Frying pan tests are for sissies.

Marine Cpl

Marine Cpl

.577 Tyrannosaur.
Messages
22,046
Reaction score
20,634
Location
Orange County
I couldn't have said it better myself. Speed penetrates. 185 gr+ P would have done the job, but people ignorantly pick the .230 gr because the number is bigger.
 
Podmonkey

Podmonkey

.577 Tyrannosaur.
U.S. Military
Messages
21,466
Reaction score
29,932
Location
Cambria co. PA
Willjr75 said:
I couldn't have said it better myself. Speed penetrates. 185 gr+ P would have done the job, but people ignorantly pick the .230 gr because the number is bigger.
Click to expand...
No, because it does a similar amount of soft tissue damage, is softer shooting, easier to contol, doesn't batter the gun and is more readily available.
Hard barrier penetration of pistol calibers is like comparing cargo carrying capacities of supercars. Differences exist but are outside the strengths of the relevant platforms. Got substantial stuff to shoot through? You need a rifle.
 
Marine Cpl

Marine Cpl

.577 Tyrannosaur.
Messages
22,046
Reaction score
20,634
Location
Orange County
Podmonkey said:
No, because it does a similar amount of soft tissue damage, is softer shooting, easier to contol, doesn't batter the gun and is more readily available.
Hard barrier penetration of pistol calibers is like comparing cargo carrying capacities of supercars. Differences exist but are outside the strengths of the relevant platforms. Got substantial stuff to shoot through? You need a rifle.
Click to expand...
I disagree. Choosing a .230 gr is a deliberate handicap. Barrier penetration on a pistol is a must. Not every shot is going to be straight on into a chest and not every hard barrier that needs to be penetrated is going to have a rifle nearby.

Also, as far as battering the gun goes, a quality firearm has no such issues.
 
Last edited:
kev74

kev74

20×102mm Vulcan
Messages
49,998
Reaction score
158,180
Location
Orange Co.
Willjr75 said:
I disagree. Choosing a .230 gr is a deliberate handicap. Barrier penetration on a pistol is a must. Not every shot is going to be straight on into a chest and not every hard barrier that needs to be penetrated is going to have a rifle nearby.
Click to expand...
I don't want to try and catch either of them.

For a gun with fixed sights, there is definitely going to be a point of impact change between 185 and 230 grain. I'd prefer hitting what I'm aiming at over a perceived difference in penetration.

If I'm shooting at a knight in armor, I'd be happy with either. :D
 
Marine Cpl

Marine Cpl

.577 Tyrannosaur.
Messages
22,046
Reaction score
20,634
Location
Orange County
kev74 said:
I don't want to try and catch either of them.

For a gun with fixed sights, there is definitely going to be a point of impact change between 185 and 230 grain. I'd prefer hitting what I'm aiming at over a perceived difference in penetration.

If I'm shooting at a knight in armor, I'd be happy with either. :D
Click to expand...
At less than 25 yards, you are talking about less than an inch in elevation.
 
Podmonkey

Podmonkey

.577 Tyrannosaur.
U.S. Military
Messages
21,466
Reaction score
29,932
Location
Cambria co. PA
Willjr75 said:
I disagree. Choosing a .230 gr is a deliberate handicap. Barrier penetration on a pistol is a must. Not every shot is going to be straight on into a chest and not every hard barrier that needs to be penetrated is going to have a rifle nearby.
Click to expand...
I disagree, I think the 230gr is the best weight for the .45. This will need to be tested somehow. If I only had the time I would love to do my own ballistic gel tests.
Also I think the need for civilian, non LE (cause LE is civilian) to penetrate barriers is minimal. Since we are legally liable for each and every round we send out if the target is obstructed you likely can't see it either and you should not be shooting at what you can't see.
 
Marine Cpl

Marine Cpl

.577 Tyrannosaur.
Messages
22,046
Reaction score
20,634
Location
Orange County
Podmonkey said:
I disagree, I think the 230gr is the best weight for the .45. This will need to be tested somehow. If I only had the time I would love to do my own ballistic gel tests.
Click to expand...
For soft tissue, the. .230 gr will penetrate further in a FMJ configuration than the .185 gr due to weight but either will have complete passthrough through a fragile human body. Hell a .380 ACP FMJ will have complete passthrough.

In a hollow point configuration, the .185 gr or the .230 gr will penetrate within inches of each other depending on the load and hollow point construction. They are both designed to stop at 12 to 18 inches in gel.
 
ECU Pirates

ECU Pirates

.308 Win
Messages
3,009
Reaction score
2,686
Location
Broome County
Willjr75 said:
For soft tissue, the. .230 gr will penetrate further in a FMJ configuration than the .185 gr due to weight but either will have complete passthrough through a fragile human body. Hell a .380 ACP FMJ will have complete passthrough.

In a hollow point configuration, the .185 gr or the .230 gr will penetrate within inches of each other depending on the load and hollow point construction. They are both designed to stop at 12 to 18 inches in gel.
Click to expand...
Calls himself a professional and keeps posting .230 and .185......

The .165 Gr .45 would be Wills favorite.
 
Podmonkey

Podmonkey

.577 Tyrannosaur.
U.S. Military
Messages
21,466
Reaction score
29,932
Location
Cambria co. PA
Willjr75 said:
Bigger diameter. But then again, .40 holds more.
Click to expand...
That's my point. I wonder if 165gr .45s have too little mass behind too much diameter causing insufficient penetration. And capacity usaully trumps bullet weight. In general volume of fire is desirable over effectiveness of fire, within reasonable limits.
 
Last edited:
You must log in or register to reply here.
Top