Guy shot himself in the leg and posted it on the M14 forum

[Marine Cpl]

I'm not going to even try to speculate on how much of his account is truthful versus fabricated. That's a futile endeavour.




A good holster/carry setup is important, but it’s not foolproof (which you seem to acknowledge). Trigger awareness is important, but it takes just one momentary lapse for that ‘safety’ system to be bypassed. That’s why I think redundant safety features and a pro-active mindset to avoid ND’s are important.

If some people are able to convince themselves that they can safely and effectively operate and holster/unholster a non-safety striker-fired pistol because of their experiences in a range setting, that’s their call. For my purposes, that’s not a sufficient benchmark. If I’m not comfortable operating/carrying a pistol when I’m cold, hungry and tired in the middle of the wilderness, then I’m not carrying it period.

The key word is "Comfortable."

You said, " If I’m not comfortable operating/carrying a pistol when I’m cold, hungry and tired in the middle of the wilderness, then I’m not carrying it period."

I am many others am. Just because you experience discomfort, it doesn't mean everyone else feels that same discomfort but convinces themselves that they don't.

 

[96coal449]

No this is not fake. It is a real event that happened to a real person. From what I recall, (now that it was mentioned), he reached in his pocket to grab the grip with thumb and forefinger and lost hold of it when it went off. Still in his pocket. This was also not his EC pistol. He just happened to decide to carry the Glock.

 

[Gonzobird]

The silver lining in all this is at least someone else will learn from this. Same thing could have happened with a safety that came off. It's happened to me with my 1911. Either the safety came off as i was moving or I forgot to put it on.

The difference is a 1911 has a grip safty along with a thumb safety. If the trigger is pulled without depressing the grip safty at the same time the gun inst going off.

The clip thing is for idoits. Especailly with a Glock which has no safty. I don't care what anyone says, a Glock isn't a safe gun if it is not carried in a holster that covers the trigger. I would never trust those stupid clips.

 

[Upstate43]

The key word is "Comfortable."

You said, " If I’m not comfortable operating/carrying a pistol when I’m cold, hungry and tired in the middle of the wilderness, then I’m not carrying it period."

I am many others am. Just because you experience discomfort, it doesn't mean everyone else feels that same discomfort but convinces themselves that they don't.

I realize different people are comfortable with different firearms and carry types. I'm not speaking for everyone.

I would be interested to know if everyone who carries a striker-fired pistol (like a glock) IWB or appendix holster is really practicing what you preach (constant trigger awareness, adequate holster coverage). Moreover, I'm interested to know if they're able to maintain that discipline when in adverse/stressful conditions.

 

[Edwardteach72]

I realize different people are comfortable with different firearms and carry types. I'm not speaking for everyone.

I would be interested to know if everyone who carries a striker-fired pistol (like a glock) IWB or appendix holster is really practicing what you preach (constant trigger awareness, adequate holster coverage). Moreover, I'm interested to know if they're able to maintain that discipline when in adverse/stressful conditions.

I' pretty sure there is more than a few, fuck you can Google self defense shoots and see plenty of people not shoot themselves during a defensive shoot. (Fun fact you don't actually have to reholster right away)

 

[Marine Cpl]

I realize different people are comfortable with different firearms and carry types. I'm not speaking for everyone.

I would be interested to know if everyone who carries a striker-fired pistol (like a glock) IWB or appendix holster is really practicing what you preach (constant trigger awareness, adequate holster coverage). Moreover, I'm interested to know if they're able to maintain that discipline when in adverse/stressful conditions.

You are basically saying that you pull the trigger with the safety on a lot.

 

[Phazer]

I' pretty sure there is more than a few, fuck you can Google self defense shoots and see plenty of people not shoot themselves during a defensive shoot. (Fun fact you don't actually have to reholster right away)

Yup. Correct.

I've taken several courses using my Glock 19 OWB and my Glock 43 IWB (during concealed carry course). I've done hundreds of rapid presentations. I've stood on the practice line with many other students, most of whom were also using Glocks, and I have never seen a negligent discharge at any of those courses. Sure, they can happen. But, they are certainly rare.

By the way, although I have performed hundreds of live-fire rapid presentations, and practiced hundreds more dry-fire rapid presentations, I have never practiced or performed a rapid reholster of my pistols. I reholster my pistols with all of the deliberate intent and focused movement that I use when manipulating power tools like chainsaws and circular saws.

 

[gun_slinger_boy]

I don't see how someone pulls the trigger as they are drawing unless they imminently put their finger inside the trigger guard when there is enough room to do so. If you simply put your finger on the holster where the slide is underneath then your finger will be on the slide when the pistol is fully presented. Safe. I think the main problem is reholstering although if you do the same exact thing as you did drawing it should be okay. The holster should wedge between your finger and the slide. So then it comes down to foreign objects getting in the way. The only solution is to either empty the gun every single time you draw or be nude with just a gun belt and holster.

 

[Airborneguy]

I would be interested to know if everyone who carries a striker-fired pistol (like a glock) IWB or appendix holster is really practicing what you preach (constant trigger awareness, adequate holster coverage). Moreover, I'm interested to know if they're able to maintain that discipline when in adverse/stressful conditions.

I carried IWB appendix for years. Still carry IWB but at 4:00 now. I've never had an issue and don't anticipate ever having one. Safe practices are muscle memory for me now.

 

[Marine Cpl]

The only solution is to either empty the gun every single time you draw or be nude with just a gun belt and holster.

Or just reholster carefully. There is never a good reason to have to reholster quickly and carelessly. Even if you have a safety engaged it's bad practice to do so. Why? Because one day you may think you have the safety engaged when it isn't and and you'll end up reholstering quickly and carelessly like you are normally used to doing.

Rule number one is to always treat every firearm as if it is loaded and ready to fire. That means treating it as if the safety is off.

 

[Darth]

What happened to "a gun safety is no substitute for safe handling practices?"

 

[gun_slinger_boy]

What about carrying without one in the chamber?

 

[96coal449]

That bypasses the ready to draw and fire. Reason for carrying. No good when you have to rack before pointing for defensive reasons.

 

[96coal449]

Funny thing is this thread died in the original forum. Still thriving here.

 

[Airborneguy]

If someone is too scared to carry chambered, they should carry a revolver or leave gun handling to real men.

 

[Marine Cpl]

Yeah but a revolver has 5 or 6 loaded chambers. That's terrifying.

 

[Upstate43]

You are basically saying that you pull the trigger with the safety on a lot.

No, what I'm saying is I like having a mechanical safety backup for my own safety awareness. People make mistakes, even those that practice all the time.

What happened to "a gun safety is no substitute for safe handling practices?"

I agree with that. I also agree that 'safe handling' entails keeping the weapon on safe until ready to fire.

 

[Darth]

I agree with that. I also agree that 'safe handling' entails keeping the weapon on safe until ready to fire.

As is achieved with nearly every modern firearm until you pull the trigger.

 

[Upstate43]

As is achieved with nearly every modern firearm until you pull the trigger.

Only for those that actually have mechanical safeties.

 

[96coal449]

Unsubscribing.

 

[Darth]

Only for those that actually have mechanical safeties.

As, again, nearly all modern firearms do.

Including all Glocks.

 

[Edwardteach72]

No, what I'm saying is I like having a mechanical safety backup for my own safety awareness. People make mistakes, even those that practice all the time.



I agree with that. I also agree that 'safe handling' entails keeping the weapon on safe until ready to fire.

So let me get this straight.
You don't drop the safety until just before you plan to shoot...... not after you draw but after sights are good target identified then safety..........

Oh and you don't mistakes and thumb that safety off perfect every time? Even under stress?

 

[Phazer]

What about carrying without one in the chamber?

You didn't?

Ummm...yup, you did.

 

[Upstate43]

As, again, nearly all modern firearms do.

Including all Glocks.

Are you referring to Glock's integrated trigger safety? I don't consider that to have the same functionality as a lever or grip safety or the redundancy of a DA/SA hammer.

So let me get this straight.
You don't drop the safety until just before you plan to shoot...... not after you draw but after sights are good target identified then safety..........

Unless I'm alert-and-to-the-dirt or actually on target, my safety is kept on. On the ergonomic setup's at least (m9a1 being a good example), It's very easy to flip up the safety as you raise the pistol for a presentation drill.

 

[Darth]

Are you referring to Glock's integrated trigger safety? I don't consider that to have the same functionality as a lever or grip safety or the redundancy of a DA/SA hammer.

No I am not. I don't even like that stupid dingus on the Glock trigger. One of the reasons I prefer the P99

Unless I'm alert-and-to-the-dirt or actually on target, my safety is kept on. On the ergonomic setup's at least (m9a1 being a good example), It's very easy to flip up the safety as you raise the pistol for a presentation drill.

It's even easier to keep your finger off the trigger until you are on target.

 

[Phazer]

Unless I'm alert-and-to-the-dirt or actually on target, my safety is kept on. On the ergonomic setup's at least (m9a1 being a good example), It's very easy to flip up the safety as you raise the pistol for a presentation drill.

Well, when I draw any of my striker fired pistols (OWB or IWB), my finger never moves from the frame to the trigger until I'm pressing out on target. So, my safety-free pistol is just as unlikely to go off as yours.

When I reholster on my right side, I very intentionally tilt out my right hip so that the muzzle is not aiming at my leg when the pistol goes into the holster.

 

[Marine Cpl]

I just holstered and unholstered my Glock 26 when I got home 5 times in a row. Out of those 5 times, I only had one negligent discharge.

I'd say those are pretty good numbers.

 

[Airborneguy]

I hated the Army’s obsession with safeties. I get it that there are some dumb ass privates (and butterbars), but coming in with firearms experience, it drove me nuts. I don’t buy handguns with safeties with the exception of a few “must haves” I really wanted.

It’s pretty much the only reason I prefer Glocks.