

Of course wiki provides no source for this claim.

In 2010 I saw a mare's leg for sale at the Fort Drum PX. I inquired about it about a year later and was told they couldn't sell them in NY anymore. No reason given and no reason to doubt the guy behind the counter, (he was a friend of mine). I wasn't really interested in them but I asked why I had not seen one in a while. If any states restrict it I am sure it is the PRK and the PRNY.

 

[Marine Cpl]

What this boils down to is whether an FFL will sell it you after a NICS check. It's totally up to the FFL.

After that it's totally up to a law enforcement officer to arrest you which is unlikely in your travels to the range.

After that, it's up to an ADA to press charges. If those charges are indeed pressed and not plead down to a disorderly conduct, you will win the case based on NY's definition of firearm which this tool does not fall into.

The ADA is not stupid. Chances are they will offer you a ticket first before they do all charges.

 

[freddy]

What this boils down to is whether an FFL will sell it you after a NICS check. It's totally up to the FFL.

After that it's totally up to a law enforcement officer to arrest you which is unlikely in your travels to the range.

After that, it's up to an ADA to press charges. If those charges are indeed pressed and not plead down to a disorderly conduct, you will win the case based on NY's definition of firearm which this tool does not fall into.

The ADA is not stupid. Chances are they will offer you a ticket first before they do all charges.

Does it make more sense to try and put it on a pistol permit?

 

[Marine Cpl]

Does it make more sense to try and put it on a pistol permit?

No it's not a pistol. That's the problem.

 

[NYGuns]

Sorry to be lame but I had to remove that pic of that chick who was a 10. That has to stay in the bar, if nudes are on any page where there is an ad we will get in trouble.

 

[Gunright]

Sorry to be lame but I had to remove that pic of that chick who was a 10. That has to stay in the bar, if nudes are on any page where there is an ad we will get in trouble.

Shoot. What did I miss?

 

[meketrefe]

Shoot. What did I miss?

someone posted pelosi naked.

 

[Eddie Gunks]

i am still waiting for the NYS definition of a pistol?

 

[Marine Cpl]

i am still waiting for the NYS definition of a pistol?

I think I see what you are getting at and may be correct. There is none. So if it isn't a shotgun or rifle or an SBR'ed rifle or shotgun it may only be a pistol since the definition of firearm says, "All pistols and revolvers."

Either that or out isn't a firearm at all.

 

[hoodfu]

I think I see what you are getting at and may be correct. There is none. So if it isn't a shotgun or rifle or an SBR'ed rifle or shotgun it may only be a pistol since the definition of firearm says, "All pistols and revolvers."

Either that or out isn't a firearm at all.

It's not a firearm by New York's definition. It doesn't fit. If a state doesn't have their own definition of an object, then it defaults to the federal definition. The federal government DOES define a pistol and that definition doesn't fit the shockwave either.

18 U.S.C., § 921(A)(29) and 27 CFR § 478.11

The term “Pistol” means a weapon originally designed, made, and intended to fire a projectile (bullet) from one or more barrels when held in one hand, and having:

• a chamber(s) as an integral part(s) of, or permanently aligned with, the bore(s);
  
  
• and a short stock designed to be gripped by one hand at an angle to and extending below the line of the bore(s).

The ATF has said that guns that shoot shot shells can't be pistols. It's why there are no shot shell pistols like you would have with AR pistol. They're either short barrel shotguns, an AOW if it's under 26" and has a forward vertical grip, or like in this case, the federal definition of a "firearm" because it's over 26" in length but never had a stock on it.

 

[Marine Cpl]

It's not a firearm by New York's definition. It doesn't fit. If a state doesn't have their own definition of an object, then it defaults to the federal definition. The federal government DOES define a pistol and that definition doesn't fit the shockwave either.


The ATF has said that guns that shoot shot shells can't be pistols. It's why there are no shot shell pistols like you would have with AR pistol. They're either short barrel shotguns, an AOW if it's under 26" and has a forward vertical grip, or like in this case, the federal definition of a "firearm" because it's over 26" in length but never had a stock on it.

Most of us understand that but where does it say that if the state definition doesn't exist it defaults to the federal definition? That's the problem.

 

[hoodfu]

Most of us understand that but where does it say that if the state definition doesn't exist it defaults to the federal definition? That's the problem.

Supremacy Clause - Wikipedia

The federal government guarantees a right or restricts a right. The states then have the ability to restrict it further as long as it doesn't conflict with federal law. In the absence of the state defining or restricting something, federal law is supreme.

 

[Marine Cpl]

Supremacy Clause - Wikipedia

The federal government guarantees a right or restricts a right. The states then have the ability to restrict it further as long as it doesn't conflict with federal law. In the absence of the state defining or restricting something, federal law is supreme.

Nice. Thanks. So if that is indeed the case which it looks like it is, that AOW would be defined as a firearm federally which would be illegal in NY unless exempted.

 

[freddy]

Shoot. What did I miss?

See her right here:

http://nygunforum.com/threads/wife-at-the-beach.117/page-6#post-101708

 

[hoodfu]

Nice. Thanks. So if that is indeed the case which it looks like it is, that AOW would be defined as a firearm federally which would be illegal in NY unless exempted.

I'm not understanding. The shockwave isn't an AOW in NY State or federally. They do have another model that has a forward grip though which IS an AOW if that's what you're talking about. You can have that in NY but you'd need the NFA tax stamp and it goes on your NY pistol license. A bunch of people in NY including downstate have those.