Opinions wanted re: Colt M4

[SmallGameAddict]

I am considering the purchase of an AR- style rifle next year, when I change my residency to the great state of Kentucky.

The new manufacture Colt M4 flat top has caught my eye, includes 1-30 rounder, and I was wondering if Colt still made a quality rifle.

I had a Colt AR-15 Sporter in the 1980's, and it was quality throughout.

Would appreciate constructive opinions from you AR diehards out there.

 

[ArmedCorgi]

I am considering the purchase of an AR- style rifle next year, when I change my residency to the great state of Kentucky.

The new manufacture Colt M4 flat top has caught my eye, includes 1-30 rounder, and I was wondering if Colt still made a quality rifle.

I had a Colt AR-15 Sporter in the 1980's, and it was quality throughout.

Would appreciate constructive opinions from you AR diehards out there.

I just bought one of the new cr6920's. I went back and forth about wanting to get an older Colt for all the markings and such, but just decided that even if Colt outsources parts, most companies do. Colt lost the military contract for the m4. There are a lot of opinions about Colt not marking parts the way they used to. Some say it's because they no longer have the mil contract and so are no longer obligated to mark stuff they way they have. Some say it's because Colt is cheaping out and outsourcing everything and you are just paying for a name...

Who knows? I have built my share of AR's with both cheap and high end parts. The Colt I bought, is a quality carbine and I have no regrets buying it. Is it worth what they are asking?? That's up to you.

 

[SmallGameAddict]

I just bought one of the new cr6920's. I went back and forth about wanting to get an older Colt for all the markings and such, but just decided that even if Colt outsources parts, most companies do. Colt lost the military contract for the m4. There are a lot of opinions about Colt not marking parts the way they used to. Some say it's because they no longer have the mil contract and so are no longer obligated to mark stuff they way they have. Some say it's because Colt is cheaping out and outsourcing everything and you are just paying for a name...

Who knows? I have built my share of AR's with both cheap and high end parts. The Colt I bought, is a quality carbine and I have no regrets buying it. Is it worth what they are asking?? That's up to you.

Appreciate the input. $1k doesn't intimidate me, I'll still have food on the table.

 

[dwa12479]

Are you just looking for an AR? Or is your heart set on Colt for nostalgia purposes? There's a zillion options for a quality AR both to buy and/or build if you want.

 

[SmallGameAddict]

Are you just looking for an AR? Or is your heart set on Colt for nostalgia purposes? There's a zillion options for a quality AR both to buy and/or build if you want.

Quality matters more than cost, to a point. I don't want to build one, I want to buy a quality rifle I can depend on. Last I knew, Colt was top of the line.

 

[Saltwater60]

Plenty of good options out there. Plenty know more than me but there are better options that Colt IMO.

 

[Podmonkey]

Recent Colt AR15s are largely assembled from 3rd party parts. Even the barrels aren't made by Colt anymore. If a $1,000 is within your grasp might I ask if $1,200 is also acceptable? If so I would recommend something from Centurion Arms.

Centurion Arms | Combat Reliability

Centurion Arms, with our team of combat experts have created the best weaponry for sale. Made for and trusted by SEALs, we take great pride in our products.

centurionarms.com

I think the CM4 is the best fighting carbine you can get for the money. I would avoid optioning tge upgraded trigger and back up sights, you can do better for less money.
This rifle gives you all the goodies you need with out any fluff you don't need.

 

[SmallGameAddict]

Recent Colt AR15s are largely assembled from 3rd party parts. Even tge barrels aren't made by Colt anymore. If a $1,000 is within your grasp might I asked if $1,200 is also acceptable? If so I would recommend something from Centurion Arms.

Centurion Arms | Combat Reliability

Centurion Arms, with our team of combat experts have created the best weaponry for sale. Made for and trusted by SEALs, we take great pride in our products.

centurionarms.com

I think the CM4 is the best fighting carbine you can get for the money. I would avoid optioning tge upgraded trigger and back up sights, you can do better for less money.

I appreciate that, and your knowledgeable and experience input.

My deal breaking price point is $2500, the most I'm willing to spend.

 

[4WHLDRFTN]

My deal breaking price point is $2500, the most I'm willing to spend.

you can get a JP for that

 

[SmallGameAddict]

you can get a JP for that

What's a JP

 

[Podmonkey]

I appreciate that, and your knowledgeable and experience input.

My deal breaking price point is $2500, the most I'm willing to spend.

Welp, I'd give the CM4 a very hard look then.
$2,500 will give you access to all but the most obscure boutique manufacturers.
You could even swing something from the highest echelons such as LMT or Knight's Armament:

LMT Defense | Home

LMT Defense offers premium firearms. All LMT weapon systems are tuned and built to withstand the harshest conditions around the globe.

lmtdefense.com

Knight's Armament – When your life is on the line

www.knightarmco.com

But I don't think it's at all necessary.

 

[4WHLDRFTN]

What's a JP

JP Enterprise

 

[Podmonkey]

If a target AR is more what you are after @SmallGameAddict, JP does indeed have some good stuff.

Also, while I think Centurion Arms has an equally excellent product at a slightly lower price
I would also recommend Daniel Defense.
The are considered one of the top tier companies for a standard type carbine. I have one and it is excellent.

Daniel Defense | Daniel Defense

Find the full line of firearms, parts and accessories from Daniel Defense, including AR-15’s, AR-Pistols and Bolt Action Rifles for sport shooting and hunting.

danieldefense.com

 

[4WHLDRFTN]

This is my JP i bought 24yrs ago, orig had a 1” 24” bbl . few yrs later i set it back to shorten it (lighten) he put his prototype bbl on it 1”x20” tapered down under the hand guard, it took 2lbs off … this will hit an ants asshole at 200

 

[SmallGameAddict]

If a target AR is more what you are after @SmallGameAddict, JP does indeed have some good stuff.

Also, while I think Centurion Arms has an equally excellent product at a slightly lower price
I would also recommend Daniel Defense.
The are considered one of the top tier companies for a standard type carbine. I have one and it is excellent.

Daniel Defense | Daniel Defense

Find the full line of firearms, parts and accessories from Daniel Defense, including AR-15’s, AR-Pistols and Bolt Action Rifles for sport shooting and hunting.

danieldefense.com

Target shooting isn't my primary objective, I am more interested in quality, durability and reliability.

Kentucky is a Stand Your Ground, Castle Doctrine and Constitutional Carry state. This includes concealed carry for nonresidents over the age of 21.

I want something that a man can count on to repel boarders if necessary at distance while living in an isolated mountain home.

I'm thinking inside 1-1/2" @ 100 yards (scoped) is all the accuracy required.

 

[SmallGameAddict]

This is my JP i bought 24yrs ago, orig had a 1” 24” bbl . few yrs later i set it back to shorten it (lighten) he put his prototype bbl on it 1”x20” tapered down under the hand guard, it took 2lbs off … this will hit an ants asshole at 200



View attachment 124831

Lol @ "An ant's asshole". Now that's funny shit right there.

 

[Podmonkey]

Target shooting isn't my primary objective, I am more interested in quality, durability and reliability.

Kentucky is a Stand Your Ground, Castle Doctrine and Constitutional Carry state. This includes concealed carry for nonresidents over the age of 21.

I want something that a man can count on to repel boarders if necessary at distance while living in an isolated mountain home.

I'm thinking inside 1-1/2" @ 100 yards (scoped) is all the accuracy required.

Centurion Arms and Daniel Defense are both top of the line. Lewis Machine and Tool would be my go to option for generating high levels of range envy.
All three are what I'd consider battlefield grade equipment, all three (Knight's Armament too) would see you through the apocalypse.

 

[Podmonkey]

Also, tge trend in ARs over the last few years is lightweight rifles and components. A fighting carbine shouldn't weigh more than 6.5lbs naked.
LMTs weigh more than that, LMT's thing is monolithic upper receivers. The forend and receiver are all one peice forged and machined aluminum which adds some weight. LMTs are nuclear blast proof however.

 

[SmallGameAddict]

Also, tge trend in ARs over the last few years is lightweight rifles and components. A fighting carbine shouldn't weigh more than 6.5lbs naked.
LMTs weigh more than that, LMT's thing is monolithic upper receivers. The forend and receiver are all one peice forged and machined aluminum which adds some weight. LMTs are nuclear blast proof however.

Funny you should mention that, the wife and I were just looking at the Centurion Arms CM4 Lightweight. $1495 is def do-able.

 

[Podmonkey]

Funny you should mention that, the wife and I were just looking at the Centurion Arms CM4 Lightweight. $1495 is def do-able.

That would be an excellent rifle, assuming you could find one in stock.

 

[SmallGameAddict]

That would be an excellent rifle, assuming you could find one in stock.

Ain't that the truth

 

[Podmonkey]

 

[SmallGameAddict]

I notice they offer their rifles with the faster 1:7" twist. This is to properly stabilize the 62 grain (in 5.56x45 NATO of course) bullets, correct?

 

[Podmonkey]

I notice they offer their rifles with the faster 1:7" twist. This is to properly stabilize the 62 grain (in 5.56x45 NATO of course) bullets, correct?

1:7 twist is just about standard in any fighting carbine these days. That twist ratio will generally stabilize pills up to 80gr. That said what a given barrel will or won't stabilize actually has more to to with the total bearing surface of the bullet is, but as a rule of thumb the 1:7 will handle 99.9% of 5.56/.223 loads. My personal experience is that 1:7 barrels do very well with 55gr bullets too.
On a related note Centurion Arms uses FN Cold Hammer Forged, chrome lined barrels which is great as FN makes an excellent barrel and that manufacturing method and bore lining gives great heat and wear resistance which is good for a serious use carbine. Many manufacturers forego cold hammer forging but several do offer It, Daniel Defense makes their own barrels of that type in house along with almost every other component.
I would avoid Stainless Steel barrels for a fighting carbine as they wear out faster, a few training classes where you shoot high volumes of ammo over a short period can nuke a SS barrel quickly.
DD rates the useful service life (full accuracy potential) at 50k rounds. I imagine FN barrels would last as long as well.

 

[SmallGameAddict]

1:7 twist is just about standard in any fighting carbine these days. That twist ratio will generally stabilize pills up to 80gr. That said what a given barrel will or won't stabilize actually has more to to with the total bearing surface of the bullet is, but as a rule of thumb the 1:7 will handle 99.9% of 5.56/.223 loads. My personal experience is that 1:7 barrels do very well with 55gr bullets too.
On a related note Centurion Arms uses FN Cold Hammer Forged, chrome lined barrels which is great as FN makes an excellent barrel and that manufacturing method and bore lining gives great heat and wear resistance which is good for a serious use carbine. Many manufacturers forego cold hammer forging but several do offer It, Daniel Defense makes their own barrels of that type in house along with almost every other component.
I would avoid Stainless Steel barrels for a fighting carbine as they wear out faster, a few training classes where you shoot high volumes of ammo over a short period can nuke a SS barrel quickly.
DD rates the useful service life (full accuracy potential) at 50k rounds. I imagine FN barrels would last as long as well.

Since one of my fave features of my 20 gauge Benelli Monte is the chrome lined chamber and bore, I can dig that.

 

[Podmonkey]

On a further side note, for a high volume of fire carbine I would stick with a 5.56 NATO chamber. The extra leade of tge NATO chamber is more forgiving of carbon build up.
I also haven't noticed any issues of reduced accuracy of .223 loads with the 5.56 NATO chamber. My favored HD load is the 64/62gr Gold Dot which is a .223 load and it shoots beautifully from both my ARs.

 

[SmallGameAddict]

On a further side note, for a high volume of fire carbine I would stuck with a 5.56 NATO chamber. The extra leade of tge NATO chamber is more forgiving of carbon build up.

Good to know. That's a useful lil tidbit.

 

[Robin]

I ask these questions because I don't know. I have put together several of these, uppers and lowers, with parts purchased from a lot of different vendors. Are the basic receiver, upper and lower, heavier, from what I understand there are two basic alloys used? Is the steel alloy in the internal parts different, in description I read before buying, they all seem to use pretty much the same, except for the ultra high end stuff? Many times I have thought, say a bolt carrier assembly, is the same from two different vendors, only with a 30-40% price difference. So far I have had no problems with anything I have put together and am seriously wondering what exactly makes for a more trustworthy piece? Twenty years ago when I decided to re-enter this type of riflery, I asked my son if the m4 had earned his faith and trust, "yeah Dad, they got all the bugs out of it", was his reply, and from my experience since then, I have to agree.
Robin

 

[4WHLDRFTN]

have you checked out the AR14's ?

 

[SmallGameAddict]

have you checked out the AR14's ?

Not yet. I need to save some of this research for winter.