Cheapest, Good Quality .308 Bolt Gun

[meketrefe]

Danmit Meke. Now I'm second guessing myself.

I am sorry I misspoke, I checked my notes and the ones I worked with were ATR model not the patriot.
They share some of the same issues but the Patriot seems like a nice improvement.
Still too new to say how it will stand the test of time. finishing seems the same and it
can use some pillars to add rigidity. The action still too thin on the right side, in part due
to the huge magazine opening.

Sorry about the confusion man.

And sorry for being a pest. My mind always drifts to the basics like what kind of
foundation we are starting with. This is what I mean when I talk about strength
and rigidity of the action...

View attachment 1292

 

[Harry Hood]

Bought a Ruger American in .308 last year and has Nikon glass on top. I like the rifle very much and is very accurate at 100yds. The one draw back I have found with it is the stock. It is hard to get a good cheek weld and be lined up with the scope. I had to install a cheek pad and now the weld is perfect. All total I think I am into it for about $700

 

[Prudii]

@meketrefe Is that really the patriot action? That does not seem like nearly enough material.

 

[ECU Pirates]

I am sorry I misspoke, I checked my notes and the ones I worked with were ATR model not the patriot.
They share some of the same issues but the Patriot seems like a nice improvement.
Still too new to say how it will stand the test of time. finishing seems the same and it
can use some pillars to add rigidity. The action still too thin on the right side, in part due
to the huge magazine opening.

Sorry about the confusion man.

And sorry for being a pest. My mind always drifts to the basics like what kind of
foundation we are starting with. This is what I mean when I talk about strength
and rigidity of the action...

View attachment 1292

Do a .375 Ruger a and a .338 win mag require a strong action? I don't think they are really hi pressure but I don't know. The partiot is chambered in both (also 300 win mag) so I would think it's plenty strong.

 

[GuyMontag]

Meketrefe's pic of the Mossberg action is an eye opener for sure, relieving all that material is an awful design IMO.

Meketrefe, sounds like you've had a chance to see the Bergara.

Are they making their own actions in house? Looks promising, but I've never seen one firsthand.

 

[GuyMontag]

Do a .375 Ruger a and a .338 win mag require a strong action? I don't think they are really hi pressure but I don't know. The partiot is chambered in both (also 300 win mag) so I would think it's plenty strong.

ECU, that action is not what you want for a magnum cartridge.

Here's a Howa with a very similar design, any questions.

 

[meketrefe]

If one wants to lighten up an action and rifle it is better to resort to fluting vs. providing huge ejection/feed and magazine windows.
I think that is why despite all the other budget add-ons the axis is a much more accurate action on average and can also
take a pounding. The Remington 700 has extra threads on the tenon are built like tanks. Savage 10 even one action version used
in several models that match the external dimensions yet they have smaller windows (like the axis) so they are more rigid.
They are so good that in comopetition they challenge R700 aftermarket actions like Stiller or Surgeon. I am talking about the PT action.
Savage Precision Target action has been the baseline for all the other Savage 10 /11 variants including the 338 lapua magnum(large shank)
Amazing factory trigger and same thing only with the window below vs. the single shot target that btw is a very good way to building a well priced match winning Bench Rest rifle.
They took those learnings and applied that to the axis, 10lrp and others.



Savage 10 lrp



Classic savage 10/11 and remington 700. The two most popular actions in the world.
Lighter action but not so light that they compromise the strength and rigidity..


Tikka T3 provides the same concept for a rigid accurate action.
Bolt lug area is not as strong as the savage or rem700 but overall it is a good action.



Just for reference a high end Surgeon Remington 700 Action machined from a single billet with top rail and recoil lug machined into it. This is bomb proof.




Savage axis cut to take regular recoil lug for even more rigidity. One can do that later on when upgrading stocks.



I love the CZ mini mauser action for 7.62x39 ! who wouldn't.

 

[Cleck]

Hopefully I can dig up this thread when I resume my hunt for a "beginner" or entry-level bolt 308. Lots of good info here, even if I don't understand it all right yet.

 

[ECU Pirates]

ECU, that action is not what you want for a magnum cartridge.

Here's a Howa with a very similar design, any questions.

Looks like a Glock I once knew.....

 

[pseudonymity]

HOME - HOWA RIFLES
Howa – Legacy Sports International

For plain Jane .308, traditional old school no-frills construction, HOWA has been good to me. Broom handles cost less, heavy barrels cost more. You can buy them without scopes or in a combination package. Blued or SS.

The Howa triggers are pretty nice for the price and the actions are pretty good also - pretty slick bolt and the receiver has a flat bottom and an intregal recoil lug. Aftermarket options are so-so for the rifles, LSI sells a detachable mag kit which is in the $100 range. If you plan to keep the rifle and build on it later the only real negative compared to other rifles in the price range is that barrel replacement is not as simple as an Axis, Savage 10 or Rem 700 receiver.

I have a Howa in 308 sitting in the cabinet that I do not shoot much anymore - sporter contour barrel and Hogue overmolded stock, blind mag with swingout floorplate. Willjr75, if you think you may be interested in a used rifle shoot me a PM.

 

[GOPerfect]

I have been a big fan of the Ruger American. It was so easy selling these guns when I was at Gander.

The Savage Axis is also a great bolt gun without breaking the bank.

 

[carpediem]

I have a Savage 11FL. The 11 is the short action, and that gun is now 16 yrs old and has never missed a beat. Out of the box with iron sights I could hit a light bulb at close to 100 yds. I have an old broken Bushnell Sportview on it and it is stuck on four or five power but I have taken many deer like that and even more woodchucks. I even hit a running coyote at 240 yards, the only one i've ever got, with that rifle. I love it and would never part with it.

 

[FrankenCub]

The American and Axis are both better guns than most are willing to admit. Check out the threads on the Savage forums, they are grouping better than a $2000 gun in many instances. The American has a better stock, the one on the Axis does suck but there are replacements, but I got the Axis just because I like Savage better than Ruger. The Axis trigger isn't too bad stock but can be sweet after a bit of work. As for the mag dropping issue above, I've never experienced it with my Axis.

 

[meketrefe]

The issue with the American is that is a hit and miss situation. Stiff bolts and subpar accuracy has sent many
back to the manufacturer. I think the design is ok but this rifle and market is still new to ruger and it might
be hard still to assure QC and hit the price point. The rotary magazine is a cool feature as it is the
70 degree bolt lift but I also think there is a huge benefit in accuracy in the floating bolt head and/or toroidal cuts
in the bolt and lugs that the rugger doesn't have. In that sense the R770 was a better solution with 3 lug floating
head but then it had a few other problems now resolved with the R783.
That is why I think it is better to aim for a floating head design unless one is planning to have the rifle trued
and refinished. We now see the trend going this way with all new rifles and ruger didn't follow probably in
order to cut machining time and being able to meet price points.
We know these rifles are not perfectly indexed for machining as machine time is cut down so there are a
few ways to mitigate tolerances and allow for a more loose fit yet produce positive lug contact upon firing.
This would have made the Ruger also smoother possibly with some polishing but as we know probably more
expensive.
As you probably sense I am all for innovation but also cautious when I see we introduce all new designs and
some new concepts all at once. I prefer to see a company come with a solid action and base and then gradually
introduce new features that are well tested. As we know that takes years and that is why it is hard to see
new super hits while having time tested actions at competitive prices.

It is a bit like the glocks. they do not introduce anything super radical nor super exciting so some might see it
as boring but boy, you can bet your life on them.

 

[ECU Pirates]

The issue with the American is that is a hit and miss situation. Stiff bolts and subpar accuracy has sent many
back to the manufacturer. I think the design is ok but this rifle and market is still new to ruger and it might
be hard still to assure QC and hit the price point. The rotary magazine is a cool feature as it is the
70 degree bolt lift but I also think there is a huge benefit in accuracy in the floating bolt head and/or toroidal cuts
in the bolt and lugs that the rugger doesn't have. In that sense the R770 was a better solution with 3 lug floating
head but then it had a few other problems now resolved with the R783.
That is why I think it is better to aim for a floating head design unless one is planning to have the rifle trued
and refinished. We now see the trend going this way with all new rifles and ruger didn't follow probably in
order to cut machining time and being able to meet price points.
We know these rifles are not perfectly indexed for machining as machine time is cut down so there are a
few ways to mitigate tolerances and allow for a more loose fit yet produce positive lug contact upon firing.
This would have made the Ruger also smoother possibly with some polishing but as we know probably more
expensive.
As you probably sense I am all for innovation but also cautious when I see we introduce all new designs and
some new concepts all at once. I prefer to see a company come with a solid action and base and then gradually
introduce new features that are well tested. As we know that takes years and that is why it is hard to see
new super hits while having time tested actions at competitive prices.

It is a bit like the glocks. they do not introduce anything super radical nor super exciting so some might see it
as boring but boy, you can bet your life on them.

The store I worked at sold more Americas than any
Other rifle. I never heard of one going back for anything. This was a busy store that moved a lot of guns. One inch at 100 is good enough accuracy for a budget rifle in my opinion. My American outshot my 700 out a f the box. I'm sure upgrades and tinkering favor the 700 and you can make them easily outshoot the ruger though. For no frills bang per buck it's the rifle I always recommended.


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[meketrefe]

I don't sell firearms and only improve them or fix them so I cannot tell you but we had a couple of folks in the predators forum who had to
send them back to Ruger for repairs. I also had the chance to bed the base and install optics in one so I was able to inspect it closely and
shoot it. As I said, I don't think it is a bad rifle but also don't know why they didn't go with a floating bolt head and looser fit for a smoother
action. Given the prices on the Savage 10/11 I think one will be hard pressed to find a better value out of the box. $420 with a nikon scope
is a very good deal and then one has a time tested, battle tested action and barrels. Just the consistency of the savage barrels is worth
the investment in any savage. Getting a remington 700 to be all it can be is not easy not cheap. That is why the Bergara B14 is making such
a hit with their R700 action at the prices they are coming out.

 

[Glenn B]

Just in case you are still looking: F/S - Marlin X7, .308 caliber, For Sale

 

[ECU Pirates]

I don't sell firearms and only improve them or fix them so I cannot tell you but we had a couple of folks in the predators forum who had to
send them back to Ruger for repairs. I also had the chance to bed the base and install optics in one so I was able to inspect it closely and
shoot it. As I said, I don't think it is a bad rifle but also don't know why they didn't go with a floating bolt head and looser fit for a smoother
action. Given the prices on the Savage 10/11 I think one will be hard pressed to find a better value out of the box. $420 with a nikon scope
is a very good deal and then one has a time tested, battle tested action and barrels. Just the consistency of the savage barrels is worth
the investment in any savage. Getting a remington 700 to be all it can be is not easy not cheap. That is why the Bergara B14 is making such
a hit with their R700 action at the prices they are coming out.

If a savage 10 with a Nikon is only 420 then I agree that is abut the best bang per buck I have ever heard of!


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[Celt]

I would personally hold out for either a Remington 700 or a Savage 10/11.

 

[Jaywmustang]

I don't sell firearms and only improve them or fix them so I cannot tell you but we had a couple of folks in the predators forum who had to
send them back to Ruger for repairs. I also had the chance to bed the base and install optics in one so I was able to inspect it closely and
shoot it. As I said, I don't think it is a bad rifle but also don't know why they didn't go with a floating bolt head and looser fit for a smoother
action. Given the prices on the Savage 10/11 I think one will be hard pressed to find a better value out of the box. $420 with a nikon scope
is a very good deal and then one has a time tested, battle tested action and barrels. Just the consistency of the savage barrels is worth
the investment in any savage. Getting a remington 700 to be all it can be is not easy not cheap. That is why the Bergara B14 is making such
a hit with their R700 action at the prices they are coming out.

Have u handled a bergara?

 

[Airborneguy]

Will, meet me in Roscoe.

Big Dog Arms | Savage Axis Bolt 308 Winchester 22" Black Synthetic Black

 

[Marine Cpl]

Will, meet me in Roscoe.

Big Dog Arms | Savage Axis Bolt 308 Winchester 22" Black Synthetic Black

You buying one?

 

[4excal]

If you're looking at 600$ top have you seen @Glenn B for 450$? F/S - Marlin X7, .308 caliber, For Sale

 

[Airborneguy]

You buying one?

Very soon, but probably not till after hunting season. That price is insane though. If I hunt up that way at all this year, I'll probably stop in.

 

[Jaywmustang]

I dont think it has the accu trigger.

 

[Jaywmustang]

Savage AXIS XP 308 W/SCP

I think this is the same rifle. Add $20ish for the transfer.

 

[Airborneguy]

Bud's won't sell to me because of my NYC address. They don't support the Second Amendment when it matters.

 

[meketrefe]

The Marlin X7 is a good rifle. If you look at it closely they followed all the directives previously established by savage that are a standard today
for a competitive hunting rifle. This is the reason Remington used the same formula in the 783 to avoid the fiascos of the 770.
The marlin barrels are amazing and use the precise same threads as the savage but might not be exchangeable in all cases due
to the bolt being a tad more recessed so they might not headspace correctly and one might need the the X7 barrel nut too.
But they are beautiful barrels. It looks almos as if savage made them.
As you know in this category they all have mold injected plastic stocks. Some a little better but all pretty basic and crude yet ok
for a beater hunter.
One that doesn't come with a scope and it also has the basic stock is the hog hunter but it is a SAVAGE 11 with a 20" 3008 with scout sights, threaded
barrel and amazing accuracy out of the box. So like the savage 11 hunter with the nikon I would not think twice about getting one
for around $420-$430... This right now is a better than any budget 700 and nobody can get a $700 SPS to shoot like any of these
hog hunters out of the box. Later on one can upgrade the stock and bottom with endless options for stocks and magazines.

Savage 11 HOG HNTR 308 TB

I am not a Savage or Remington seller. I am explaining the best I can the way it is. You know, some people hate glocks just because they are glocks.
There was general who recently said he didn't want to develop an new pistol for the US army. He wanted to go out and buy glocks for his guys. Why not right?




Crude stock but just consider the actual hardware. IMO there is no good reason for the Axis II nor any of the many other newcomers.

 

[Jaywmustang]

Bud's won't sell to me because of my NYC address. They don't support the Second Amendment when it matters.

Gotcha. Dicks has that axis xp on sale for $299.98 after $30 rebate. Sale ends the oct 8th unfortunately. I am sure there will be more sales. Runnings has them for $294.99 on sale. Doesn't mention anything about a rebate. If u have one around u.

 

[4excal]

Gotcha. Dicks has that axis xp on sale for $299.98 after $30 rebate. Sale ends the oct 8th unfortunately. I am sure there will be more sales.

Look at you giving the poor guy 46 minutes to run to that sale